I no longer dream of a super .35

[Lon371]

 Saturday was firearms opener, see nothing! Sunday morning 2 deer ran on the field in the dark. Could see them against the frost on the ground. No sun no shooting. Around 10am feet are cold getting ready to climb out of the stand. Turn around and there is a nice doe at 40 yards. H&R .357 maxi barked. She turned to leave and collapsed 6 feet from the shot. Yeah no biggie. Took her home and warmed up.


 Back out at 3pm. Wasn't going to go, but a friend wanted to hunt. We have had issues with trespassers, So I went with him. Plan was to put him in my stand. I would take the second field where the trespassers had fired 17 shots opening morning. Figured I would go in and set next to one of them . To my suprise they were not around. Picked out a tree and set down.  Right before sun down 2 does stolled out in the field. Picked out the bigger of the 2. Looked to be a little far, so I held the scope on her spine and squeezed. Hornady 180 ssp went clean thru the shoulders. She went less than 10 yards and expired .  The second one hung out for a few minutes, then wandered away. Called my buddy to bring the truck. He also brought the laser rangefinder. Ranged the shot. Wait for it...196 YARDSSSS !!!!!!!

Now normally I would not have taken this shot. But after not seeing squat the first day, got me to thinking our heard is down. After opening her up, well the heart was perfect   But then my friend says where is the lungs? uhm they are gone!! I mean completely liquidfied.  Had a complete pass thru the shoulder bones. I am amazed and dumb founded by the power of this round. I knew it was good and my favorite, but this shot just put icing on the cake. Think I will be sticking with her for a while


Lonny


  My friend did say the ranger finder had a +-4 yards. I told him that is cool I would take 200 

[Dinny]

Some people have all the luck! If it weren't for bad luck, I wouldn't have any at all. Good shooting there Lonny! Better send those SSPs to me, afterall the gelatin testing showed they weren't no good.

Thanks, Dinny

[bulletstuffer]

Dang!  You Hoosiers sure do get up early    Congratulations on the deer.  I came down to Indiana for the weekend and only shot 3 pars    Can't believe I was golfing instead of sitting in the woods.  Oh well, it was still outside.


Good luck to all this season!


Bulletstuffer

[Lon371]

 Thanks guys.
Sorry Dinny they have been designated to deer duty 
Bulletstuffer, they wont let me carry a gun on the golf course 


Lonny

[cwlongshot]

Congrats Lon!!!

CW

[Hank in Indiana]

Good job. Nice report. Thats the bullet I'm using in a 1.8" 358 win. Do you know what your velocity is approx.

[cwlongshot]

Good job. Nice report. Thats the bullet I'm using in a 1.8" 358 win. Do you know what your velocity is approx.

It's a good bullet Hank IF KEPT WITHIN DESIGN PERAMETERS!!!

Your 358 has the horse power to out pace it quickly!  If your over 23-2400 fps I would switch to either of Hornadys two offerings. 200 FTX or 200 Spitzer.  Both EXCELLENT TO 3000fps.  Your 358 aughta reach nearly 2700fps.  I shoot them from my Whelen at 2900+ with excellent preforms ce!!

CW

[Lon371]

 Thanks guys.


 Hank,  I don't have a chrony. I went off of Steves data on 357maximum.com started low and worked up.


28.0gr/A1680 CCI 450 Rem 2.350 10" Test 1704 fps


Mine is on the H&R rifle with 22" barrel. Rechambered with the reamer from Tim.


Lonny

[cwlongshot]

I will guesstimate that load is solid 2100fps but could be as hi as 2300 fps.

My 21'' gets 2200+fps with 26 grns... 

CW

[dave29]

Better send those SSPs to me, afterall the gelatin testing showed they weren't no good.

Thanks, Dinny

HAHAHAHA!!! I know exactly what you are talking about. I paid no attention to those tests.

Lonny, nice work! I took my Maxi with me this weekend, but no nice bucks showed up. 

[Lon371]

Dave


 If I only waited on nice bucks I would never get to shoot . I am a meat eater. I am also trying to keep our roads clear of blook stained carcasses, yeah thats it.


Lonny

[dave29]

Dave


 If I only waited on nice bucks I would never get to shoot . I am a meat eater. I am also trying to keep our roads clear of blook stained carcasses, yeah thats it.


Lonny

I hear ya man. I take some does every year, I just wait until late season. I've always done it like like, not sure why. 

[steve@357maximum.com]

Lonny,

Congrats and good shooting!  There is nothing like a freezer full of venison.  By the way, I checked my notes and the load you are using clocked 2150 fps out of a 22" Ruger No.1 for me.  It would be hard to argue with the results you had.  I continue to receive emails of hunters having excellent results with their .357 Max's.  Most of them, like yourself are using the 180 SSP bullet but some are using the XTP.  Results seem excellent with both.

