Author Topic: What to build (Read 1498 times)

Double D · « **on:** January 18, 2004, 03:37:51 PM »

I had an email from John. John is in the Sandbox right now and will shortly return to Fort Carson. John was inquiring about building a cannon and is seeking advice on what to build

I have made up a packet of plans and will send them out to his house tomorrow. I have also suggested he get a copy of the complete Cannoneer.

Here are the questions he has.

Quote

I have a few questions about cannons, since you're the only person I know who actually shoots one. 1- I have looked at web sites such as Dixie Gun Works to price the barrels. With some effort (and begging from Household 6) I think I can swing it. Where is the best place to buy a barrel? Like any American, I'm looking for high quality and best price. I'm thinking full-scale or close to it. Probably Civil War era, though I won't join one of those groups like N-SSA (none in my area). 2- Generally speaking, can you give me a ball park figure for what the carriage will cost to build? I know it will depend on a lot of variables (what wood I use, etc.) but just shoot a ball-park figure. Any special tools I will need? I have your basic handy-man tool set-up, with access to a full-fledged wood shop (Ft. Carson's was voted best in the Army). 3- I will need a mold to make my own rounds; I'm assuming whoever I buy the barrel from will be able to sell me a mold for it and recommend powder charges. Is this true? Thanks for all your help

I love that term "Household6" Modern times, and how things have changed....in my days of wearing the uncles uniform the lovely wife was referred to as the War Department.

I am going to start this off John by recommending that you build a a reduced scale gun and not a full scale gun at this time. A 1/4 scale maybe. A good one to build is a mortar or the Boat howitzer. Fairly simple for a first time project. If you can get access to a metal lathe you can turn the tubes your self quite easily. Carriages a pretty straight forward...and when you are competing with the orthodonist for braces for the kid or powder for you cannon, you be better able to afford both.

A smaller gun will not push you over the top in your household goods weight limit whenyou move and is easier to take care off. It's a good intro to cannon shooting.

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #1 on:** January 18, 2004, 04:33:36 PM »

I assume the 'household 6' refers to the G6 department (or would that be J6 staff level).

One advantage of going full scale is that it may be fired in a few more competitions (some only allow 1:1 scale models).

CJ - you would have the BEST guess estimate to time/$ (US/Canadian) that the project would cost. (Time would be almost directly equivalent as setup time is the most significant)

mac266 · « **Reply #2 on:** January 18, 2004, 06:33:03 PM »

Douglas,

Thanks again. I'll keep watching this post.

Ooooooooooooh! I can smell the Holy Black burning already!

No....wait....that was an incoming round. Darn.

Just kidding, it's been almost a month since the bad guys tried anything against my unit.

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #3 on:** January 19, 2004, 12:52:09 AM »

Ahhhhhhh the smell of black powder in the morning!

Mac266 -

Don't let your guard down! (Insert story of choice here.)

Ask the questions here, that will prime the pump.

Spent a 28 day tour at Ft. Cartoon once - enjoyed it too - with the Joint Unconventional Warfare Taskforce.

Should be some great places to shoot around there - lots of space and intersting topography.

You should consider caliber and ammunition availabilty. The mortars I make are in golf-ball, beer-can, sodapop-bottle, and 4" pvc pipe calibers (filled with concrete).

There are other readily available calibers too - D-cell battery, etc. etc.

Then think of range. It's EASY to find a 100 yard range. So where do I fire that 24-oz pop bottle filled with concrete that will go 1500 meters? Low angle - unless I'm willing to put it over the mountain - somewhere out there....

Double D · « **Reply #4 on:** January 19, 2004, 01:02:40 PM »

Another one to consider John is the Mtn Howitzer. This is the type gun that was often used out on the prairie.

The plans I am sending you include the Mt. Howitzer. It has a wheeled carriage.

mac266 · « **Reply #5 on:** January 19, 2004, 06:01:36 PM »

I am new to the whole artillery thing (modern equipment excepted, of course). I think my first impression of what I should build is between the 1841 6 pounder (due to the fact it was common in the Civil War) and the mountain howitzer. I have also started looking at Douglas's suggestion that I build a mortar. To be honest, I was more interested in a cannon at first, and didn't consider the mortar until Douglas suggested it.

