Author Topic: Handguns suitable for big animals? (Read 1699 times)

Sverre A. · « **on:** February 25, 2005, 10:34:23 AM »

I`ve shot about 50 african antilopes (small and big ones) and deers with 357 Mag., 44 Mag., 454 Casull, 30-30 and 375 JDJ. Oryx/Blue W.beest/Zebra and Kudu have been the biggest species I have shot. I ask myself: Where goes the limit for the .454 and 375 JDJ - within reasonable distances (110 and 170 yds)? Of course I have read stories about handgunned Buffaloes and Elephants. In April I will travel to Africa again, and hunt with my .454 and 375 JDJ - but I`m not sure that I will shoot something bigger than a Zebra. What do you think? Do we have "a too good believe" in our handguns?

AZ223 · « **Reply #1 on:** February 25, 2005, 11:55:25 AM »

Sverre A: What kind of loads did you use for your .357? I'm going to be working up some loads for next deer/javelina/whatever season, and I'm curious to know what you used.

BTW -- Good luck on your trip!

myronman3 · « **Reply #2 on:** February 25, 2005, 05:21:22 PM »

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I ask myself: Where goes the limit for the .454 and 375 JDJ

that is not the question. the real question is what is your limit. loaded properly, the 454 doesnt really have a limit. it is more a question you need to ask yourself about yourself. the 454 has proven itself.

Sourdough · « **Reply #3 on:** February 25, 2005, 09:22:58 PM »

I plan on using my 454 Casull for drifting the rivers this spring looking for and calling bears. We have both Blacks and Grizzlies in this area. I'm just waiting for a chance to drop a Grizz with the 454.

Sverre A. · « **Reply #4 on:** February 25, 2005, 10:25:44 PM »

"use for your .357"

158 gr. Hornady XTPHP - Vihtavouri N110.

Sverre A. · « **Reply #5 on:** February 25, 2005, 10:28:32 PM »

"what is your limit. loaded properly, the 454 doesnt really have a limit"

I`m not sure. I had a bad experience with a shot on a Oryx with Lyman 325 gr/1400 fps/100 yds. Send me a pm with your e-mailadr. - and I will send you some pictures from this hunt and a story. Then you may understand my question.

Sverre A. · « **Reply #6 on:** February 25, 2005, 10:30:59 PM »

"use for your .357"

158 gr. Hornady XTPHP - Vihtavouri N110/15 grain.

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #7 on:** February 25, 2005, 11:09:19 PM »

heres my take on it. I hunt with handguns the I own a .500 and .475 line. Ive taken various deer bear and hogs with them and they flatten them. I shot a 1000 lb buffalo this year and it was a different story. It took 3 shots and the buffalo hardly reacted to the shots. My buddy took one with his .500 at the same time and with the same results. John Linebaugh and some of his buddys went hunting them last year too and said about the same thing. I allways thought i was carrying a gun that would knock down a building if it got in the way but in all actuallity your not. What you have to keep in mind is that the best your doing is mild 4570 power level with top end handgun loads. My dream is to take a cape buffalo with one and i will do it before it die. But believe me after watching a buffalo walk away and keep eating after a shot ill have a guide with a big *** rifle backing me up. I guess you have to remember just because it kicks like a mule and belches fire out the end its still just a handgun!

Sverre A. · « **Reply #8 on:** February 26, 2005, 01:31:26 AM »

"out the end its still just a handgun"

Exactly! When I see friends shoot 4 and 5 shots on Elands before they go down (and hardly then) - I doubt that our "short canons" are the right tools on animals which weight are 1800 pounds and up. Of course - the distance is a mainfactor, but my experience is that most of my shots are fired between 60 and 100 yds. At 25 yds. - I believe that I could take a shot on a real big animal, but at "my distances"? No.

When I compare the animals I have shot with my rifle in 375 H&H against the shots done by my handguns - I feel that my handguns are in a lower division.

And J. Linebaugh wrote in an article:
"If you are after dangerous or really Big game, don't load your little gun up. Load your big gun normal. In other words, don't send a boy to do a man's job".

"John Linebaugh and some of his buddys went hunting them last year too and said about the same thing"

Maybe he should remember what he wrote?

palgeno · « **Reply #9 on:** February 26, 2005, 02:21:39 AM »

Severre____Sounds like you have proven that your guns can and do work well enough to do the job-----you apparently did not loose the animals you were hunting. As for American Bison ----I have not yet hunted them-----but I understand that they are rather stoic and may not feel enough pain to make them run and even the sound of a shot may not frighten them----and they don't just drop without a central nervous system hit. Maybe an RPG would be different!!!

Maybe Cape Buffalo are more aware of their environment---MEANER----and maybe harder to kill as well----how can we tell? I suppose someone who has killed a large number of both types could give us a fair comparison. pg

myronman3 · « **Reply #10 on:** February 26, 2005, 02:37:52 AM »

to expect very big animals to drop instantly with a handgun just isnt a realistic expectation. put the shot through the heart, and stand back. follow your animal and it will die. a guy up here that raises buffalo uses a 22 lr pistol to kill them for slaughter. shoots them at the base of the ear.

if you want the utmost in power, handguns aint the ticket- everyone knows that. handguns can get the job done when properly loaded and the hunter does his part. with big dangerous game i would go for cns hits. but then, i personally wouldnt hunt big mean stuff without using a rifle. that's just me though.

