Brass frame 1858 ?

[r29l20]

Is there anything good about the brass frame ? I just bought one, then found out about the frame. I mean the cost differance is minimal, so that can't be the omly reason to even make them, can it ?

[mcwoodduck]

The Brass Frame has a neat look.
They are called the Rebel models
The brass frame was made as the South did not have the resources to make as much steel as the north and you put the steel in the important parts, the Brass was easy to work with and took less time to manufacture.
It is a personal preferance as to what model you want.  I am the Yankee of the family and have a steel framed 58, and uncle had a brass framed one.
The brass framed guns are fine just do not load it to max and you should have a gun that will be functional and last a long time.

[Hellgate]

It's mostly the looks, lower price, and lack of knowledge by the buyers that the guns will eventually shoot loose with full loads that keeps them on the market. Eventually the back of the cylinder will pound into the recoil shield causing the cylinder gap to open up to an excessive level. I have two Colt models with brass frames that I shoot with modest charges of 20grs FFFg +.454 ball. So far, so good. If I were to shoot 30 gr charges I would have a couple of paperweights by now. THe Remington will hold up a little better than a Colt but eventually you will see the outline of the back of the cylinder imprinting on the recoil shield. If you keep to about 20gr loads (25 tops) in the 44 it will be a long time before that happens. Measure your gap now while the gun is new. You can guage the wear by the increasing gap size.

[r29l20]

Realisticly how long will it last ? Round balls & 25 gr Pyrodex for example.

[Hellgate]

I'm sounding like Bill clinton: it all depends on how you define "last". How much cylinder gap is too much? I saw a brass Remington for sale at a shooting match with a tag on it saying "make offer". It had about a .03" gap (I like .007) with an obvious impression of the cylinder battered into the recoil shield. I do not know how much shooting the gun had been through or loads used. Once I saw how much gap there was and the mark on the recoil shield I put it down. The cylinder had a lot of back & forth play. Your gun would likely last for years if shot with 20grs, a few years less with 25 grs and maybe only 300-500 rounds at 30 grs. Just my guess. I've read posts from guys that shoot 30 gr loads in their colt brassers and claim no harm done so guns vary. I've seen others that ruined theirs in short order.

[mcwoodduck]

With proper care the brass framed 58 will last a good long time.
Unlike the colts the Rem 58 has a full frame.
The colt has a pin the barrel rests on and the slamming of the bullet into the barrel twists the frame a little.
The Remington is like a modern S&W and has a top strap that holds the barrel in place and with the same loads will last longer than a colt army 60 or 51 Navy in brass frame.
With propper care and maintenance the 58 brass reproduction should last you a long, long time.
Like any revolver you can shoot them loose.  My steel 58 with a steady diet of 25 grains and a round ball will eventually shoot loose.  Add to that the 180 grain conical bullets I use and that round count will be 75% of the lighter round ball at about 125 grains.

[r29l20]

Just wondering why you could'nt make a steel shim for the recoil shield, when the gun gets to loose. Of coarse finding a way to fasten it on might be a problem. Or maybe a longer cylinder ? Maybe price to do it, or timing issues, I really don't know for sure.

[mcwoodduck]

The Brass frame guns are based on war time production.  It was not about lasting it was about arming a rebellion.
The Brass 58 is a strong gun.  I think you should worry less about it lasting and try to prove me wrong.
I can understand your concerns if you owned a brass Colt 51, or 60.  But the pressure is even on the frame with the 58 Rem.
If you get less than 5,000 rounds of the light loads through the gun and it shoots loose.  I'll give you my steel one.
Of course you need to take care of it and clean it.  Save the powder cans and the boxes the 454 round balls come in, as proof you shot them.

[r29l20]

The Brass frame guns are based on war time production.  It was not about lasting it was about arming a rebellion.
The Brass 58 is a strong gun.  I think you should worry less about it lasting and try to prove me wrong.
I can understand your concerns if you owned a brass Colt 51, or 60.  But the pressure is even on the frame with the 58 Rem.
If you get less than 5,000 rounds of the light loads through the gun and it shoots loose.  I'll give you my steel one.
Of course you need to take care of it and clean it.  Save the powder cans and the boxes the 454 round balls come in, as proof you shot them.

I'll get started on that right away.   Thanks for some good feedback Pard.

[Gatofeo]

Brass-framed revolvers are cheaper because factories typically invest less effort into their fitting, polishing and finish. They are almost always inferior, in these regards, to their steel-framed counterparts.
Compare a brass-framed revolver to an identical steel-framed one. The price is lower because of the lesser quality. The strength of Colt vs. Remington revolvers, as applied to the steel-framed versions of good quality, is a moot point -- as long as we're talking black powder or Hodgdon Pyrodex P. Either will last decades with proper care. Black powder and Pyrodex P generate pressures amply handled by either design.
A problem emerged when Hodgdon 777 was introduced. It was designed to approximate black powder pressure levels with 15 percent less propellant. Unfortunately, too many shooters wrongly assumed that 777 was to be used equal-volume with black powder, like Pyrodex P. Not true.
Hodgdon does not recommend the use of 777 in brass-framed revolvers. Even in the 15 percent reduced charges. There's a reason: 777 is stout stuff, especially when mistakenly used in equal measure with black powder.
I've owned two brass-framed revolvers in more than 40 years of shooting cap and ball revolvers. Both were of poor quality and gave me problems. One wore out. With reduced loads, they're okay for beginners but should never be used with anything approaching a full load. Doing so will accelerate wear and cause damage.
I've long urged people to buy steel-framed cap and ball revolves, mostly because of the likelihood of better quality in a steel-framed gun. The steel-framed guns are stronger too, but this point is moot unless one plans to use Hodgdon 777. Both designs were amply strong long ago, for the black powder for which they were designed.

[gcrank1]

Do you really need to shoot full 'man killer' loads all the time?.....not likely, so use the 'target loads for most (not unlike shooting .38 Spl Wadcutter loads in your .38 or 357 and +P or Magnum loads for social work).
I have a brass frame .44 Rem.'58 and its held up well to the target loads. Problem with the cylinder end shake thing is that it gets worse faster as it gets worse, so it accelerates the process. If you 'slow' the beginning of the process you do well.
Shoot it and enjoy it and just use common sense (available here for free).