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Offline Dali Llama

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Pataki's gun fee proposals spark outcry
« on: February 23, 2004, 12:56:43 PM »
GUN OWNERSHIP
Pataki's gun fee proposals spark outcry

2/22/2004  
 
  By WILL ELLIOTT

Gov. George E. Pataki has fired another shot heard 'round the state.
Gun owners, pistol shooters and collectors in particular could get hit with a volley of permit fee increases and a change in permit status, if Assembly bill 9556 and Senate bill 6956, part of the governor's new budget, are passed.

Currently, pistol permits are issued for the life of the applicant, after a rigorous investigation of that applicant's status with various legal agencies.

Will Fowler, a pistol permit supervisor, said, "Right now, when a person applies for a pistol permit, we collect $99 for a criminal justice services and FBI criminal records check. After approval, applicants pay $5 for a permit and $3 for each gun added or removed." An applicant's permit remains valid until revoked or the holder dies, Fowler added.

Erie County Clerk David J. Swarts sees enacting these proposed fee changes as "an administrative nightmare."

"These fees would become a burden on county clerks' office staffs to fulfill all sections of law," Swarts said. "This county has the largest number of permit holders in the state, almost 70,000, and, as mandated in this proposal, all permits would need to be reissued by February of 2005." The clerk's office would have to triple its staff to comply with this new law.

The County Clerk's office now collects about $30,000 in fees each year at a cost of about $250,000. Collection of mandated fees would raise office costs to about $1 million and remove ceilings on county fees, Swarts said. He noted that subsequent permit fees would have to be raised well above the proposed $100 fee just to cover renewal expenses.


Swarts recalls a similar bill proposal in 1987, designed with an allowance for fee increases and renewable every five years.

"Back then, we realized that fees would have to be doubled to cover costs," he said.

For hunters, shooters and gun collectors, these fees are more than a slight imposition.

If passed, Gov. Pataki's permit fees would "cancel all lifetime New York handgun licenses," according to SCOPE, the Shooters Committee on Political Education.

"It amounts to nothing more than confiscation by taxation," John Susz of SCOPE said during the January Erie County Federation of Sportsmen's Clubs meeting. Susz pointed out that new pistol permit fee assessments would force many pistol owners to sell or turn in handguns that they could not afford to keep.

"It (pistol ownership) would become an exclusive privilege of the wealthy if these new fees become law," said Stephen Aldstad, Erie County SCOPE chairman, echoing Darren Szczudlik, a salesman at the Buffalo Gun Center.

Chauncey Parker, Gov. Pataki's criminal justice adviser, told lawmakers that the state "must keep better and more current track of handguns," comparing permit renewal with those for driving or fishing licenses.

However, state and federal agencies already have records of all gun owner purchases and of any criminal proceedings involving a gun owner. While drivers and anglers pay fees to subsidize roads and fishing opportunities, pistol owners - and long gun owners in the future if lawmakers get their way - pay to reregister their property.

A pistol permit is more akin to a property deed or a marriage license than to a driver's or fishing license. After thorough checks, government agencies do not charge additional processing fees for continued property ownership or for an ongoing marriage.


Harold "Budd" Schroeder, with the Erie County SCOPE chapter, said lawmakers and county clerks' offices across the state are generally opposed to the permit fee changes.

"But legislators have to know just how strong those feelings are against these fees, especially leading figures like Paul A. Tokasz, the Assembly majority leader."

Schroeder sees Tokasz as "on the fence and needs to be made aware of strong opposition to these fees."

Schroeder suggested looking up lawmakers' phone numbers in the phone book on the local and state pages - especially Tokasz.

