Author Topic: 100gr Black Mag'3 + 200gr Shockwave = Dead Deer Part 2 (Read 1185 times)

Busta · « **on:** December 18, 2004, 08:29:31 PM »

Well I gave the 200gr Shockwave another chance and am VERY impressed to say the least.

I went out to the same stand that I shot the doe in last Saturday to see if I could fill another antlerless tag. I have been seeing numerous does from this woods since they took the corn out Wednesday, even seen a nice little buck yesterday. Still waiting on the big buck, but only have one more day with the smoke pole.

Well anyway to make a long story short, just before dark I had a doe at 60 yards and decided to take her. At the shot she bolted and ran on a dead run for about 50-60 yards and hit the ground dead. This time I nailed her right behind the shoulder tearing her heart in pieces and exiting just behind the far shoulder. The entry and exit holes are just amazing for that little bullet and the blood trail was just unbelievable to say the least.

I will try to get a couple post mortem pics before I cut her up. You won't believe the holes that little bullet left behind. I would sure like to get a crack at a big-un on the last day.

The Huntsman and Black Mag'3 did a fine job also. The breech plug removal is as easy as it gets with just Whites grease alone and clean up couldn't get any easier. Gotta like that.

JoeLansing · « **Reply #1 on:** December 18, 2004, 09:23:23 PM »

That was a beautiful story. As far as your misgivings about having a blood trail to follow. How good of a shot are you at a broadside deer at 60 yards? Could you have taken a neck shot? Most of my deer are taken at 25-30 yards and I shoot them at about the bottom 1/3rd of the neck. No need to follow a blood trail. They just drop. We are allowed to use scopes here, that might make a difference? The deer where I hunt at have a very heavy layer of fat. Even a full pass through shot in the heart/lungs I don't get much of a blood trail. A little pink foam for a bit, then nothing because the fat seals the hole. A nice neck shot and needing a blood trail becomes a moot point.- Joe

Tracker · « **Reply #2 on:** December 25, 2004, 11:38:44 AM »

I have had similar results with the lighter bullets. I switched to 300 grain and have had complete pass thrus even on shoulder hits.

Primer · « **Reply #3 on:** December 27, 2004, 07:07:39 PM »

Busta

Congrats on the hunting success! Sounds like the Shockwaves (200gr) did the job for sure. :grin:

Why did you settle on the SW 200's? Was the accuracy somewhat better than your other projectiles,..or were you going mainly for higher velocity,flatter trajectory with the 200's?

Also, fill me/us in on the Black Mag'3. I have to admit ignorance on this stuff. What's it compare to...anything like 777,or more like Pyro? :roll:

ELMO · « **Reply #4 on:** December 27, 2004, 10:47:09 PM »

Congratulations Busta'yote: I keep hearing about this Black Mag'3 powder and it sounds real good. I was wondering, do you get the crud ring while using this powder? I use 777 and I'm getting ready to try something else, tired of crud ring and plug seizure. Thanks, ELMO

Busta · « **Reply #5 on:** December 28, 2004, 03:28:48 PM »

Primer,

I just thought I'd give the 200gr Shockwaves a try, just out of curiosity. Two shots, two dead deer that only traveled 50 yards each. the one through the shoulder left NO blood trail, the one behind the shoulder left a blood trail 4 to 5 feet wide, no kidding.

The Black Mag'3 powder is like a breath of fresh air, no horrible smell, lots of power like 777, small amount of fouling that allows you to seat another sabot without swabbing. I probably only needed about 80 to 85 grains to do the job, but used 100 grains to make sure I had enough power with the light 200gr Shockwaves. The powder is most like the old Clean Shot (now American Pioneer Powder) but the granules are very fine. I bought my BM'3 up at Jay's Clare store.

So far I like the powder, but have only shot sabots and one PowerBelt with it. I will do some Heavy lead slinging with it when the weather warms up a bit. I also need to work up a load with it for my White 12ga Shotgun for turkeys.

ELMO,

I have not done any extensive testing with BM'3. It does produce some fouling right at the face of the breech plug on the barrel walls, but does not hinder you from loading another sabot without swabbing. You will need to use a wet (spit) patch when you do swab however, otherwise it will grab your patch when the jag bottoms out.