As you know I am hunting with the .358 Win. short neck this year.  I am using the 200 gr. FTX at 2520 fps.  So far, one smaller 1 1/2 yr old doe at 110 yards.  The shot was broadside thru both lungs behind the shoulder and the deer ran about 50 yards and was done.  The exit hole was around 3/4".   Hopefully, I'll have a chance at a buck by the end of the week.

Thanks for sharing your hunting experience and best of luck to you on your future hunts.

Steve

[Lon371]

Thanks Steve


 I have a 308 still hanging around for a chance to do the .358 win short. Just didnt have the funds yet. But it is still on top of the want list.


Lonny

[Hank in Indiana]

The 35 cal 180 SSP seems to hold up good at 2510fps. Approx 30" of diagonal penetration, then broke a rib, and stayed under the hide. Good mushroom, .710" and weighed 134g.

[cwlongshot]

The 35 cal 180 SSP seems to hold up good at 2510fps. Approx 30" of diagonal penetration, then broke a rib, and stayed under the hide. Good mushroom, .710" and weighed 134g.

Just in fairness and to clarify... what was impact distance?

 I assume 2510 fps was a muzzle or near muzzle velocity?

CW

[quickdtoo]

The 180gr SSP was included in these 35 Rem impact tests, test media was wet phone books.

Tim

http://www.suitorsgarage.com/gunstuff/35remington/35rempart2b.html

The 180 grain Hornady Single Shot Pistol Bullet

Apparently this bullet is a good seller at Hornady, as they produce around a half million per year. There are a lot of lower velocity 35’s and pistol length barrels that require an easy opening bullet for reduced velocities. The SSP 180 meets that need. My questions were few; how would it hold up at close range and what were the expansion characteristics at longer ranges? To answer this question, I fired it at 2380 fps into the books, range twenty feet, and also at 2300 fps out of my Bullberry barreled Contender pistol in .35 Remington at the 100 and 200 yard books.
 
At close range, velocity 2380 feet, (call me Elmer Keith) the bullets expanded to wide diameter and penetrated around 8 inches, less than any other bullet save the 125 pistol bullets discussed later. Bullets held together, no doubt due to the Interlock feature, but the lead remaining in the jackets looked almost melted. They also blew the crap out of the phone books. Two shots, one in the top half and the other in the bottom, were all the first few books could take. These look adequate for most lung shots on deer but I’d hesitate to use them against tough resistance at close range at these velocities. At 100 and 200 yards it was apparent that the scoring in the nose of the bullet was not shallow, but deep, as the nose of the bullet peeled back into clearly defined segments. The bullet expanded to wide diameter at 200 yards and showed around 11 inches of penetration. This appears to be a deer bullet, and if any doubt about the expansion qualities of the .35 Remington at long range are present this bullet should answer all questions. There are more suitable cartridges than the .35 Remington for the longer ranges, but if this bullet is placed properly in the chest it looks to be able to cause sufficient damage way out there. A 2300+ fps launch velocity should be sufficient to at least 200 yards as regards trajectory, and these bullets can be used in tubular magazines if the soft nose is clipped and filed off flush with the jacket. The resulting meplat is considerably larger than the 150 Remington PSP factory load and similar to the 180 Speer. Little loss of ballistic performance should occur, as the bullet still has most of its tapering ogive. It is also possible to load the levergun as a two shot with pointed bullets, one in the chamber, the other in the tube.

[Hank in Indiana]

The 35 cal 180 SSP seems to hold up good at 2510fps. Approx 30" of diagonal penetration, then broke a rib, and stayed under the hide. Good mushroom, .710" and weighed 134g.

Just in fairness and to clarify... what was impact distance?

 I assume 2510 fps was a muzzle or near muzzle velocity?

CW

70 yds. It computes to around 2325fps at impact.

[jackpine]

Lonny,
Congrats on your freezer filling adventure.  I found my way over here and to this thread from the link at the bottom of your post over at the Contender forum where you responded to my question on 357 Max. 
A little background on me:
I originally started looking for info on pistol caliber rifles because my son has moved to Indiana.  He has been a better hunter than me since he was probably 14, but I am the resident "gun nut" of the family.  He found out in late summer that his eight year old son can hunt there.  My son has hunted with a Super Redhawk. but his son  is a little small for the recoil of practicing with slugs and not yet a pistol shooter. I found out about this just before we came to visit them in Sept. I happened to have a Rossi single shot rifle in 44 mag. I put a low power scope and a youth stock on it and set up a second rifle the same way in 22 rimfire. My grandson has been shooting a pellet rifle and a youth sized 22 bolt action since he was five, but thought it would be good to practice with a rimfire that was identical to the 44. We went out shooting when I was down there and the grandson was told that if he could hit a five in circle 4 out of 5 times at 25 yards, the distance his dad thought would be his max range, he could go deer hunting.  The target moved to 50 hards after the third dead center shot and he put all 5 in the circle.  I had him shooting powder puff loads in the 44, not wanting to take any chances on starting a flinch, saving the full house loads for hunting and figuring he won't even notice the difference if he is pulling the trigger on a deer. 
 
