Author Topic: 357 MAX. ?? (Read 1083 times)

Buckeye · « **on:** December 19, 2004, 11:35:26 PM »

Who has tried the 180gr. Hornday pointed bullets in there 357 Max ??, and What type of results ??

jeff223 · « **Reply #1 on:** December 20, 2004, 02:29:23 AM »

i just rechambered this 357 to 357max and the Hornady 180s are on the list.also the Speer 180gr flat nose.im new to the max but i have done lots of checking around.the Hornady and Speer 180s have good report.there are lots of cast bullet shooters here and the 180gr Hornady XTPs work out for the max shooters here too.im sure some will join in here to help you

22KHornet · « **Reply #2 on:** December 20, 2004, 04:20:13 AM »

180's do pretty good but I have had better luck with the Remington Core Loct. bullets. Of course I still can't seem to beat the 180 xtp for deer stopping. When I tried both bullets into wet newsprint at 50 yards I had more weight retention and deeper penitration with the 180xtp over the 180 single shot pistle bullet. Also the recovered SSP bullets came out in an oblong shape while the xtp was perfectly mushroomed.

Smokin Joe · « **Reply #3 on:** December 20, 2004, 04:39:40 AM »

I use the Hornady # 3505 180 gn and the # 3515 200 gn round nose, both with H110 and they work great. I've also used the Remington 200 round, and it seems to open a little faster.
If you have stability problems with the 200 grainers and the NEF twist rate, increase the velocity.

Leftoverdj · « **Reply #4 on:** December 20, 2004, 05:44:05 AM »

I've shot a few of the Hornady 180 pointed bullets. They were not as accurate for me as the various flat nose, but they were still accurate enough for deer at any range I would use a Max. The XTPs would be my choice in jacketed bullets , but the cheap Remington bulk 180s ain't at all bad.

Far as I am concerned the Max is a born cast bullet rifle and 180 is the weight that suits it best. My accuracy with cast is a shade better than with jacketed, possibly because I have put more effort into it. With a good gas check bullet, I get consistent sub inch 50 yard five shot groups at around 2000 fps. Lyman 212 GCs give me nearly the same velocity and very decent accuracy, but that's a round nose design. I'm pretty sure that it would shoot through one of our little deer from any angle, but it would not give much shock.

You wanna shoot hunting load cast, it's gonna have to be a GC design and the bullets should sized .359-360. I waterquench as I cast and lube and GC through a .360 sizer. The sizer barely touches my bullets so the very hard bullets are not a problem to size.

Buckeye · « **Reply #5 on:** December 20, 2004, 09:57:20 AM »

Thanks for the info. gentlemen,I recently picked up this Rossi (from BIGBOREFAN) which I highly reccomend ,if you ever trade with him.
And was getting ready to try a few loads, when I get time,learning a new job is taking up most of my time now.
Smokingjoe ,how deep do you seat your 200gr. Rem Cor-Lokts ?

22KHornet · « **Reply #6 on:** December 20, 2004, 10:03:43 AM »

Not sure about him but I seat mine to the cannular and give it a good crimp. Hornady reloading manual states that the Max should be crimped for ballistic consitiancey. Handi seems to like them but they don't work in the blackhawk.

Buckeye · « **Reply #7 on:** December 20, 2004, 10:37:43 AM »

Thanks, I didn't know bout the OAL ,with the 200 Rem. do you use H110 ?
If so whats you load ?

22KHornet · « **Reply #8 on:** December 20, 2004, 10:55:08 AM »

I have switched to the lil gun powder. I load 22 grns and getting very good accuracy as well as a little over 2100 fps with the 200 grner. Still need to have the chrono checked out to make sure it is reading right. I plan on checking that this spring

Buckeye · « **Reply #9 on:** December 20, 2004, 11:33:50 AM »

Thanks , hopefully after the Holidays and the Weather breaks I'll get to work up a few loads,I'm thinking bout switching to another range also.

JPH45 · « **Reply #10 on:** December 20, 2004, 12:26:40 PM »

I've not used any of the lil gun powder, 2100 for a 200 grainer fromthe max case seems quite warm. I'd be interested in how fast you push a 180 Hornady XTP with it. Best I have been able to do is about 1830 with the Rem 200, but it is an accurate bullet and expands well in newsprint. It is designed for low velocity, Remington only claims 2050 or so for their 35 Remington factory load, so we are certainly inside the poerformance envolope for the bullet, even started out 200 fps slower.

I agree with DJ, I think the 180 is about perfect for the Max, and it seems someone killed a deer this season and posted here about it using the LBT 180. I push the Hornady 180 XTP with 26 grains of 1680, and the Remington 200 with 22.5 grains of 1680.

22KHornet · « **Reply #11 on:** December 20, 2004, 12:35:37 PM »

Velocity seemed kind of high to me as well that is why I am a little concerned on the crony. Winter here in Iowa so I really won't get to test it untill it warms up. Snowing as we speak.

v8r · « **Reply #12 on:** December 20, 2004, 01:52:50 PM »

Hey jeff223 how do you like that G2?how heavy is the trigger?I handled one awhile back and noticed the trigger wasn't adjustible like the old one.

