Author Topic: a US shopping trip (Read 1896 times)

kevin.303 · « **on:** January 16, 2004, 07:54:26 AM »

now that i finally got a steady job that i know i won't get fired from i've started to plan a trip to cabela's in grand forks for around june-july. i called customs and and asked what the restrictions where regarding ammo and was told i could bring a max of 5,000 rounds across the border. nothing was said about any permits, i just have to declare it.
here 's the list of my planned purchases;

500 rounds 7.62X54 wolf ammo
fiberforce Dragunov stock for an SKS
2 10 round mags for a .303
a scope

now i know we've been over this before but i'm still confused about what i have to do to bring this stuff back with minimum hassle and whether i need a permit or not. my dad suggested calling customs when we leave and telling them when we would be coming thru and having the car clean and organized so if they search it it won't take to long. i',m sure most of you guy's have some experiance with this.

upnorth · « **Reply #1 on:** January 16, 2004, 10:19:38 AM »

ok kevin, I'll do my best. You know I cross at emerson every night so I'll try to help. yes you can import up to 5000 rds of ammo without a permit. You better make sure that you have a rifle in that caliber registered to you. otherwise it opens up more questions. I carried my reg. cert. with me just in case they asked. You will only have to pay gst and pst on what you bring across. no duty. the stock will be ok. the 10 rd mags...NO!!! the law says you can only have 5rd mags unless the 10's are blocked. the 10rd mags are considered prohibited, so try to find those in canada. be aware that under u.s. law, non-resident alien visitors are not allowed to posess ammo. usually not a problem in g. forks, but during the day, they sometimes set up a roadblock at us customs and inspect cars and trucks leaving the u.s. don't offer any more info to customs than asked. at us customs, make sure you have birth cert, drivers lic. or passport. when you return to canada, they will ask you if you have any firearms. say no. if they ask about parts and ammo, say yes. any other questions, just ask.

John Y Cannuck · « **Reply #2 on:** January 17, 2004, 01:47:22 AM »

upnorth

10 round SMLE mags are a specified exemption.

John Y Cannuck · « **Reply #3 on:** January 17, 2004, 01:55:16 AM »

Suggest you have all documentation in order, and ready. Don't act nervous, or be chatty. These are things the border guys watch for.
If you've never experienced a border search, they are not nice experiences.
I have had but one, at Detroit, going into the US. One of the guys I was with forgot his Birth cert.
Dumped our luggage took the car apart a bit, let their dog go through everything, and held us in a holding cell with an armed guard for an hour while they checked us out. I have no idea what they thought they were going to find, we were clean. Just going on a business trip.

upnorth · « **Reply #4 on:** January 17, 2004, 10:48:18 AM »

didn't realise they were an exemtion. HOWEVER, we are probably more up to date on the laws than customs officers are! might save some grief if you can locate locally. are you over 18 kevin?

Snowshoe · « **Reply #5 on:** January 17, 2004, 02:42:47 PM »

What is wrong with shopping in our own country? Support your local businesses, or they may not be there when you need them. They can use all the support we can give now. These new gun laws are not only hurting gun owners, they have had a big impact on the gun shops too.

upnorth · « **Reply #6 on:** January 18, 2004, 08:52:53 AM »

the reason why we shop across the border is a simple one. I cannot find alot of what I want in canada. I go to local store, they tell me 3-6 months to order. I can drive down to g.forks and get it the same day, and cheaper too. our "local" stores simply don't have a good selection.

Eagle Eye · « **Reply #7 on:** January 18, 2004, 02:52:39 PM »

Yeah and a a lot of dealers are charging far too much for American products as well. Of course he wants to go south. Have you compared what a Leupold scope costs in the USA vis-a-vis Canada? Some places (like Wholesale Sports, for example) are making a whole lot more than just the exchange rate!

