44-40 or 45lc??

[ranger730]

can anyone tell how much difference there is between 44-40 and 45lc such as veloticy,range,etc .And what about the 32-20          

[jd45]

As far as I know, both carts started out with bullets under 40grs of blk powder; the first with a .427(approx) dia. 200gr bullet; the second with a .456 dia. 250gr bullet. The .45's muzzle velocity out of a 7-1/2" bbl was 910fps, and remained the most powerful handgun cart until 1935, when S&W brought out the .357 magnum. I don't know the mz of the .44-40, but my money would be on the .45, with a 25% heavier bullet, plus handloading would give a person a much wider lattitude, from mild target loads to stout hunting loads... Paco Kelly has used 18.5grs of 2400 under a 260gr bullet, out of SAA Colts & their clones for years (Elmer Keith's load) for 1165fps from a 7-1/2" bbl. Stout, to say the least! Of course, you can hotrod the .44-40, too, but, I think it's limited in what you can do with it. I'm sorry, I 've had no experience with the .32-20. Maybe someone else can weigh in on the subject. jd45.

[California Lawdawg]

Can't tell you anything about the difference but, I do know the 45 is easier to reload :-D


Lawdawg :cb2:

[jd45]

Yeah, I forgot to say that, too. A straight-wall case is easier to work with than one with even a slight "bottleneck" shape, as the .44-40 has. You won't need to lube it before resizing as you will with the other, to insure that it won't get stuck in the resizing die. Again, my 2 cents is the .45 Colt has the .44-40 beat hands down. jd45.

[DennisE]

Naturally your best all around choice remains the .44 Magnum.  Sorry the devil made me do it!  Dennis

[jd45]

But Dennis!...you just went outside the scope of the subject. By the way, I understand you can load the .45 Colt to equal or better the .44 Mag. at lower pressures, as long as the gun can stand the gaff. Sorry, the Devil's guilty this time, too! jd45.

[ranger730]

Thanks for the info jd45 and dennise,your right about 44 mag got two {super blackhawk 5.5 and the 7.5 Hunter both of'em a  handfull} but was wanting to get a lever rifle and vaquero in matching caliber going with 45lc again thanks

[jd45]

Ranger, check out the Sixgunner.com website for Paco Kelly's articles on the .45 Colt in lever-action rifles. Lots of food for thought & load info in those articles. By the way, he says the 1892 Winchester type action is the strongest ( as opposed to, say, the 1894 Winchester, or the Marlin type action). Not suggesting you load to the max, but since you mentioned Ruger, which is known to be among the strongest, I thought I'd make that point. You'll be amazed at what you can do with the .45 Colt in a rifle.jd45.

[threefingers46]

i like my ruger blackhawk 45lc.i reload keith load 18.5 grs of 2400.that is a good load for me with 260 or 250 gr bullet she will drop just anything.they say one could load to 1300 fps,but why if wanted hot load i would buy a 44 ruger blackhawk or the redhawk in the 45lc or in 44mag.that load is only in RUGER and the TC ONLY.

[Gatofeo]

Okay, getting back to the original question of .44-40 vs. .45 Long Colt.
I started reloading for the .45 LC back in 1973, on a Lee Loader for my then-new Ruger Blackhawk with 7-1/2" barrel.
I used the Lyman 454424 lead bullet, cast 1 part tin to 10 parts lead, lubricated with an alox lubricant. This was usually over 8.5 grains of Unique, though I dallied with 2400 from time to time to create very heavy handloads.
JD45, I must take issue or at least clarify your statement, "A straight-wall case is easier to work with than one with even a slight "bottleneck" shape, as the .44-40 has. You won't need to lube it before resizing as you will with the other, to insure that it won't get stuck in the resizing die."
You probably meant to say that when using carbide dies with straight walled cases, you don't need to lubricate the case. At least, I hope you meant to say that.
God help the reloader who forgets to lubricate a .45 LC case and runs it into a standard die. I've done it, absentmindedly, and it's a bugger getting that fat case extracted after the shellholder's torn off the rim.
Incidentally, the .45 LC cases of yore had very small rims. With the older cases, usually of balloon head construction, you run the risk of tearing a rim off without ample lubrication.
Some older cases have such a smidgen of a rim that to prevent damage it might be wise to size these cases in a Lee Loader, where the case is tapped into the die and then tapped out from the other end with a steel rod.
I still use the ink stamp pad method for some cases. The stamp pad is dampened with case lubricant and cases rolled across the surface. Of course, you must buy an uninked stamp pad for this purpose.
But I digress ...
For a newcomer, I would suggest the .45 Long Colt as the better of the two. You will have a wider selection of bullets from which to choose, all the way from the tiny 185 gr. jacketed or lead semiwadcutter used for target work in the .45 Auto (but works great for targets and plinking in the .45 LC too) to the massive 300 grains-plus lead bullets.
If I could pick but one bullet, it would be my Lyman 454424 mould. This casts a plain-based, semi-wadcutter, of Keith design, weighing about 255 grains when 1:10 alloy is used.
This bullet is accurate, easy to cast and load into a case (no troublesome gas check), and delivers the goods on target, beast and man (haven't shot the latter two with it but others have and report excellent results).
My Lyman 454424 mould is no more. Some years ago, Lyman slightly reduced the diameter of the mould and redubbed it the 452424. No matter, most .45 Long Colts of today have bores of .451 to .452 inch.
I size my old 454424 bullets to 452 inch. With 1:10 alloy they drop from the mould at about .455 diameter.
I also reload the .44-40, but in a reproduction 1873 Winchester rifle. It too is a great round but not nearly as versatile. No matter, I only shoot 200 gr. lead bullets in it, sized to .429 inch (the .44-40 rifles of today tend to have larger bores than the originals, hence the slightly larger bullet for best accuracy).
I like both rounds, but the .45 is easier to reload and has a greater variety of bullet weights and styles, should you wish to take up hunting or target shooting with it down the road.

