Question for Bikerbeans Rifled .410?

[hunter4626]

Hey Biker not wanting to hijack another thread-but I've noticed you have a 410 RIFLED barrel? how so and can it be done again?

[tacklebury]

Just in case he doesn't see this, I believe he has a .444 Marlin barrel that he uses with bumped up diameter lead bullets, but he will likely chime in. 

[bikerbeans]

hunter,

The gun modification is easy, just mod the rim cut and extractor (don't use an ejector barrel for this) to accommodate the larger OD of a 410 hull.  You are now done with the gun, assuming it is an H&R 444M Handi Rifle.

Now the hard part.  Figure out how to modify a brass/plastic 410 hull to one, accept a 44 cal bullet and two chamber into a 444M chamber.  There is a bunch of trimming, neck sizing, hull resizing etc. required plus a bit of the unknown in load development to make this work.  I had to make my own dies and a reamer to modify the hulls to work. 

You might be able to make this work using all brass 410 hulls, but I am not sure as I never tried.  All brass shotgun hulls are not legal for deer hunting in my state.

Once Matt gets the lost posts restored there are a couple of threads with a bit more detail on this.  Right now I am going off my memory and it ain't so good.  Three years ago I made what I thought was a lifetime supply of slugs and I haven't made any since.  I made need to re-read my own posts before I can make anymore hulls.

To answer your question, yes it can be done again, but just not by me.  HBB (Honing Big Bore, IIRC) can make you a fully rifled 410, but it is on a Encore platform.  They can also provide you with the ammo.

Good luck,

BB

[RPRNY]

Curious. I have a 410 and a 444M Handi. I load 5/8 oz shotgun loads in 444M brass for the 410.

Do I understand you load 410 plastic hulls with .432" cast slugs for the 444M Handi for shotgun season or a shotgun only restriction? Certainly clever. It's the shell rather than the bore that is defined for use? I ask as NY's southern counties are shotgun only and if they too define by shell rather than gauge, this is an option for me and you are a bloody genius (well, I suppose you already are, but you would be acknowledged as such by a grateful hunter...) ;-)

[bikerbeans]

RPRNY,


My wife agrees with you on the "bloody" part but not the genius.   This conversion wasn't my idea and there have been many variations on the theme for quite a number of years.  I have seen "homemade" 410 rifled slug guns based on;

lever guns
pump guns
bolt guns
and non-H&R break action singles.

There are probably other action types out there as well.

In my state the rules basically state that a shotgun slug can be no smaller than 410 bore or larger than 10ga.  They don't specify a particular bore or gauge.  They also state that all brass hulls and bottleneck hulls are illegal.  There isn't much more to there rules than that.   IF they were to include SAAMI pressure specs in there rules then I might be pushing it a bit, but I doubt a game warden is prepared to conduct piezo pressure testing in the field.    Anyway, it is about to become a moot point for me as Ohio has proposed the legalization of pistol/straight wall CF rifle cartridges for deer.

IF you try and go this route I would suggest you use the older style Winchester compression formed hulls.  These are by far the strongest brass/plastic hulls I have found.  The only other hull I would use is the newer Winchester AA/HS hulls but these hulls are much weaker than the compression formed hulls.


BB 

[RPRNY]

Thanks. I will have to look at the NYS regs.

[tacklebury]

Depending on the range you need to get to, my little .410 Slugger made by cutting a std. barrel to 20" and adding sights was inexpensive, requires no modification and seems to be pretty accurate so far with off the shelf .410 slugs and my home made .413 slugs made from .41 magnum bullets loaded backwards.  They don't tumble and have been grouping around 2" at 25 yards.  Need to have it warm up to do some more testing though. 

[RPRNY]

"Shotgun—is a firearm with a barrel length of 18 inches or more that uses shells that are nonmetallic except for the base."

That's the NYS hunting regs definition.

 So, I am thinking trim hull to .410 length, neck ream to seat .432" bullet, fill with black powder, covered with veggie wad and I'll have no pressure worries and an absolutely jolly shotgun / 444 Marlin for southern counties deer season. Who'd a thunk?

[tacklebury]

Sounds fun, keep us posted.    I'll be curious to see how much better accuracy your rifled version gets than my smoothbore using .413 pistol bullets over bp with cardboard wads. 

[RPRNY]

Well, one can't just blame the firearm. It's accuracy may be hindered by the shooter in my case. ;-)