I for one would feel a lot more loyal to our Canadian shops if they would stop ripping us off. :evil:

upnorth · « **Reply #8 on:** January 18, 2004, 03:03:26 PM »

perhaps I should restate my position. I will shop from local retailers whenever possible . Sometimes saving a buck or two ain't worth the drive. But for the most part, cdn retailers are way behind when it comes to getting new product. I wanted to buy some powerbelts last year to try out. went to my local store, didn't know what I was talking about. drove down to the u.s. for the day, and bought several weights to try. went back to my local dealer to show him what they were, he found them in the catalog, told me 3-6 months. I shook my head and walked out. I don't do all my shopping in the states, but I'm not waiting for retailers to catch up.

kevin.303 · « **Reply #9 on:** January 19, 2004, 07:46:41 AM »

just turned 20 a couple weeks back. one reason why i'm not buying this stuff locally is it's not available.i'd never heard of wolf ammo before i picked up a cabelas catalog. with the enfield magazines they will be exempt, and for the price at cabela's i can get 2 of NEW manufacture for the same price as 1 at SIR. the one's SIR carry's are pulled of parts guns and are often rusted and dented(believe me i used to work there). i don't have an SKS yet but i will soon. i was gonna get a box or 2 of the 7.62X39 154 gr SP but if i don't have a gun in that caliber when i go i might not if you say there'll be a hassle. cabelas makes a lot of stuff thats only available through them that i want like there real image fishing lures. if they opened up a store up here i think that they'd make a large profit, or if an existing place like SIR became a licensced retailer.

Snowshoe · « **Reply #10 on:** January 19, 2004, 01:22:17 PM »

Sorry I did not intend to step on any toes. I guess I am spoiled dealing with the 2 small shops close to me. I have made friends with the owners, and like to see them do well. I also have had poor serice and high prices from some of the larger shops. We all have to make our money go farther.

kevin.303 · « **Reply #11 on:** January 19, 2004, 01:56:24 PM »

i actually prefer some of the smaller shops like MacDonalds in Portage as compared to the large ones.where are the ones you go to? i didn't think there where any in the Souris-Deloirrane area. i've found SIR has a limited selection when it comes to special orders. i also check gun shows for hard to find items but they aren't as numerous as they are in the states.

Snowshoe · « **Reply #12 on:** January 20, 2004, 03:55:56 AM »

I have a couple in Brandon, RWP- Owner Greg Steel mostly used guns and such. And A&G- owner Al Aplin- a wholesale outlet, mostly reloading and he is now getting into other related stuff. I have a gunsmith in the Souris area- Alan Dodds, and Wolverine supplys in Virden, and its just 1/2 hour away. I can get most anything I want, or they will get it for me. These get most of my bucks, but I check out a few more from time to time.

John Y Cannuck · « **Reply #13 on:** January 20, 2004, 06:29:33 AM »

Wolf Amo is widely available in Ontario. Maybe you're just not looking in the right places.

http://www.wolfbullets.com/

Rick Teal · « **Reply #14 on:** January 20, 2004, 10:53:55 AM »

Kevin:

What actually happens when you reach the border may be completely different, however, I understand that wolf ammo is made in Russia, as well as most any "surplus" 7.62X54 you may be able to pick up in the US. NAFTA allows the duty free (but taxable) import of goods manufactured in the US or Mexico. Wolf and other non-NAFTA ammo and goods should be subject to the full duty payable as if the ammunition was imported directly from Russia.

Rick

kevin.303 · « **Reply #15 on:** January 20, 2004, 02:40:17 PM »

i'm pretty sure that wolf ammo out of kingston is a different company. wht would the duty on that be? it's 500 rounds for $99.99 us. i have no idea cuz i haven't crossed the border sine i was 7.

upnorth · « **Reply #16 on:** January 21, 2004, 10:30:14 AM »

they have never asked what country the ammo is made from. they seem more concerned about clothing . however it is a valid point. e-mail ccra with that specific question. another thing kevin... cabela's doesn't stock every item at it's stores. call them, give them the stock number out of the catalog and make sure they have it at the store level.

Rick Teal · « **Reply #17 on:** January 21, 2004, 04:27:22 PM »

Kevin:

You'd best follow upnorth's advice. I've been retired for over 2 years now, and don't have access to the tariff schedules any more. I believe they're available on the web site, but I don't remember the address.