SCOPE has a legislative search on its Web site. By entering your ZIP code, you'll get state senate and assembly representatives where you live. To find legislators' addresses and phone numbers, go to: www.scopeny.org
e-mail: wille@pce.net
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Offline NYH1

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Pataki's gun fee proposals spark outcry
« Reply #1 on: February 23, 2004, 03:15:13 PM »
That's "REPUBLICAN"T" Gov. George E. Pataki. :biggun:
"ROLL TIDE". . .Back To Back. . .Three In The Last Four Years "GO GIANTS"  "YANKEES"

Offline Dali Llama

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Pataki's gun fee proposals spark outcry
« Reply #2 on: February 23, 2004, 04:20:15 PM »
Quote from: New York Hunter
That's "REPUBLICAN"T" Gov. George E. Pataki. :biggun:
...and??? :?  :?  :?
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Offline NYH1

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Pataki's gun fee proposals spark outcry
« Reply #3 on: February 23, 2004, 04:34:41 PM »
Quote from: Dali Llama
...and??? :?  :?  :?[/quote]

And what? Their's your PRO GUN REPUBLICAN'TS  :evil:

Pataki's suppose to be one of "W's" good buddies. I wonder what "W's" gonna do next for money? After all Republican't stick together, just like Dumocrap's. :roll:
"ROLL TIDE". . .Back To Back. . .Three In The Last Four Years "GO GIANTS"  "YANKEES"

Offline Dali Llama

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Pataki's gun fee proposals spark outcry
« Reply #4 on: February 23, 2004, 04:40:27 PM »
Quote from: New York Hunter
Quote from: Dali Llama
...and??? :?  :?  :?


And what? Their's your PRO GUN REPUBLICAN'TS  :evil:

Pataki's suppose to be one of "W's" good buddies. I wonder what "W's" gonna do next for money? After all Republican't stick together, just like Dumocrap's. :roll:[/quote]Dali Llama say he curious what be with the "your" comment? :?  Dali wonder if New York Hunter have mouse in pocket? :?  :?  :?
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Offline NYH1

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Pataki's gun fee proposals spark outcry
« Reply #5 on: February 24, 2004, 06:57:28 AM »
Quote from: Dali Llama
Dali Llama say he curious what be with the "your" comment? :?  Dali wonder if New York Hunter have mouse in pocket? :?  :?  :?[/quote]

No mouse Dali. Everytime a dumocrap does something "anti gun" most of you are all over them like stink on crap. When a Republican't does it nobody says much at all.

If "your" (all of you) are gonna bash the "anti gun" people then bash them all. And while "your" (all of you) at it, bash the Republican'ts for being "anti American worker". How many more jobs are we gonna send to China, Singapour and Korea? What do you guys care. Most of you are probably "baby boomers" and are on the "BACK NINE" anyways. :D
"ROLL TIDE". . .Back To Back. . .Three In The Last Four Years "GO GIANTS"  "YANKEES"

Offline Dali Llama

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Pataki's gun fee proposals spark outcry
« Reply #6 on: February 24, 2004, 08:09:06 AM »
Quote from: New York Hunter
Quote from: Dali Llama
Dali Llama say he curious what be with the "your" comment? :?  Dali wonder if New York Hunter have mouse in pocket? :?  :?  :?


Quote
No mouse Dali. Everytime a dumocrap does something "anti gun" most of you are all over them like stink on crap. When a Republican't does it nobody says much at all.

If "your" (all of you) are gonna bash the "anti gun" people then bash them all. And while "your" (all of you) at it, bash the Republican'ts for being "anti American worker". How many more jobs are we gonna send to China, Singapour and Korea? What do you guys care. Most of you are probably "baby boomers" and are on the "BACK NINE" anyways. :D
Dali Llama say he suppose he should feel severely admonished or experience similar emotion? :?  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :?
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Offline Red Neck64

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Pataki's gun fee proposals spark outcry
« Reply #7 on: February 24, 2004, 10:51:09 AM »
Pataki,was just another hungry pig who wanted the power.But now that he has it,he knows not what to do with it.It's just the same old story,and it will go on.Untill,?

Offline Chuck White

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Pataki's gun fee proposals spark outcry
« Reply #8 on: February 25, 2004, 04:52:34 AM »
I think the whole thing on this pistol permit situation is BS!
I just wonder though, did he fall out of his tree stand!

It almost seems as though George is parking his shoes under Hillary's bed!
At least they seem to be on the same wave length!
 
There is a better money making deal for NY State though!  If they would sell off the "State Land" in 100 acre parcels, this state would make more money than "ALL" of the polititions could spend!
Chuck White
USAF Retired, Life Member, NRA & NAHC
Don't matter what gun you use,
just get good with it!

