building a M/N " sniper " rifle

[kevin.303]

I’m buying a M/N 1891 off of a friend and I would like to turn it into “sniper” model, (don’t worry it has non matching numbers) and I’d like to know where and how much I could find a PU scope and mount and a bent bolt handle. I’m also considering the mount that cabelas sells, but I’ve heard both good and bad things about them.

[Stan in SC]

Kevin,
Check out the mini sniper on surplus rifle.Here's a link.Go to articles at the top and then you can go down the list till you find the one.He used a Kalinka mount on an M44 but I just finished doing the same project on a 91/30.
http://www.surplusrifle.com/
Here also is a link for Kalinka.
http://www.kalinkaoptics.com/cgi-bin/kowstore.cgi?user_action=link&link=mainpage
Go to "manuals" at the top and you will see the surplus rifle article in there.

[1911crazy]

I just built a mosin scoped 91/30 and I purchased a mosin scopemount from "Interordnance"  it looks like the orginal but it has a weaver rail.  It mounted on the low rail reciever too so no high rail wall reciever is needed.  You just have to move the mount forward or rearward to make it fit and you will pick up on how to mount it when you take the reciever out of the stock and line the mount up on it.  After mounting the scopemount on the reciever i just laid the reciever in the stock and marked were to notch it out. The bent bolt i purchased from surplusrifle.com(i think) it looks the same as the orginal one.  I did post pics of it in the album section here a while back but i will post pics again for you.                                                                  BigBill


1. Russian/Finnish 91/30 Mosin   very good condition....................$80
2. Interordnance mosin scopemount sidemount.....#M91WVRMT....$59.95
3. CDNN Investments scope........"ultralux"...6x42..military 3post  $29.95
4. CDNN Investments  new mosin dog collar sling..........................$9.95
5. buymilsurplus.com/mosin accesssories...bent bolt....................$69.00
............................................................................Total...........$248.85


Ok the orginal mosin sniper facts;
 BUT ITS NOT THE ORGINAL ITS A FAKE THERE SELLING RIGHT NOW ANYWAY!!!!!!!

For $750 to $1200 but lately the prices have dropped on some to $399 because there not selling but there fakes anyway?? The scopemount numbers don't match even some of the years don't jive too. Plus its the wrong model mosin the snipers only came from one factory.

The choice is up to you I just wanted a scoped mosin but i didn't want the over priced price tag!!!! Or to get ripped off with a Fake too for the big $$$.  Ok its as close as i could get for $250 its not orginal but i didn't pay the big $$ for the fake one.

Some people just burn my butt wether its a fake or not but some of the military guns there selling us right now aren't aresnal refurbs anyway the've been refurbed lately for us were lucky the finish is dry when we get them. this makes me kind of laugh when some of these big collectors say don't refinish your gun when these guys are taking disc sanders and refinishing them to sell to us so who is better to refinish us or them?  Sorry for the rant but its an education for all but we must be careful what we buy and spend our hard earned cash on so "WE" don't get ripped off.

So buy a cheap mosin refinish it and scope it!!!!!!!!! Thats the bottom line you built it and you'll enjoy it too.

Go to; http://www.mosinnagant.net/sniper%20section/fake-snipers.asp

You can find a scout mount at CDNN investments too. You have a choice either way too an orginal looking mount or a scout mount too its up to you too.  Either one will work I have nothing against the scout mount there are different ways to go but the end result is you have a scoped mosin to enjoy.

I purchased 6 finnish captured russian 91/30's that were in very good condition from samco but 5 of them were in excellent condition so i took the 1 in very good condition and scoped it.  Back then these guns were awesome the excellent ones are the best i've ever seen. One is marked #41 thats the finnish marking like the [SA] is.

[Stan in SC]

Bigbill,
Your project sounds good and also what you said about fakes is perfectly correct.
One reason I used the Kalinka mount was that it,unlike the original repro,is adjustable for both windage and elevation by means of set screws rather than grinding and filing.
I have had better success using the scout mount scope concept on my Mosins.Makarov sells one that requires no modification to the rifle.It mounts on the dovetail that the rear sight sits on.You just tap off your rear sight and install the mount.Only the Models 91,91-30 and 91-59 use that dovetail.Also Darrel makes a scout mount.It will fit the carbines(m38 and M44).
I made my own scout mount by installing a Weaver rail on top of an extra rear sight which I had.No mods to the rifle.Tap it on,tap it off.Rock solid.

