Author Topic: 209X50 and Changes in Point of Impact (Read 568 times)

Vapour · « **on:** June 01, 2004, 10:28:22 AM »

Hi all. I've been lurking this forum for some time soaking in information on accurizing my Encore, but I recently ran into a problem that I'd like some advice on.

My Encore barrel has been relatively accurate so far, but in the quest for even better accuracy (sub-MOA) I recently attempted to remove as much contact between the forend and barrel as possible. I first tried using nylon washers on the posts to float the barrel, but still had a pretty tight fit. I went on to carefully remove wood from the barrel channel and from the area near the hinge pin which was rubbing against the receiver. I can now easily fit a dollar bill between the barrel and forend.

Now to the problem. Two weeks ago it seemed like I was shooting two different groups at the range--both about 1 inch, but about 3 inches apart vertically. Last weekend I brought out my chronograph to see if there were any large variations in velocity which might account for this type of grouping. I shot 3 rounds (spit patching once between each shot) into about a 2 inch group. I then shot three more rounds into a 1 inch group about 3 inches above the first group. There were no major changes in velocity between these two groups. I let the gun cool off for an hour and then fired 4 more rounds which went into my second group.

I'm pretty sure that it's not barrel heating that's causing this strange effect. So I'm guessing it's either a barrel fouling effect or possibly a shifting hinge pin problem--removing wood from the forend near the pin does allow it more freedom of movement. My next step will probably be aquiring a larger hinge pin, or aluminum tape to stop hinge pin shifting. Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks.

209x50 · « **Reply #1 on:** June 01, 2004, 02:41:06 PM »

Like you said ....those are two of the most likely candidates ( the size of the pin and its movement)...maybe the 209 primer is another cause....have you checked out the Precision Rifle breech plug conversion....lots of this conversation in the Modern Muzz form...go there for further advice.....

Vapour · « **Reply #2 on:** June 01, 2004, 04:29:00 PM »

Yeah, I may still get one of prbullet's .25 ACP conversions as well--but it would be nice if I could fix (or understand) the problem for under $60. I was hoping that someone might have had a similar problem with an Encore in a non-muzzleloader form. Then I could chalk it up to a hinge pin problem. Thanks again.

Bullseye · « **Reply #3 on:** June 01, 2004, 05:29:40 PM »

I do not believe that a loose hinge pin is causing the problem. The pin on my 209x50 just about falls out be itself when you lay the gun on it side and it shoots great.

I assume the gun has a scope. I think I would check the scope and mounts first.

skeeter · « **Reply #4 on:** June 01, 2004, 07:57:11 PM »

Was your gun clean when you shot the first group? I have owned a couple of in lines that the first couple of shots were off with a clean barrel. When hunting I always hunt with a dirty gun. The first shots may be off several inches. I have seen this with numerous muzzle loaders. I have also seen where people clean the gun with solvents or WD 40 and it makes the first groups bad until the solvent or WD 40 is burned up. Then the gun settles in a shoots OK. If you are shooting pyrodex or 777 you should not need to swab the bore between shots. I hope this helps.

Vapour · « **Reply #5 on:** June 02, 2004, 03:59:29 AM »

Cool, it looks like I can chalk it up to fouling in the barrel then. I've been shooting 220 grain dead centers on top of 90 grains of FFFG triple 7. After a day of shooting I clean the rifle using CLP, dry the bore, and then run a patch with Hoppes oil through. Before shooting I run two patches down the bore to remove the oil, fire off two 209 primers, swab once with a spit patch, once with a dry patch, load and fire. After firing I run a spit patch, then a dry patch down the bore after every shot to remove the triple 7 crud ring and to keep conditions from shot to shot relatively the same.

I was hoping it was a barrel fouling effect, but it seemed odd that I would get two groups out of the gun. I would have expected a gradual change in point of impact as fouling accumulated in the barrel. Thanks for the help.

skeeter · « **Reply #6 on:** June 03, 2004, 06:49:40 PM »

I think you are using too fine of gun powder first off. Second I would use either water or T/C number 13 solvent to clean. After cleaning use T/C bore butter to lube the barrel. T/C recommeds not using petroleum based grease. You need to "season" your bore. Its like seasoning and old cast iron frying pain. Once the frying pan gets black and shiny things don't stick. You never wash that old pan with detergants. Triple seven especially cleans up easily with water. Using water to clean your gun seens to go against everything you learned about gun care. You just need to dry it and put on a good coat of bore butter. Get rid of the Hoppe's and the petroleum grease and your accuracy will improve. Once your bore is fouled your groups will get better. Triple 7 is so clean that you do not need to swab your barrel between shots.