Sverre A. · « **Reply #11 on:** February 26, 2005, 03:40:22 AM »

"stand back. follow your animal and it will die"

But trying to follow an animal for a long distance - can end up with no animals. That`s my experience (but I have not followed any tracks in the sand of Sahara - only in bushy terrain).

myronman3 · « **Reply #12 on:** February 26, 2005, 05:44:09 AM »

if that is your issue, i would say either go for a cns hit or use a rifle. i understand what your question is now more than i did originally. it sounds like you have some wonderful hunts under your belt.
when i have to absolutely, positively, have to have the most power available, i use a rifle.

Sverre A. · « **Reply #13 on:** February 26, 2005, 06:21:51 AM »

"most power available, i use a rifle"

In Norway - we are not allowed to hunt with a handgun - and because of that - I hunt with rifles in suitable calibers for the game I hunt in my "mother-country".
When I travel to Africa - I will not spend a lot of money on a riflehunt.
I want to hunt with handguns. If I was allowed to hunt with handguns in Norway - I would sell all my rifles.
You don`t know how lucky you are - who can drive a few miles. But the world will never be just, so the 3rd April I will travel to the other side of the planet again.

poncaguy · « **Reply #14 on:** February 26, 2005, 08:32:26 AM »

! would think the new 460 S&W would be great, also will shoot 45 Long Colt and 454 Casull in it

myronman3 · « **Reply #15 on:** February 26, 2005, 10:16:56 AM »

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...You don`t know how lucky you are...

why not leave and come over here with the rest of us. we can always use a fellow handgun afficiando around. besides, with all the hard-headed norwegians running around here, you would fit right in.

maybe someday when the deer numbers recover, you could come over and hunt. right now the wildlife managers have our herd screwed up.

Sverre A. · « **Reply #16 on:** February 26, 2005, 11:48:59 AM »

I should like to share a Oryx-story with you - and a couple of pictures - if the moderator allow it. Then you may understand my concern about handguns and limits. I have shot some animals with the 454, but after this well-placed bullet - my doubt was born.

myronman3 · « **Reply #17 on:** February 26, 2005, 03:51:59 PM »

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I should like to share a Oryx-story with you - and a couple of pictures - if the moderator allow it.

i dont think there is a problem with that. let's hear it...

Sverre A. · « **Reply #18 on:** February 26, 2005, 06:21:33 PM »

How do I post the pictures?

Mikey · « **Reply #19 on:** February 27, 2005, 01:54:07 AM »

Sverre: I would pm Matt and ask him for advice on posting pictures. I think this is an important issue. If your pictures do not show a quick, clean harvest of a large game animal with a pistol or pistol caliber hunting arms then this is the sort of a limitation handgun hunters need to know about.

I like hunting with handguns. It is just as if not more enjoyable than rifle hunting. But Friend, there are limits to what handguns will do. This past Autumn I encountered some Bison on a guided hunt. It had been a long number of years since I had seen an American Bison at close enough distance to consider a handgun shot and although my 44 magnum was stoked with heavy loads I knew that if one of those big boys took a dislike to me I would have been eating Bison bottom hoof before the 44s took effect.

There are limits to handgun effectiveness in the field. Some shots defy credibility yet the proof is there. Other times we wish for a large bore rifle. I hope Matt can help you with posting your pictures. Mikey.

AfricanHandgunner · « **Reply #20 on:** February 28, 2005, 03:43:06 AM »

Sverre, I have hunted Africa with handguns, and have numerous 1 shot kills. My eland was taken with my 375 JDJ and went only about 40 yards. I doubt a rifle would have done any better. You better check the new South African firearm regs before planning a handgun hunt there. No handgun calibers over 45, no semi autos, gun must be "custom made for hunting" ie. TC, XP100, ect. They have made bringing in any revolver almost impossible. :cry: Unless these regulations change, handgunning South Africa will be a thing of the past pretty soon.

AfricanHandgunner · « **Reply #21 on:** February 28, 2005, 03:55:29 AM »

Mikey, I forgot to reply to your post :roll: My PH in Africa has video of a hunter hitting a cape buff 5 times with a 460 Weatherby rifle and the bull still went a couple hundered yards. A properly loaded handgun of sufficient caliber will kill anything that roams the planet dead-PERIOD. Take your time and make a proper shot. Large caliber rifles are not a subsitute for poor bullet placement. I would have no qualms in using my 375 JDJ or 416 GNR on dangerous game. In fact I am planning a cape buff hunt for 2006 with my handguns.

Sverre A. · « **Reply #22 on:** February 28, 2005, 04:02:05 AM »

Where are you planning your buff-hunt?

Sverre A. · « **Reply #23 on:** February 28, 2005, 04:04:00 AM »

"only about 40 yards"
What distance did you shoot at? What bullet?

AfricanHandgunner · « **Reply #24 on:** February 28, 2005, 09:09:34 AM »

Sverre, I am planning my Buff hunt in Zimbabwe. The eland was shot at 90 yards using Hornady 270 grain SP's.

Sverre A. · « **Reply #25 on:** March 03, 2005, 10:48:18 PM »

How can I post the wordfile with 2 pictures of the Oryx - which was badly hurt from my 325 gr. in 454?
I should like to hear other experienced hunters opinion about it.