One more benefit is that I can just use regular BP grease because the plug comes out with only my fingers on the wrench. The cleanup is also the easiest cleanup of any of the BP subs, and I have tried them all.

I have only scratched the surface on load development with BM'3, as I have only had three range sessions and two successful hunts with it. Sorry I can't give you more than that.

Primer · « **Reply #6 on:** December 28, 2004, 06:25:43 PM »

Busta, thanks for the info.

Man,that second kill really DID leave a blood trail! Unbelieveable for sure, but have seen similar on a few of my bow kills with lung hit & pass throughs. Like a red highway, and the feeling of "YES !!"...knowing deer is not far ahead. :grin:

I'll have to get up to Jay's and "get with the program" with BM'3.
I also have tried many powders and have to say that the regular APP kind of turns me off when pouring/measuring the charge. It's kind of light gray,course and leaves a white powder on everything....like powdered sugar or something.
Like the cleanup though, the barrel is a little cleaner than the 777 and the breech plug actually comes out. :grin:

Problem with me is that after shooting 777,all the other powders seem a little weak,with the 777 having a sharper recoil...and I guess I've gotten too used of that feeling. :roll:

Hey,good news.........Turkey season is NEXT!... time for application is coming up fast!. :-D

Busta · « **Reply #7 on:** December 29, 2004, 04:34:41 AM »

Hey Guys, take a look at the Black Mag'3 site. This powder burns way cooler that 777 and seems to have as much power with noticeably LESS recoil. I don't know how they do it, but I like it.

Primer,

I was just at Jay's Clare store yesterday and they had a bunch of BM'3 on the shelf. The only downside that I can see to BM'3 right now is the price, $29.95 a pound at Jay's. I think that is what is keeping it on the shelf, but once the word gets out and more retailers start stocking it I'm sure (hope) the price will come down some. Take a look at the site. The only contradicting information I have found is the Ballistic Data on the site and the downloadable PFD file on the site, but it is not much. I do not have an argument to any of their other claims though, so far with the exception of their no fouling residue claim. There is minimal fouling, but their claim of no residue is just not so, in my experience with the Huntsman and 209 primers.

http://www.magkor.com/index.html

Primer · « **Reply #8 on:** December 29, 2004, 06:24:08 AM »

Thanks, Interesting material. Few things caught my attention for sure.
Claim of non-corrosive ...and their tests showing 50% reduction in barrel pressure as compared to black powder. Hmmmm :roll:

Didn't see a posted ignition temp,so tried to download their Safety Data sheet that would show this,but seemed not to load.
Has to be cooler burn, as you found the much improved ease of breech plug removal...without the welded "peanut brittle" crud more normal with 777.

Ya, $29.95 is a stiff price and hope it comes down some once their retailer base increases. For what they claim though, I will have to bite my lip and give it a try.
Did your rifle seem to have any trouble burning all of the 100gr load?

EZshot · « **Reply #9 on:** December 29, 2004, 07:15:37 AM »

I too decided to try BM3 when I heard some of the reports I've read on message boards. I got a pound from Cabela's in Dundee,MI for $27.

After one range session with my Omega I'm questioning whether I got a bad batch of powder. First off, accuracy was good but I got more fouling than I expected per the claims on the Magkor site. Second, the powder I got is a light tan color when the website describes it as a light gray. Lastly, after letting the tightly sealed jug sit the powder I got starts to clump and i have to squeeze/roll the container around to bust up the clumps.

I am not ready to give up on BM3 yet, I'm just wondering if I got a dud batch.

Regards.

snicker · « **Reply #10 on:** December 29, 2004, 09:37:22 AM »

I also got some BM3 before the muzzleloader season and I've got to say that I am impressed with it. I only use 80 grains and a 240 grain T/C sabot in my Huntsman and it is extremely accurate. Shot a nice spike at 45 yards, lower neck, and he went down on the spot. The powder seems to be a creamy gray and real fine. Clean up is really great, not much at all. It will clump in my flask but a quick shake and it breaks up. Got to say I really really like this stuff. Just hope the price comes down.

