patched round ball

[Cuz]

I have a question?? have any of you folks fired a patched round ball from an inline?? I have read a lot of talk about the sabot, etc. but nothing about the round ball. it may be a silly question to some, but I have always thought of "muzzleloader=round ball".

I have read the discussion intently over the Omega and the Apex and I see two different 'camps' on the subject. I am leaning toward a new .45/209. After reading all the posts, I am leaning toward the Omega.

thanks for your comments. Cuz

[Longcruise]

Cuz, there was an aricle in Muzzle Blast about 10 myears ago on the then new Rem 700 ML.  the author tried patche d round balls and great accuracy.

I've shot them out of a .58 huntsman over 60 grains ffg and got 4 inch 10 shot offhand groups at 50 yards.  That's about as good as I can do with any ml offhand.

[jgalar]

Due to the fast rate of twist they shoot light loads very well.

[sduve]

I have fired the roundball in my Encore 50 cal with great results. It would make 1 ragged hole at 50 yds over 50 gr of FF Pyro. RS.

[Wolfhound]

My old CVA hunterbolt would shoot very well with 80 gr of Pyro RS and a .495 ball with a .015 patch. At 50 yds it kept them under 2" with open sights even though it fairly well shredded the patch. It was a 1/32" trist.

[Walker]

I've shot a bunch of them in White Whitetails and Knight T-Bolt. With 60gr. Pyro-P they shoot pretty good. Any faster and they start spraying. ^0gr. of 777 and they were no better than 8".  Fast twist is for conicals and sabots. Round balls like 1/60 best.

[walt cowan]

hornaday has a round ball sabot called hardball. start with a low load and work up until the sabot shows ware or groups open up. :grin:

[Mel Taylor]

I don’t know about using a patched ball but I use .457 round balls with an ordinary black MMP sabot in my Savage with smokeless powder (IMR 5744) for plinking and as a varmint load for Jackrabbits with good to great 100 yd. accuracy. I imagine that round balls would work as well, or maybe even better with BP or one of the substitutes.  

I also tried .451 and .454 balls. Accuracy was at least as good as with the .457’s but the looser fit in the barrel caused too many misfires when using smokeless. That problem shouldn’t exist with BP or a substitute.

The .457 ball weighs something like 146 grains, recoil is light and fun to shoot and I found I could cut the powder charge way down for my ten year old grandson and still maintain accuracy.

For general information or If any of the Savage shooters on the board want to try round balls with smokeless, Here’s what I use: For jack rabbits and hundred yard plinking, .457 ball, MMP black sabot, 50 grains of IMR 5744 measured in an adjustable BP measure. This equals approximately 45  weighed grains. For light loads I use the same components but cut the powder to 30 grains, measured.

It's been several months since we last used the light loads and to be truthful, I can't remember whether we were shooting those at fifty or a hundred yards.  

I use the 5744 because it is much easier to ignite than most other smokeless powders. And, since it takes a relatively large variation in load weight to produce any significant change in point of impact, lends itself well to measuring .

[Longcruise]

You can shoot the .430 to .433 round balls as well with the Hornady green sabots (.50 cal for .44 bullets).   I've also had good results with my .45 barrel and the Hornady blue for .357 bullets using .350 buckshot.

Mel, I expect you have checked the weight of your smokeless loads thrown by your volume measure, but I'd be plumb nervous about the idea of somebody assuming that their volume measure would throw the same charge. :eek:

[Mel Taylor]

Longcruise,

Your point is well taken and I agree with you. And, more importantly, that information applies ONLY TO IMR 5744 powder AND only for use in Savage rifles which are designed for shooting smokeless.

On the other hand the worse thing that would happen if someone using a Savage were to over charge it, is that the sabot would blow, release the pressure and the shooter would wonder  where the ball ended up.

I spent a lot of time weighing measured charges of different powders to determine which ones would give the most consistent weights from measured load to measured load and which ones would allow the biggest variation in weight without affecting accuracy.

The BP measure I refered to is one of the brass carry-in-your-pocket ones that I ordered from Bass Pro and is calibrated in 5 grain increments but in the process of trying to figure out what worked best I tried four different ones of the same general design but with different lengths and diameters. I was surprised to find that they all measured very close to the same amount.

[Longcruise]

I was surprised to find that they all measured very close to the same amount.

Have never compared any of mine.  Not too concerned since BP is my only propellant.  For hunting, I buy the fixed measures that exceed my hunting charge and then cut, file, etc. until it holds the charge that is desired.  Easy to hang around your neck or whatever.  I've found that if all my components are within easy reach (and i remember where each is ) that my loading goes nearly as fast in the field as a speed loader.

OTOH, in 29 years of ml hunting I have never needed a "quick follow up shot".

[Jason]

My Knight doesn't shoot patched round balls very well at all, which I think is due to the shallow, flat rifling its barrel has. My CVA Eclipse shoots patched round balls amazingly well, though, which I think it because it has much taller, rounded rifling. The only loads I tried were 50 and 60 grains of FFg Triple Seven under .490" Hornady round balls with .015" pre-lubed patches, and it kept all holes touching for about 10 3-shot groups in a row at 50yds. I even won $10 that day from a "traditional" shooter who bet me that my 1:28 barrel couldn't hold a candle to his 1:70 twist custom gun. :twisted: I wish the Knight shot them that well, as it's my primary hunting gun now (the Eclipse used to be) and patched round balls would make an excellent cheap practice load. Oh well, the Knight shoots sabots and conicals better than the CVA does, and those are the hunting loads that I care about the most. I can always pick up a couple packs of T/C Cheapshots. :grin: