45-70 Hornady vs Remington 300grn bullets....

[jonr]

Hey everyone! Has anyone noticed an accuracy/performance difference between the Hornady and Remington 45-70 300grn hollow points?
They will be used for whitetail.

I will probably be shooting these bullets around 2200 fps out of a modern marlin.

Thanks!

 

Jonr

[jackfish]

They seem pretty much the same.  I shoot the 300 grain Hornady in my 22" barreled Marlin 1895 at 2180 fps.  I previously have used the Sierra and Remingtons and it seems they all pretty much drop whitetails quickly.  However, my Microgroove barrel seems to shoot the Hornady the best.  Here is my load:

Marlin 1895 45-70 22" barrel
300 grain Hornady hollow point seated to 2.55" COAL and crimped with a Lee Factory Crimp Die
Winchester brass, 2.1" trim
CCI 200 primer
51 grains H4198 START
55 grain H4198 HUNTING LOAD, 2180 fps, below 28,000 CUP

[jonr]

Does the Hodgdon data seem a little hot to anyone else besides me?
Just called them today.

H4198
Over a 300 grain bullet

55 - 60 grains
Velocity 2221 - 2424

Jonr

[Terrible Tom]

Hogdon publishes the hottest 45-70 data I've found.  Unlike most of the bullet makers, Hogdon seems to be comfortable with lever gun loads that Nosler, Speer or Hornady would call a Ruger #1 load.

On one hand, you'd like to think that they have tested and re-tested their data and that it is completely safe.  OTOH, they're in business to sell powder and Speer/Hornady/Nosler are selling bullets.

A lot of folks would say that 2200fps is too fast for the Rem 300.  You might get better performance from them at 2000, 1800 or even 1600fps.

IMO you don't need all that velocity (and recoil, and powder expense) to kill deer with a 45-70.

[jackfish]

Does the Hodgdon data seem a little hot to anyone else besides me?

No.  The 45-70 loads for the Marlin 1895 are within its safe operating pressure of 40,000 CUP.

[rickt300]

I sort of settled on much lighter loads for my 45-70. The fastest loads with the 300 grain bullets are a bit much in my opinion on Texas whitetails. Really pretty destructive any where near 2000 fps. If I need that kind of velocity for trajectory I'll take my 30-30 .In my 45-70 a 405 grain bullet at 1500 fps will do what I need done on hogs. As soon as the 405's are gone I will use 350 grain Hornady RN's at the same velocity.

[Terrible Tom]

Does the Hodgdon data seem a little hot to anyone else besides me?

No.  The 45-70 loads for the Marlin 1895 are within its safe operating pressure of 40,000 CUP.

There's the riddle.  Marlin sells the 1895 in 450 Marlin, a caliber with a 40,000 CUP SAAMI-certified pressure rating.  Therefore, the 1895 action mut be capable of handling the pressure, right?

OTOH, Marlin cannot recommend or even condone loading the 45-70 past 28,000 CUP--they're a SAAMI member and they have to abide SAAMI guidelines.

Lots of reloading manuals list hotter-than-SAAMI loads for 45-70, but say that they're intended for Ruger #1/Siamese Mauser ONLY.  AFAIK, Hogdon is the only source of published reloading data that recommends this pressure level for the Marlin 1895 in 45-70.

If Hogdon's loads seem hot to you, that's because they are hotter than anything anyone else is willing to publish.  Whether or not they are too hot for the action is a subject of never-ending debate.

Marlin, SAAMI and the bullet manufacturers are all toeing the company line--no loads over SAAMI pressures for the Marlin 1895.  Hogdon is saying to he-double hockey sticks with Marlin & SAAMI, we know the action will withstand 450 Marlin pressures so we're using that pressure level for our 45-70 loads.  Of course, Marlin also has an interest in the success of the 450 Marlin...

I am sure that Hogdon's data is safe.  Yes, it is hotter than everyone else's data, but it's still safe.