Cast 9mm dies

[bugdust]

I am purchasing a Glock 19 pistol. I intend to use the Lee 105 cast bullets which I use in my 38 Special. I size them to .358.
I have a .357 RCBS taper crimp die that I  have never used. I was thinking of buying a Lee 9mm die set. Will this die set be OK.  Should I use the Lee factory crimp die or the RCBS crimp die. I was thinking the Lee die will crush the cast bullets. I have dies for 38 special. What dies do I really need. I need a little help before I place any orders. Thanks

[Savage]

Buy the die set and size your bullets to .356 for the 9mm. Keep the loads moderate and watch for leading. As I'm sure you know, Glock tells you to avoid lead bullets in their barrels. I'm not going to recommend it, but I shoot mostly lead in my Glocks. 9mm/.40/.45. I have aftermarket barrels in the 9mm but use the factory ones in .40/.45. I use the LFCD on all my pistol ammo and have not found any accuracy problems due to deformed bullets. Actually mine shoot better groups using the die than without.  Just my experiences, yours may differ.
Good Luck,
Savage

[Land_Owner]

Slug your barrel.  Carefully drive a .358" lead slug (not water quenched, not harder alloy, but 100% lead that has air cooled) through the barrel with a wooden or at worst a brass rod and caliper the result.  It is typical to oversize a cast bullet to 0.001" to 0.002" diameter LARGER than barrel diameter so that the heat and pressure upon firing expands the cast bullet end and seals it to the lands and grooves of the barrel.

Excerpts from http://reloaders.gunloads.com/archive/index.php/t-1132.html for your consideration:

versifier  06-03-2009, 05:50 PM
Most loaders never trim pistol cases. I know I don't. In theory, they headspace on the case mouth, but in practice, the extractor holds the case in place for the firing pin strike.

Echo  06-17-2009, 01:52 AM
Ed Harris called it end-play, that movement that exists due to the fact that the .45ACP case (for example) is several thousandths shorter than the chamber. Excessive end-play causes ignition variance, according to Mr. Harris. He suggests seating the boolit out .015-.020 so as to contact the leade and remove the end-play.

armyrat197007-01-2009, 12:44 PM
I have never had a problem loading 45ACP, 40S&W, or 9mm which all headspace on the front of the cartridge case and I never trim those calibers. Most action pistol shooters, who may shoot many thousands of rounds in a year, don't trim either.

I must take exception to the practice of headspacing on the bullet though! If there is no space between the bullet and rifling then pressures can soar and you could find yourself with a ruined pistol... or worse! Taper crimping to just the size of the factory specification case mouth diameter for the particular round is the recommended way to go. If the case has been properly full length resized anyway, this will insure enough bullet grip to prevent "setback" of the bullet while feeding and will not create an overpressure situation in the gun. You can load longer than the recommended cartridge OAL with no problems as long as the bullet is not actually forced into the rifling when feeding which is easy to check by loading a few rounds and dropping the slide on them then cycling them by hand and inspecting the unfired round to see if there are rifling marks on the bullet. If there are rifling marks seat them a little deeper until they no longer show any contact with the rifling. Let's not blow things up!

  emphasis added.

Purchase the 9mm die set (I use RCBS in 380 ACP, 38/357 Mag., 45 ACP, and 45 Colt) and follow their instructions for taper crimping.  I shoot almost all cast pistol and revolver bullets now.

[Savage]

No need to slug a Glock barrel, or likely any standard caliber smokeless powder pistol barrel made in the last century. Standard dimensions for cast 9mm bullets is .356. And yes, taper crimp.
Savage

[bugdust]

The problem is that I have read on other forums that the cast bullet should be .001-.002 oversize or I am going to get leading in a std. Glock barrel. I cast all my bullets .358 for my 38 special. Great- I do not have  to keep two different sizes for the same bullet. If I use the Lee FCD will it crush the bullet down to .356 and cause leading. I use this crimp die on my 45ACP and it does a nice job. The cast bullets are .452 but the barrel is a standard barrel not a Glock. I can buy a three die set or spend extra for a four size set which I may never need because I already have a RCBS crimp die. I would prefer the Lee FCD because it straightens out the round but it could cause me leading.I can resolve this problem by spending over 100 dollars for a LS barrel. Does anyone use the Lee FCD for an oversize cast bullet in a Std. Glock barrel. I can find out for myself if I spend the time and money. But why reinvent the wheel.