Smokin Joe · « **Reply #13 on:** December 20, 2004, 02:56:15 PM »

Buckeye, I load the 200 RN to the cannelure, or to 2.20" if I'm using the Hornady RN.
I use 19 gn H110 with a Rem 7 1/2 primer. You can also get good results with RE-7 in this bullet weight.

jeff223 · « **Reply #14 on:** December 20, 2004, 03:02:36 PM »

v8r,the trigger was 4lbs from the factory.my gun smith friend did a trigger job on it for me and now its just under 2lbs.its got a real nice trigger now.
"SWEET TRIGGER NOW"

Paul5388 · « **Reply #15 on:** December 20, 2004, 06:37:01 PM »

That velocity doesn't seem too high to me. Back in Sept I ran some 170 gr Keith type Dry Creek bullets at 1698 fps (that's at 15') out of my Handi. The load was 13.5 gr 2400 in .38 Special brass with a CCI 500 primer. The same load clocks at 1350 fps out of a 6" Security Six.

I guess I need to check 15.0 gr 2400 using .357 Mag brass and see if the velocity goes up any.

Elmer Keith said those loads are OK, and they are!

Buckeye · « **Reply #16 on:** December 21, 2004, 11:45:54 AM »

Thanks Smokin Joe !

jspirko · « **Reply #17 on:** December 29, 2004, 08:06:15 AM »

I played with pointed stuff and 200 grainers for a bit with my self reamed max but went to XTPs as many here have.

The Flat Point XTP 158s are fast and accurate. I have taken game with them from our Mag the boy shoots and preformace is good. I am a little concerned about the effect of Max velocity on them and have not used them on game out of the max. This bullet with H110 will get up close to 2200 FPS out of a 22 inch barrel. That is a 400 FPS gain on the Mag and I worry indeed about it blowing up on bone. For small game though (chucks, yotes, etc) it is realy cool.

The 180s rock and are deadly on deer sized game. We have pushed 180s with H110 past 2000 FPS in the Handi. My load of choice is 20 Grains of H110 under the 180 grain bullet that gives about 1950 FPS from my Handi. This is a maximum load please work up if you duplicate it.

To me prefection would be a good 180 Grain FP I don't like HPs intended to go 500 FPS slower when you start hitting bone and flesh. But the 180s have been fine so far.

JPH45 · « **Reply #18 on:** December 29, 2004, 12:13:04 PM »

Quote from: jspirko

I played with pointed stuff and 200 grainers for a bit with my self reamed max but went to XTPs as many here have.

The Flat Point XTP 158s are fast and accurate. I have taken game with them from our Mag the boy shoots and preformace is good. I am a little concerned about the effect of Max velocity on them and have not used them on game out of the max. This bullet with H110 will get up close to 2200 FPS out of a 22 inch barrel. That is a 400 FPS gain on the Mag and I worry indeed about it blowing up on bone. For small game though (chucks, yotes, etc) it is realy cool.

The 180s rock and are deadly on deer sized game. We have pushed 180s with H110 past 2000 FPS in the Handi. My load of choice is 20 Grains of H110 under the 180 grain bullet that gives about 1950 FPS from my Handi. This is a maximum load please work up if you duplicate it.

To me prefection would be a good 180 Grain FP I don't like HPs intended to go 500 FPS slower when you start hitting bone and flesh. But the 180s have been fine so far.

I had a talk with the guys at Hornady last year as I was deciding what to use in my Max for hunting. They actually rate the 180 XTP for a starting velocity of 2100 fps. I load mine with 26 grains of 1680, and get 2060fps on the nose. I shot a spike last year in the shoulder at 25 yards, shattered the foreleg just below the shoulder, drove thru the heart, leaving a 1.5" hole in it and it exited breaking a rib and leaving a calber size hole in the hide. Deer dropped like it was hit with Thors hammer. It is an exellent bullet, showing absolutely no sign of core/jacket seperation even when fired into wet newsprint. Have no worries about the 180 XTP on deer, it will do just fine.

Badnews Bob · « **Reply #19 on:** December 29, 2004, 09:35:21 PM »

I have tried bullets from 110gr XTPs up to the 200gr rnsp and ssp cast and jacketed and it seems to shoot them all ok but always shoots better with flatnose bullets, It really likes 180gr LBT style cast GCs. With 21grs of H4227 I'm getting 2000fps avg. Scoped it'll shoot 1 to 1.25 inch groups all day, with irons I can still keep'em inside of 2. Took a 150lb doe with them this year caliber size in got both lungs and the liver dime size coming out I was more than pleased.

jspirko · « **Reply #20 on:** December 30, 2004, 07:48:55 AM »

Thanks JHP45,

I have shot one deer with this bullet from the Max pushed a little faster then you do. It worked well also.

I need to contact Hornady myself according to the fifth edition of their Manual the 180 HP XTP is designed for a MV of 900-1700 FPS so there is two conflicting pieces of information from Hornady.

Part of my feelings are just my personal preference. My goal is always penetration over expansion. I have heard the pencil through theory from many people on paper but in the field I have seen that you put a hole in both lungs and the animal dies and "goes about as far as it can hold his breath". (quoting Jack Oconner there).

I think it is a good bullet and will probally keep using it I just wish someone would make a flat point 180 in .357

Perhaps I need to give the Hornady 180 Gr PSP SSP another trial. It just did not group as well as the XTP for me.

Jack Spirko

Robert · « **Reply #21 on:** December 30, 2004, 08:30:48 AM »

I lucked onto swaging dies for 357 bullets...they make flat-point and flat-hollow-point bullets. You are very correct...the bullets in the 180-200 gr work excellent in the max. I still enjoy casting...but these homemade jacketed bullets are twice the fun without leading the bore. I am using them in a 20 " Contender Carbine, but I sure do enjoy reading all the NEF forum posts. I am sure I will soon have a nice Handi as well....might start with that new 7.62x39 that will be out soon....still waiting to see if it will be available in .311 bore.