Busta · « **Reply #11 on:** December 29, 2004, 10:03:00 AM »

Primer,

You want the In Print Brochure in PDF, give it a few minutes to load.
The posted ignition temperature of Black Mag'3 is 333 deg C. and 313 deg C. for Black Powder.

http://www.magkor.com/blackmag%20brochure.pdf

EZshot,

I think you may have gotten a bad batch also, my powder is a greenish/gray and very fine almost dusty granules. I got mine from Jay's in Clare and was just there yesterday and squeezed the jugs, no clumping in any of them. Mine however has been inside and outside a few times, just went and checked it and it felt a little firmer than it used to. I opened it up and the powder is very dry and no clumps at all that I can see by turning it while looking inside.

I wonder since Cabelas was the first to carry BM'3 in Michigan, if they didn't get a batch that had been sitting around for months or maybe years? Another thing with a NEW powder on the shelf, everyone has to open it to look inside to satisfy their curiosity and that exposes the powder well before it is purchased. The stuff at Jay's was good as of yesterday and NO I didn't look inside, I gave it the squeeze test. :wink:

encore31 · « **Reply #12 on:** January 01, 2005, 06:30:16 AM »

just being the devils advocate in regards to the triple 7s i shoot a 209 by 50 encore with the 250 grain shockwave with 150 grain three pellet load though i am scoped.but i am hearing allot of bad feed back from the triple 7s understanding that everyone has there own opinion i would like to share mine.now you all can believe this or not but i am sited in at 100 yds and i am shooting 1 inch groups this year i have killed three deer with it from ranges to 20 yds to the longest shot i ranged him at 173 yds and hit him in the lungs with about a seventy yard tracking job though he was running dead case and point 173 yards in the lungs!now in terms of cleaning at the range i will shoot two rounds wet a patch with water three times run three dry patches and the barrell is spotlesss though i do agree with the breech plug seizing nothing that some antiseizee wont fix that takes all of about 2 seconds and if a person stays on top of it in terms of cleaning wich is a given in muzzleloading the problems wont be an issue anyway no matter what kind of powder you shoot.One thing is for sure this year one of the bucks i got was a 170 class buck and for me im gonna keep shooting my 150 triple 7s tipped with the 250 grain shockwave t/c at 173 yds scoped of course. now had I gone with the 80 to 90 grain charges as some are saying, that buck would still be in the field.Like i say everybody has there own opinion and i respect every last one,this is just mine. ps... i am new to the site that is why i haven't had any other posted replies i hope i didn't offend anyone and it wasn't an attempt to try to insult anyones intelligence.just one opinion amongst a million.

Busta · « **Reply #13 on:** January 01, 2005, 08:08:15 AM »

encore31,

Welcome to the board.

777 is a very good powder and I have been using it in loose form since it hit the shelves. It has good and bad points just like all of the powders. This thread was part 2 to a previous post about Black Mag'3 powder and 200gr Shockwave.

So far, I like the MB'3 powder, it has lots of power like 777 but does not heat up the barrel or try to seize up the BP like 777 loose powder does. Don't get me wrong, I haven't thrown away my 777, I have lots of good loads for all of my guns (7) with that powder. My Huntsman will not reliably set off 777 pellets with a consistent velocity 100% of the time, in my experience, so I no longer use them. 777 loose is very consistent in all of my guns.

This post was only meant to report the performance outcome of the 200gr Shockwave being propelled by 100gr of Black Mag'3 on deer sized game. Some comparisons have been made along the way, but you are comparing apples to oranges when you compare a Encore with 150gr charge capability to a Hunsman with a manufacturers suggested 100gr powder charge maximum. If your Encore will shoot 150gr charges accurately, then you are very fortunate.

FYI, 70gr of 777 loose powder and a 460gr all lead conical can, has and will take out even elk at 200 yds. It is not all about how much powder you can stuff down you barrel, it is about finding an accurate load and being able to hit your mark. Nothing cares how fast you miss them.

Congratulations on the nice buck! Post some pictures, I am sure everyone would like to see it.