They got out the first weekend and several deer, but none that presented a good shot.  They went to the other grandparents (non-hunting) this weekend, so no hunting, but hope to get out next weekend.  Anyway, my whole reason for chasing the 357 Maximum Contender idea, was to have a better and longer range round for next year for my son.  I did not think that the Rossi was capable of the kind of accuracy.  Maybe I am wrong, or maybe a Rossi won't do what an H&R will.  Any thoughts on this?
 
When I looked at the Indiana regs and changes of legal cartridge for 2012, I understood that the rifle had to actually be in a commerical pistol round, but am starting to think I misread.  Is it true that you can have any cartidge, commercial or wildcat, as long as the case length is no longer than 1.8 inches and bullet is at least .357, with no max cartidge length.  Could you take a 50 BAR case, cut it down to 1.8 inches, neck it to 357 and load a 500 grain bullet, with any overall cartidge length of three inches?  Maybe a bit extreme, but want to make sure I understand the rules.
 
Hope I am not out of place or hijacking you thread.  Let me know if I am and should go somewhere else.
 
Jackpine

[cwlongshot]

The 35 cal 180 SSP seems to hold up good at 2510fps. Approx 30" of diagonal penetration, then broke a rib, and stayed under the hide. Good mushroom, .710" and weighed 134g.

Just in fairness and to clarify... what was impact distance?

 I assume 2510 fps was a muzzle or near muzzle velocity?

CW

70 yds. It computes to around 2325fps at impact.

Thats very good preformance from that bullet. When using this bullet at upper levels of its designed velocity, your placement was optimal. This same velocity with a hit on the spine or even leg bone would have produced different results.

I have shot many deer with this bullet at nearly exactly this velocity at impact in bones and altho I have yet to loose a deer, the bullet all but totally disentigrated.

Congrats on the deer and you are right to proclaim success with that preformance and about what I would expect with that shot at that impact velocity.

CW

[Lon371]

Jackpine


 First, sorry about the other post.


 Secondly, so far from every enterpitation of the 1.8" case length rule has been. It is only the case length that is being regulated. According to all the shops it is only case length and NOT the weapons chamber.
 Steve and Hank on this thread are discussing(thanks for the info guys) They are using a .358 win trimmed to legal length.  There are a bunch of .35 rems and various other cartriges that people are cutting down and using the preexisting chamber without modification. There was one board member(sorry dont remember who) that called DNR office. They told him he could not use a gun in .35 rem. But the thought is they did not understand the round was shortened. The brass length is what Dnr put the rule on not the gun.


No high jacks here, It is relavent to my title 


Lonny

[jackpine]

 Lonny, First of all, I wrote a post similar to what I am writing here, hit spell check and lost it somewhere in cyber space.  If they both show up I apologise. When I realized what had happened on the other thread I thought about responding, but there was no way to do that without "burning" you and I could see that you had a lot invested in this site and thought I may be a short-timer, so I just let it go.  Then I went back to see if anyone had responded with the info I was really looking for and see you had "turned yourself in."  You are a stand up guy. After I posted the question here, I found the thread about the 358.  Learned a lot.  Hank responded about the issue of rifle markings referring me to the regs which I had already seen and agree with him that they are quite clear.  My concern is the situation that you mentioned a DNR officer, except in the woods.  Also, I don't know if the reg is a quote or an interpretation of the statute.  If it is not a quote, the reg could change next year.  I would like to know if anyone there are any issues in the field or what the official stand of DNR is. This forum is a wealth of information and seems to be filled with a bunch of good folk. As I think I mentioned in an earlier post, I am not a resident of Indiana, but my son is.  He works 60 plus hours a week and has three young kids, so I am trying to do the leg work on this for him.   My grandson is eight and this year is hunting under an Apprentice license.  Do I understand the regs correctly, that if a youth takes the Firearms Safety course, they can buy a license and hunt without supervision, regardless of age.  If that is so, my next question is, do you have to have a license to be "afield" with a hunter.  I would love come and spend week taking my grandson hunting, but would prefer not to have to buy an out of state licence. Thanks again for all the great info, Jackpine