As for the .32-20, this is a grand old round but my understanding is that it can be equalled with the .32 Magnum. The .32-20 is also a necked round and requires lubrication of the case before sizing.
I have no experience with either, but from what I've read the .32 Magnum will do anything the .32-20 will do. I don't know how the cost of ammunition compares.

A strong word of caution: In the past 10 years or so, I've witnessed a proliferation of reloaders posting loads that are well beyond the maximum charges suggested by the reloading books.
These reloaders --- without benefit of a modern ballistics laboratory --- claim their loads are perfectly safe.
The trouble is, each gun is an individual. What one gun may take may strain and even blow another gun.
Always check someone's load against a modern, creditable reloading book. I suggest you buy the Lyman No. 48 reloading book as a good all-around reference. Other excellent books are made by Speer, Hornady, Sierra, etc.
When the Ruger Blackhawk in .45 LC was brought out in the early 1970s, ignorant reloaders immediately started trying to make it rival the .44 Magnum.
Why they didn't buy a .44 Magnum in the first place puzzles me.
Remember, as you increase pressure with your loads (whatever make your gun is) you accelerate recoil, muzzle blast and --- most importantly --- wear and strain on the gun.
For most purposes, there is little need to push a 250 - 260 grain bullet in the .45 Long Colt beyond 1,000 feet per second.
If you want to experience the blast and recoil of a Magnum, then buy a .44 Magnum or .454 Casull.
I wish people would stop trying to magnumize the .45 Long Colt. It is sufficiently powerful with reasonable loads to get the job done.

[Blackhawk44]

If you stay with factory velocity loads, either is OK.  45's easier to reload.  If you plan to load "UP" for hunting, the 45 is the only one of the two.  The decision depends a great deal upon which type of rifle you choose.  Replica rifles (Henrys, 66s, and 73s) are for factory type loads AT MOST.  To load to higher levels with either cartridge will quickly destroy the actions.  In the Winchester 92s(best), 94s and Marlin 94s you have the option of loads suitable for larger deer, black bear, hogs and such.  At this point the 45 leaves the 44-40 behind.  The 44 does not take to heavier bullets and higher pressures due to its design and relatively thin(fragile to this day) case.   With its straight, moderm production case the 45 can be loaded virtually up to the design limits of the action.  Heavy loads are even available over the counter (CorBon, Buffalo Bore).  If you go this way, the Winchester 92 design is definitely stonger than the Marlin 94, and the Marlin seems to stand up better than the Winchester 94.  Now, the 32-20.  What was said about the 44-40 rifle types applies equally here.  However, in the stronger actions, it does lend itself to higher loadings fairly well-as long as you use strong, modern brass (Starline preffered).  Do not mix brass as Win and Starline are a different length than Remington.  Depending on year of manufacture, head and rim size can vary, requiring different shell holders.  Thin cases are still a royal pain and crushed cases from bullet seating are not uncommon, despite care with belling and aligning the bullet in the seater.  If bent on a 32 rifle at this particular time, I'd save a couple of extra nickels and in a couple of months pick up one of the 32 H&R 1894's that Marlin has announced.  I have loaded the H&R for almost 20 years and its far easier to reload, far  easier to get great accuracy and supplies equal power.  You can even get carbide dies and skip case lubing.  Understand this is from experience, not theory, as I have 2-45 Colts (SAA&1909), 2-44-40s(Win92&SAA), 2-32-20s(Marlin 94&Colt Army Sp) and 2-32H&Rs(Ruger&S&W631).  BOL on your choices. BH