Author Topic: Ethics question (Oh no, not another one). (Read 794 times)

daddywpb · « **on:** November 25, 2004, 12:06:09 AM »

Here's a question for everyone:

I was driving on the grade in a local WMA during a hog only gun hunt. This particular area butts right up to another WMA, seperated by a fence. I saw a group of about eight small hogs. Six of them were on my side of the fence, and two were on the other side. They were obviously trying to find a way to get back togeather. I slowed down to look and kept going. I saw a truck coming up behind me in the mirror. He slid to a stop, grabbed a rifle out of a window rack, and opened up on the hogs. I saw one run away, I assume he killed the other five. You are not supposed to carry loaded firearms in a vehicle, and you aren't supposed to shoot from the road. The hogs weren't more than 25 or 30 feet from him, they were pinned up against the fence, and he fired seven or eight times REAL fast.

I realize that ethics are a very personnal matter, and I guess I'm not condeming the guy - he went home with some meat, and I didn't, but I just wouldn't shoot them that way. To me, and I don't even try to speak for anyone else, that's not hunting. It's killing, but not hunting. I guess we all head into the woods for differant reasons.

I was just interested in getting other opinions about that situation. What would you have done.

Oh yeah, HAPPY THANSGIVING TO ALL!

Wynn · « **Reply #1 on:** November 25, 2004, 04:49:28 AM »

You just raised a ethical dilemna yourself. If he was breaking laws, why didn't you report him to the authorities? So who is more unethical? Him or you? :?

Bob in TX · « **Reply #2 on:** November 25, 2004, 05:28:31 AM »

Ethics? This guy was breaking the law........

He was poaching and hunting illegally. I would have called the game warden and reported him right away.........

daddywpb · « **Reply #3 on:** November 25, 2004, 08:07:46 AM »

wynn,
To answer your question, he was. I did report it to the FWCC employee who was working the check station. I gave them his description, and a description of the truck. I was told that since the roads inside the WMA were not paved, that it didn't count as a road, and that the regs say that you cant shoot from a MOVING vehicle, so what he did was legal. Legal or not, the question I posed was whether or not you would shoot pigs that were almost on top of you and held there by a fence. I'm not a lawyer or an FWCC employee, and I don't claim to have memorized the wording of every hunting regulation in Florida - they get more complicated every year. If you were in his postion, would you have shot the hogs?

Dusty Miller · « **Reply #4 on:** November 25, 2004, 08:29:51 AM »

I guess it depends on what one considers "fair chase" is. Shooting ducks in the backyard swimming pool doesn't qualify in my book. As a matter of fact, I'd not shoot any animal that was essentially trapped and had no way out (unless I'd chased him into a natural trap).

Wynn · « **Reply #5 on:** November 25, 2004, 09:35:26 AM »

I would have to say that I would not in a fair chase, hunting situation.

On the other hand, I have been hunting and trapping hogs on private land for many, many years. I have gotten conditional use permits (nuisance permits) from the FWCC and shot up to a dozen in a night of hunting. (Not legal without a conditional use permit) I use bait, traps and dogs as well. So you see, it is a legal question for me. Not a ethical one. Now if the meat from the hogs I trapped or shot was left to waste, then yes, I feel that would be unethical behavior. As it is, I have a hanging rack, power meat saw and grinder, ample freezer space and give away tons of pork to friends and relatives. I am a meat hunter when it comes to hogs; not a sport hunter.

Now, when it comes to deer hunting, I am just the opposite. I hunt them on a private lease, with a 6 point or better rule and I personally use only a bow or a traditional muzzleloader.

Are both situations ethical for me? Yes! Maybe the gentleman you observed is a meat hunter. Hogs, although Game Animals on Florida WMA's are considered a pest by most landowners and most WMA regs are written to reduce hog populations to at least manageable numbers. Hence no limits as to size and numbers and special hunt opportunities on state lands just for hogs.

I wouldn't worry about it to much if I were you. If only one sow escaped from that hunter you saw, she will drop 2 to 3 litters by next season. Two years ago, I put a pregnant wild hog I trapped in a pen and she has raised 7 litters of 6 to 9 shoats. I can't give them away fast enough.

DesertRam · « **Reply #6 on:** November 26, 2004, 03:59:05 AM »

Ethics are a personal thing. It sounds like what he did was legal, though perhaps barely so. This other fella obviously decided that popping some pigs from the road was alright by him. It doesn't sound like it's alright by you - which is fine. We don't all have to hunt and/or shoot the same way. I doubt that any of us here would agree on everything.

I'll be the dissenter here. I don't see a problem with this fella's action, as long as it truly was legal (that's the big uncertain caveat). Of course we all know (or should) that it's not hunting (it's just shooting some pigs), but like you say he took home some meat. If that was his only goal, and he went about it legal like, who are we to complain? I say "never look a gift horse in the mouth." The piggies were there for picking, he just chose to pick them in a situation that many would not agree with.

Would I have done it? That's a good question. Probably. After all, like the previous poster I'm after meat when I hunt hogs. This guy saw some meat, and he got it. I'd probably do the same. Heck, I hunt 'em over bait and with a spotlight (it's legal in TX). Many would say that's not ethical, but it's legal, it's fun, and it puts some dandy tasting pork in my freezer. Those are my goals (fun and food), not cowtowing to some holier-than-thou hunter who doesn't agree with my methods. Of course, it probably wouldn't have been that much more difficult to putter on past 'em, then sneak 'em with the wind in your favor and have a little more fun with it :grin:

bfpgw · « **Reply #7 on:** November 27, 2004, 02:15:48 AM »

Good question, but the wrong game. I understand your theory and support it, except it was hogs.

Here in MO the Conservation Department begs you to shoot hogs. I'm paraphrasing from the wildlife manual in MO but, "anytime you are out on conservation property, or private property with permission, shoot any wild hog on sight." You see, they are pests way beyond the level of coyotes, etc. who do perform some useful purpose. Wild hogs only damage property and spread disease to other wild animals.

I would think less about shooting a wild hog on sight than I would about stopping for a free barbecue sandwich. If I see a wild hog and have a loaded gun adequate for the job (and the time to dress and drag it to the meat processor) and in a legal situation then I would fire first and lick my lips second.

The term "wild hog" conjures up ethics debates when it shouldn't. They weren't wild when they were introduced to the woods, but turned that way when freed. I haven't shot one, but my friends have. They are begged to show up on private property to stop the damage they do. If the guy you described picked up every one he shot and processed them then I'd shake his hand.

They're not bad animals, there's just no reason to think twice about the method if you can bag and eat one. Missouri is always open season on wild hogs.