[1911crazy]

Stan;  The scout mount is a good choice too either way is good.  I think there is a cheap scout mount at CDNN.(new)  The orginal type mount does have a set screw adjustment for scope tilt(alignment parrellel to the barrel adjustment) You have to also watch this when mounting the bracket to the reciever so its close before drilling it.        BigBill

[1911crazy]

I have another funny story about fakes.  There was a post once on another site the guys were talking and bragging about their Russian SVT-40 Tokarev "Carbines".   I read there is one in Russia in a gun museum there.  Another guy posted about his buddy who is an Expert Gunsmith in Canada who was cutting down the orginal long barreled Russian SVT-40 Tokarev's and making them into carbines and they were done so well you couldn't tell the difference between the real gun or the cut down one.  So how many of those are real or so called orginals or "high priced cutdown fakes that are passed off as orginals" to us?  Funny or not its true makes us just wonder?    :-D                                                 BigBill

[Stan in SC]

The way I did it using the rear sight base,alignment was not a problem.
The tang is cut off at the "T" end and it lays flat in the rear sight base parallel to the bore.A cross pin keeps it from flipping up and then the Weaver base is drilled and tapped into the tang.
Yes,the scout concept is good particularly in a hunting situation.You can keep both eyes open.
Another good feature is that there are no expensive alterations to the bolt handle and the scope is not in the way when operating the bolt.
Cost of rear sight $10
Drill and tap         $10
Weaver rail           $ 7
Outshooting the guy next to you at the range who has a $1800 Weatherby with a $800 scope on it.......priceless.
This actually happened to me.A guy at the range had the above mentioned Weatherby and couldn't hit a barn door with it.He was poo pooing my "old German gun" .I asked him if he could hit an apple someone had left lying on the ground at the 100 yard berm.He missed by a good margin and I split the apple clean in half.

[1911crazy]

Didn't walmart have vanguard weatherbys for $250 on clearance a while back? I love seeing these guys go from kringing when they first see us with military surplus guns and then they look foolish when they out shoot there expensive guns thats the best!!!!!!   :-D    And the gun costs under $100 too.  I just don't understand why these guys think these guns can't shoot? Some of the new guns are very questionable about their quality and where and how there made now.  I think they have priced themselves right out of the market too and now to cheapen the price the quality will suffer. I've heard that remington has had quality problems since '94. I've had problems with some of their guns before that.  It makes me kind of happy I got into C&R military surplus guns to have fun with too for if I paid a lot of cash for a new gun and it didn't preform the way it should the maker would sure know about it.  We have to remember too back when these guns were made we had very skilled craftsman and if we look at the modern guns now we lost that hands on skill.  Just because it looks good on paper doesn't mean its going to work right.  A computer operated machine just doesn't have the hands on craftsmanship nor the love or heart of doing a good job.  You can see the craftsmanship that went into these old military rifles they maybe "No Frills or No bells and whistles" But they sure do shoot good!!!!                      BigBill

We lose more manufacturing here in the US everyday and with that we lose the craftsman it takes to do each job too. Everyone thinks it will come full circle and comeback, while it may in the future but these hands on craftsman will be long gone and so will be the tricks of the trade knowledge too.  We just have that buy new, throw away additude too now, along with just sell it and fix it in the field after someone buys it our industry thats left shows it.  This makes older cars more appealing to me too just give me one with ignition points heck thats the only thing we had to worry about years ago.  Now were going to give our soldiers computerized guns too buy stock in battery companies!!!!

The only improvement i have ever seen which i used often was my auto darkening welding helmet while it has batteries it actually solar charges off the welding of course it costs around $500 too.

[kevin.303]

i've tried scout mounts and didn't like them. i'm going to go for the original look. i was originally going to use a low aftermart\ket mount and a weaver K4 , but figured if i want a scoped M/N, might as well go for the original look.

[1911crazy]

Kevin.303  I think Sarco may have the orginal scopemounts w/scopes too but if you find one there not cheap thats the problem.   You could try loacl gun shows.   BigBill

[Stan in SC]

Kevin,
Apologies.We got to chewing the fat and didn't answer your questions.
The bent bolt from Jim R. is about $65.A repro mount from Interordinanace is about $100.Kalinka has a nice "looks like an original" scope for about $100.Drilling and tapping and fitting that mount is about $150.There's a lot of work to it.
Go to surplus rifle and read some of his articles on Mosin scope mounting.Nothing like a little homework.Here's the link.
http://www.surplusrifle.com/
I just finished a 91/30 with a Kalinka mount.Pretty awesome.

Stan

[kevin.303]

no worries. i was just re reading Bill's post on quality control and i've been hearing the same thing about Remington. the 597's are junk, 700's that fire when a round is chambered. the only Rem. product i don't hear anything bad about is the 870. last year i went to buy a .22. my choices where the 597 for $199.99 or a Soviet TOZ-17 trainer "scratch & dent special" for $125.99. i read a few posts on the 597 here and opted for the russkie but they where sold out. i still haven't found another .22.

[1911crazy]

kevin.303  I've been warned to stay away from the new springfield armory M1a's too because of quality problems too and these guns aren't cheap too they start out at $1,200??  I was told to buy an older one. BigBill

[kevin.303]

i've decided to go the other route and use a low receiver mount and sporting scope. i'm also going to fit in a synthetic stock and paint it. now i can hear you grumbling " bubba" and sharpening bayonets, but it's pretty beaten up anyways and the paint job will done by a professional. he does many different styles of camo,mostly on M14's and it's cheaper and the faster than having it reblued! i'll try to upload a pic of some of his work when i get home from work this afternoon.