45-70 & 5744 powder

[beng]

I know we have someone out there who can answer this.   I have a Remington #1 rolling block which now has a heavy Green Mountain barrel 34" long with a 1-18 twist. I was using H-4198 of 29gr with a Brooks 535 bullet (our range is only 300yd) It has very good accuracy from 100 to 300 yd.  The barrel had very, very little leading.   With powder hard to get, I did come by some AA-5744, which I got 2  8lb canisters.  I tried it.  (Lyman cast bullet handbook and others on the forums saying this powder is the BEST with very good accuracy.)   The loads (by the book) is for a 535 lead bullet of 5744 is starting load of 23.0 to 28.0.   I tried all loads, the barrel and throat area was heavy leading.  After cleaning it out I tryed the 535 bullets H-4198, NO leading in the barrel or on the brass.  What am I doing wrong?  Should I use a filler or what.  (The books and powder people say NO filler is needed.   ANY HELP FOR ME?      beng

[zero]

I'm sure someone that'll actually know what they're talking about will come along shortly but in the meantime... how hard is the bullet? Plain base? You may not need filler but a cardboard wad could do alot. I've heard that alot of early leading is more caused by gas cutting from the initial ignition. And do you crimp? Seem to be alot of people get unburnt powder with 5744, even though it's a faster powder. Maybe it's not igniting because of too little ignition pressure in the case? If it were that, it might be that the low pressure isn't bumping up the bullet right and the gasses are escaping around it just at the beginning. Alot of them get around the unburnt powder with a good crimp

But i'm by no means an expert so that might be completely erroneous. Just a thought

[AkMike1]

If you go to the Mfgr's website they'll tell you to NEVER use filler with this powder!
 I've had good luck with this up to the 600 NE using WW lead.

[mauserand9mm]

Someone gave me a rule of thumb (which is probably wrong in many cases): throat leading means the lead is too soft or oversized (?) and barrel leading means that the projectile is going too fast.
In general, fillers are used to make ignition more reliable where the powder doesn't completely fill the case (less than 60% of the capacity). Fillers have nothing to do with leading..

[JimP.]

I use 5744 for all my 45/70 cast bullet loads and i use a fiber card on the bullet base and dont see any leading problems. Some bullets are hard cast, some are  not. JimP.

[gcrank1]

My experience does not include 5744 but does include leadiing. I have found that I get leading if the slug is undersize for the throat, regardless of alloy hardness. My ROT is to use the largest dia bullet that 'comfortably' fits the mouth of fully fire-formed brass and still chambers up and extracts cleanly. Be sure there is no residual crimp left on thew case mouth when finding that size. I do not resize cases as the typical dieset undersizes the neck for jacketed bullet size, which is usually too small a dia. for cast lead bullets in my guns. I fit to the throat rather than to the old 'groove dia. + .001' with success. I have never had throat leading with soft lead if the bullet fits the throat.
My shooting is basically BP duplicate velo with smokeless, my bullets are variously soft lead to WWt with a dash of tin.

[Larry L]

I had the same experience with 5744 in that it was incredibly filthy, lots of unburnt powder, and barrel leadng. A call to the Accurate Powder folks was no help as they had no clue either. I went back to IMR4198 and SR4759 and don't have the issue. Owning 16lbs though means you're gonna need to burn it in something. I also tried it with 300gr jacketed bullets and the filth never went away. Accuracy was extremely bad as I couldn't hit a 16"x 36" steel target at 50 yds in 5 shots. A load of IMR3031 put the same bullets touching at 50 yds. Might consider finding someone that's not having the issue or just wants 5744 and work a trade....or a gunshow.

[Ranch13]

Powder usually isn't the soule cause of leading.  Make sure that you're not shaving the bullet base when seating. Leading on the case indicates to much crimp. Also make sure the nose isn't getting deformed during the seating process, and or the lubrisizer.
25 grs of 5744 is a plenty with those big heavy bullets.

[shot1]

Your problem is most likely a too small diameter bullet and the wrong bullet lube. As far as AA 5744 and people thinking that it is not all burning because they see what looks like unburnt powder in the bore it is burning. It just burns dirty. In my Sharps 45-70 I use my own cast bullets and have found that 27 grs or AA 5744 with the Lyman #457193 drops at 418 grs from wheel weights and the diameter is .458 which is perfect for my rifle.  I use WW cases and Federal 215 mag primers. It is really accurate at 100 yards and almost as accurate as black powder at 200 to 500 yards. I get no leading.  This load is so accurate at 100 yards I once took $100 from some loud mouth at the shooting range that bet me that he could shoot a tighter 5 shot group at 100 yards with his scoped Browning BLR 308 than I could with my open sighted Sharps 45-70.I use my own bullet lube. 50% bees wax 40% olive oil and 10% STP oil treatment by volume all melted and mixed up together in a double boiler. I even made a mold out of PVC pipe and a piece of threaded rod to make hollow stick of lube to use in my lube sizer. 
If you really want to see some accuracy at longer ranges learn how to load black powder and cast bullets.