Offline Dali Llama

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Pataki's gun fee proposals spark outcry
« Reply #9 on: February 25, 2004, 08:05:33 AM »
Quote from: Chuck White
It almost seems as though George is parking his shoes under Hillary's bed!
:eek:  :shock:  :shock:  :shock:  :eek:
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Offline NYH1

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Pataki's gun fee proposals spark outcry
« Reply #10 on: February 25, 2004, 08:11:30 AM »
Quote from: Chuck White
I think the whole thing on this pistol permit situation is BS!
I just wonder though, did he fall out of his tree stand!

It almost seems as though George is parking his shoes under Hillary's bed!


Well said Chuck White.
"ROLL TIDE". . .Back To Back. . .Three In The Last Four Years "GO GIANTS"  "YANKEES"

Offline Dali Llama

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Pataki's gun fee proposals spark outcry
« Reply #11 on: February 25, 2004, 04:04:19 PM »
Quote from: Red Neck64
Pataki,was just another hungry pig who wanted the power.But now that he has it,he knows not what to do with it.It's just the same old story,and it will go on.Untill,?
...until sun rise in West, say Dali Llama... :(  :(  :cry:
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Offline NYH1

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Pataki's gun fee proposals spark outcry
« Reply #12 on: February 26, 2004, 07:12:27 AM »
Dali, I was on another GBO forum last night and a guy said Pataki's pistol permit fee thing got defeated. Did you hear this too?????
"ROLL TIDE". . .Back To Back. . .Three In The Last Four Years "GO GIANTS"  "YANKEES"

Offline Dali Llama

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Pataki's gun fee proposals spark outcry
« Reply #13 on: February 26, 2004, 08:13:44 AM »
Quote from: New York Hunter
Dali, I was on another GBO forum last night and a guy said Pataki's pistol permit fee thing got defeated. Did you hear this too?????
Dali Llama say no, he have not heard that.  Dali say he conduct quick perusal of several firearm forums in response to New York Hunter's question, and not see it there either. :?  :?  :?
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Offline Mikey

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Pataki's Proposal Defeated
« Reply #14 on: February 26, 2004, 08:29:29 AM »
Read about it today in the political action forum down the road a few steps.  Mikey.

Offline Dali Llama

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Re: Pataki's Proposal Defeated
« Reply #15 on: February 26, 2004, 12:43:19 PM »
Quote from: Mikey
Read about it today in the political action forum down the road a few steps.  Mikey.
:?  :?  :?
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Offline Mikey

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Ooops
« Reply #16 on: February 27, 2004, 03:38:41 AM »
Sorry guys, I mentioned the wrong forum.  It was mentioned in the NY Hunters Forum.  How so ever, the local news carried the story today that in the NY Senate, the Senate Republicans soundly defeated the Governor's gun licensing fee scheme.  Period.  

The important note is to understand what worked to override the Governor's proposal - what worked was a massive outcry from the law abiding gun owners in this state.  It was loud enough to be heard all the way from Buffalo to Albany and from Elmira to Ogdensburg and the politicians took note.  

In one of the other forums it was mentioned that for about $1,000, a fellow had made about 100,000 computerized telephone calls stating his position against a certain issue.  In this case the dollar was mightier than the pen and I believe the ploy worked.  It is something to think about when some other politician wants to publically implement some gun grab or gun ban scheme.  

They may be able to go up on the local news to make a point but it appears that the funding of mass telephone messages has a positive affect on the issue - at least from a gun owner's perspective.  I think that might be a tactic I will advocate for in the future - it seems to work.  Let's hope that the next time an issue like this comes to the fore we might be able to utilize that tactic successfully to defeat another imposition onour rights.  

Now, all this is just my two cents worth and ya'll are free to dissent, gripe, complain or even thumb yer noses at me (er maybe), and differing opinions are always entertained.  Thankee!  Mikey.

Offline Dali Llama

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Re: Ooops
« Reply #17 on: February 27, 2004, 08:51:06 AM »
Quote from: Mikey
Sorry guys, I mentioned the wrong forum.  It was mentioned in the NY Hunters Forum.  
Dali Llama say he appreciate clarification, as he search for long time based on Mikey's comment.
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