[LaOtto222]

Be wary of using a Lee FCD with lead/cast bullets. It will crush them down. It is important to maintain bullet diameter .001 - .0015 over size to the bore. Use a taper die, they work best when head spacing off of the mouth of the case. The other advice I have is to have a carbide sizing die included in your die set. They do not cost a whole lot more and they are very nice because you do not have to use any lube when you full length size. I size all my straight walled cases with carbide now.


Keeping the bullet oversize is important for two reasons. 1. If under size the lead will slip on the rifling and not grip it like it should, possibly making it unstable. 2. under size will let hot gas flow by the bullet cutting/melting lead into the bore. So it is important to seal the gas off with an over size bullet.


You may want to visit the cast bullet forum and ask your questions there. They have much more experience with shooting cast bullets than I do.

http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/board,45.0.html

Good Luck and Good Shooting

[mdi]

Regardless of what modern barrels are "supposed" to be, slug the barrel so you know exactly what you're working with. 9mm being a high pressure round, shooting lead can be problematic and bullet/barrel fit is important. I've just got through some leading problems with a newly purchased 9mm. I slugged the barrel and it came out .357". I shot some too hard (BHN 18) .356" bullets and the leading was some of the most difficult to remove I've dealt with in quite a while. Next attempt will be with my cast, WW alloy, between .357"-.358" bullets with Carnuba Red lube...

Just my experience shooting lead and using a FCD; toss the post seating sizing die and just go with taper crimp.

[luckydawg13]

just about all i shoot out of my 92fs 9mm is cast boolits now
i size to .357 and use C/R lube made by white label lubes

[Savage]

My experience with cast in 9mm (.355) has been good with commercial cast bullets sized to .356 and crimped with the LFCD. That's in two Glocks and a CZ. Accuracy of the three has been at least as good as with jacketed. I have shot IDPA and USPSA using the Missouri Bullets 147gr TCFP exclusively with very minimal leading in 100-200 or so rds per match or practice. I'm making a 132pf at about 900fps and holds the "A" easily at 30yds. I load the .40 with the 170gr SWC from MB to major with similar results. Good enough for me.
Savge

[bugdust]

Savage:
 
Is this with a standard Glock barrel or  repacement barrel. If it is with a Glock barrel I will have to buy a .356 sizing die for my castings and a LFCD. I am going to try  the .358 casting and my RCBS crimp die first. If this does not work then I will go ahead and buy the two dies.Still better than buying a repacement barrel. Yes, no, maybe?

[Savage]

I use both factory and aftermarket barrels.  I have Lone Wolf barrels in 9mm for my 35 and 17. I am shooting the 35 almost exclusively this year in both 9mm and .40. I use the LW barrel for 9mm and the Glock factory barrels in .40. Groove dia is .355 standard in 9x19, so the .356 dia cast bullet work fine in my guns. Sizing to .358 will give you .003 over, which may not be a problem given the short bullet having minimal bearing surface on the rifling. You may have to expand the case mouth on the 9mm cases a bit more than you'd like to insure the case doesn't shave lead at the seating operation.  Don't have an inside micrometer, but using my calipers I checked the factory mdl 17 Glock barrel. It indicated .355 as best I could measure. My LW 9mm conversion barrel is also .355 in the grooves using the same procedure. If it were me, I'd size to .356 for the 9mm. If you use the Glock barrel, check it frequently for leading.  Good luck, and let us know how it works out.
Savage