I seem to be able to find a lot of information on the internet about the 1841. Can anyone tell me more about the mountain howitzer (how it was employed, what dates it was generally used, etc.)?

Can anyone tell me about the mortar? Again, how was it employed (i.e. on the open battlefield or as a siege weapon against forts), dates, etc?

Thanks again.

Calamity Jane · « **Reply #6 on:** January 20, 2004, 10:07:05 AM »

If'n ya build a smaller scale C.W. cannon, like a 1/4 scale 6 or 12 pounder, you won't be out too many $$ 'n' if ya screw sommit up, it wont break the bank.

I figger me 1/3 scale 6 pounder cost me about $800 Canajin ('bout $1.98 U.S.) in materials (excluding the wheels) 'n' took about 1,000 hours, but then agin, I made all the danged fool li'l chains 'n' other fittings that most people don't bother with.

I'm happy with a 1" bore (although the scale would have dictated a larger bore). I cast a 1" lead ball from wheel weights (at 5 to the pound & 10 cents a pound for material) and load about 1 Ounce of powder ($17.00 a pound), so it costs me about $1.00 per shot, which is quite reasonable.

Plans are available from Dixie Gunworks, about $40 fer the two sets of plans, and ya kin build any size ya want.

I chose 1/3 scale cause the cannon and limber would fit in the back of a pickup truck and 1 person can lift a 1/3 scale 6-pounder.

The big down-side to the 1/3 scale is that I get cramps in my legs from all the up/down of putting about 15 shots down range! :shock: Of course, if I'd built bigger, I couldn't AFFORD to put 15 shots down range just for the fun of it!

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #7 on:** January 20, 2004, 01:39:52 PM »

Mac -
I'll toss out a few things about the history of artillary and a few dates ALL of the top of my head with no references and marginal credibility.

Gunpowder (blackpowder) came over from China about when - 1100 or so?

Castles were VERY good defenses, with major tactical techniques of starving them out and other siege tactics.

Then came the trebuchet - a major improvement of the catapult being able to hurl things like dead catle into the Castle. Disease is a great tactical weapon.

But in the 1300's mortars and cannon became the popular castle buster.

About 1500 the 'hand gonne' was employed - a 1/2 inch to inch bore, tube about a foot long on a 5 to 7' pole. Lots of smoke little accuracy but an infantry support weapon!

Cannon and mortars were smaller then - easier to make and transport. Bronze was one of the materials of choice. The Coehorn mortar used the technique of having the powder in a chamber with lots of bronze around it and the walls ofthe tube made thinner - saved much weight.

Lots of development between the years of our revolution and civil wars - both in materials and designs.

Many folks will distinguish weapons by the curvature of their trajectories. Gun - flat shooting, Howitzer - long high arch, and mortar - high short arch.

By the time of our Civil War both cannon and mortars were used for hitting the target directly with solid and explosive shells. Canister rounds contained many smaller projectiles, and explosive filled rounds provided fragmentation for anti personnel use.

You have MUCH good reading ahead of you about the techniques and the associated stories.

El Confederado · « **Reply #8 on:** January 20, 2004, 02:44:43 PM »

Mac,
The 1841 Mountain Howitzer was used from 1841 all the way till the 1898 Spanish War.It was used more for close support and to be used by "Horse Artillery" aka Cavalry with cannons. They had a bore of 4.62 inch I think and packed quite a wallup. Hope this is an answer for ya.
Keep you ammo ready and cover your 6.
19 Delta-Rebcavscout.

mac266 · « **Reply #9 on:** February 07, 2004, 01:05:59 AM »

Douglas,

The Wife tells me the plans have arrived. I know because she mentioned something about plans for a "howister."

I'll take a look when I get home, which should be a couple more months when you figure in all the time I'll spend in Kuwait loading ships, etc.

Blaster · « **Reply #10 on:** February 23, 2004, 12:52:53 PM »

Mac266. Just sent you a short PM regarding a cannon shoot to be held down at Raton, NM sometime this coming May. Wanted to send you an e-mail but couldn't get an address for you. Let me know if you are interested in this cannon club shoot, at your convenience and I'll hustle up more info. TAKE CARE!! Blaster (Bob in Colorado)