There is a fellow in eastern Ontario who goes by the name of wolf (or wolfe) ammo, but I believe he makes cast bullets. The stuff they mention on the US web sites is imported from eastern Europe - and I believe its Russia.

Rick

Double D · « **Reply #18 on:** January 21, 2004, 05:44:34 PM »

Your ammo and magazines will need a U.S. Department of State license to be exported.

The rifle scope will need a U.S. Department of Commerce license to be taken out of the U.S.

I haven't worked in the field for over a year so I'm not sure about the Stock. Stocks fit into a gray area.

John Y Cannuck · « **Reply #19 on:** January 21, 2004, 11:56:56 PM »

:oops:
Thanks for setting me straight

Eagle Eye · « **Reply #20 on:** January 22, 2004, 05:30:26 AM »

ANd they say we have gun control.... :cry:

Double D · « **Reply #21 on:** January 22, 2004, 06:24:51 AM »

Yes, Eagle Eye sadly you do. The Exemption from licensing requirements that you folks use to have were with drawn from U.S. law at the request of the Canadian Government

Eagle Eye · « **Reply #22 on:** January 22, 2004, 07:27:50 AM »

Well D...you have it too. Besides all the crap mentioned above, FBI checks are still required for new purchases and BATF still gets a copy of that registration from the vendor. Sounds a lot like gun control to me.

kevin.303 · « **Reply #23 on:** January 22, 2004, 08:27:44 AM »

okay, who should i call to get these permits and how soon should i start?

Double D · « **Reply #24 on:** January 22, 2004, 11:44:09 AM »

Kevin,

You can't get those permits. The U.S. seller has to get them.

Eagle Eye, the FBI check is only to see if the prospective buyer is preempted by law from gun ownership. When the call is made to the FBI check center the only information given is the buyers name and date of birth and perhaps social security number. No gun info is included.

They say they catch a lot of people that way, you know real criminals who haven't paid ther parking tickets!

As to the transaction form, the 4473, that form is completed and retained by the dealer. After 20 years the Dealer may destroy the form.

Law enforcement can get access to the form through due press.

The only gray area about the forms is when a dealer goes out of business. He must then submit his forms to the federal depository.

Not quite registry, but close.

upnorth · « **Reply #25 on:** January 23, 2004, 11:12:56 AM »

OK.... I believe we did this song and dance about the u.s. export permits in a previous discussion.... I will not advise anyone to break the law of any country. personally, I go shopping in grand forks once a month, and have never gotten any permits of any kind. I have pulled trailer loads of ammo across the border and had commercial permits for those shipments. If you want to follow the absolute letter of the law, no canadian can ever purchase anything firearm related in the u.s. which is why mail order is such a pain in the a**! I have been through the u.s.c.s. checkstops at pembina on the way out of the u.s. checked our car, saw the cabelas's stuff I bought ( holster ammo, bullets, primers, powder), and prompty engaged me in a fifteen minute conversation about a good outfitter to hunt bear with!!!!! So, reality check...... I have no problem at all with purchasing stuff in the u.s. and bringing it across.

kevin.303 · « **Reply #26 on:** January 24, 2004, 08:09:01 AM »

well, rick put me on to a website here in canada that has cheap 7.62. it's 281.99 for 500 rounds and it's not as cheap as wolf but it is brass-cased and boxer primed. what really changed my mind is this outfit has .303 for the same price.i'll still buy the other stuff but the ammo i'll get here at home

upnorth · « **Reply #27 on:** January 24, 2004, 11:48:03 AM »

if you want the brass for reloading kevin, the stuff rick put you on may be the better choice. wolf ammo has the green cases... boxer primed but I don't think you can reload the brass. I may be wrong though!

kevin.303 · « **Reply #28 on:** January 26, 2004, 06:51:39 AM »

ya, the the wolf stuff when you look in the catalog the box in the picture says it's either a steel or bimetal case(copper i think) and is berdan primed