Author Topic: Lee 309-180r (Read 856 times)

Longcruise · « **on:** June 27, 2005, 12:31:20 PM »

Finally had a chance to throw some bullets from my latest Lee mold, the 309-180r. Now for my question, has anybody pushed this bullet or a similar one to 2200 fps or more with the Lee liquid alox lube?

Am wondering how much this lubem can handle? These will be shot from my nef 30-30 handi rifle, hopefully fast enough to make a deer load.

jh45gun · « **Reply #1 on:** June 27, 2005, 06:14:16 PM »

You would be better off with the C309-170-F. Flat nose cast bullets work best for hunting. The round nose ones do not expand and slip right on through. I know from expirience I shot a buck and a doe last year with my 308 loaded with cast bullets the buck I shot first and the bullet went through to the other side and we found it in the hide after it never expanded ane Luckly I got the deer after I shot it again in the neck at close range. It was hurt bad but I sure was not impressed with on how the bullets acted. I came home and filed a flat that night to match the mould I had just gotten with a flat on in in 30 cal a Ideal 311407. The next deer I shot was with the flat nosed bullet a doe and It really did the job on it. From now on all my hunting bullets with be flat nose. If you do not want to buy a other mould look at some pics of flat nose bullets and with a caliper to keep the lengh the same file flats on them for hunting. Jim

jh45gun · « **Reply #2 on:** June 27, 2005, 06:22:54 PM »

Longcruise Forgot to add the loads I was shooting were 19 grains of 2400 which I figured would give me 1800 FPS or there abouts. Thats really enough as the doe I shot I could not have done any better than with a full strength jacketed load. I think the same would have been with the buck it I would have been using a flat nose on him.

Longcruise · « **Reply #3 on:** June 28, 2005, 06:34:00 AM »

Thanks for sharing that info. What was the alloy you used for the castings?

I'm hoping to go with air cooled and aged 2 wks wheel weights. Should be settled at about 12 BHN. Expansion was the reason I was seeking 2200 fps. My thinking was that impact velocities of 1900 to 2200 should expand the wheel weights. Was also thinking of casting with a pure lead soft point. That should assure expansion down to about 1400 or 1500 fps. The weak link in the 2200 though is most likely going to be the lube and the lee alox is so dang easy and conveniant it would be my first choice if it will work.

I have a bit over 60 of these so I guess I'll do thirty with lee alox and 30 with wiped on LBT blue each with a progressive powder charge and head for the range with the chrono.

Thanks for your thoughts on this and if you have any more ideas please post em!

jh45gun · « **Reply #4 on:** June 28, 2005, 01:35:30 PM »

THese bullets I got at a estate sale of a old gunsmith. I figure they were wheel weights though as they scratched about as easy as the wheel weights I casted myself. The flat nose really makes the difference in expansion and it does not take much either. Jim

Longcruise · « **Reply #5 on:** June 28, 2005, 02:05:11 PM »

Jim, thanks, was hoping you knew what they were made of. 1800 fps is pretty slow for any hunting load that needs to expand unless it's pure lead.

jh45gun · « **Reply #6 on:** June 28, 2005, 08:58:28 PM »

No with the flat tip they will expand at that velocity. Jim

Badnews Bob · « **Reply #7 on:** June 29, 2005, 01:18:44 PM »

What if you tried some pure lead noses on that round? That should help with expansion and still handle the higher speed. I've never done this but I've read about it and I stayed at a Holiday Inn express once.

jh45gun · « **Reply #8 on:** June 29, 2005, 09:12:16 PM »

Some guys have done that but I really do not think it is neccessary. Wheel Weights are not that hard and if you have a flat nose bullet it will expand at lower velocities. Jim

Longcruise · « **Reply #9 on:** June 30, 2005, 04:28:59 AM »

I'd like to do some expansion testing on the various alloys and nose shapes. Unfortunately it's a time consuming operation and I just don't have the time for it along with all the set up etc.

I hear about guys testing in wet phone books and that's just fine if you have a bunch of phone books. :grin: Also wet newspaper but by the time I save enough up the season will be over.

Leftoverdj · « **Reply #10 on:** June 30, 2005, 05:15:08 AM »

I've pushed the Lyman 311411 past 2000 fps in a .308 while using Liquid Alox. You're OK on the lube.

The easy way to get a mepat on an RN WW bullet is to use the pedestal from a Lee sizer to force it into a seater die that has a SWC top punch in it. If it affects anything but the nose, the difference is too small for me to detect it. You can do a hundred in 15 minutes.

Longcruise · « **Reply #11 on:** June 30, 2005, 01:38:34 PM »

DJ, thanks for that tip! If I can get them going at 2200 fps or better and then keep them flying straight with the flattened points, then I'll go ahead and do that.

tom barthel · « **Reply #12 on:** July 02, 2005, 06:03:45 AM »

I have pushed the lee c309-170f to just around 2400 fps with No leading. I use only lee liquid alox lube. I have decided to back off a bit on speed to try for greater accuracy. I usually just load and shoot. I write the loads on a card and don't usually keep the card after the ammo is gone. I melt seven pounds of wheel weights with three pounds of VERY soft lead. My bhn is 12-13. Shooting wet paper suggests the bullet will PROBABLY expand in game. I load this bullet in .30-30, .30-40, and .308. NO leading in any of the barrels.

Good luck and God bless.

Tom

Longcruise · « **Reply #13 on:** July 02, 2005, 01:20:33 PM »

Maybe I should try mixing some pure lead into the WW? Well, one thing at a time!