1891 argentino more ?

[Gun Runner]

Still havant gotten it to the gun smith to check cal. Mauser Modelo Argentino 1891 Manf. Loewe Berlin 7 m/m M(with what looks like a degree sign next to it) B. Blindee stamped on same line. Has a crown over R Looks like a griffon(sp) PV, Star on top of an A, Ring with crown with the letter L E G inside, with the E being above the L and G, underneath is a star. Letters M B in scroll with the M over the B. Left side of the receiver has the clasped hands. Ser nr# E80xx, stock has stamped # 6830. Bottom of mag is stamped F8836. This one cocks on closing. Bad part is "Bubba" owned it at one time and "Bubbatized It" My orig gunsmith moved, and the nearest one is 2 1/2 hrs away, in a direction I never seem to travel. I have fired several 7x57 rounds thru it, tied to a big tire and a LONG cord. Cases showed no spliting or anything. Cases measured out the same as out of my 93 mausers.
What makes me curious is the 7 m/m stamping on the bbl. that it would be a 7x57. BBL is a military type bbl (steped down). The bbl is defently newer than the receiver. Any body got any ideas?

Gun Runner

[John Traveler1]

Gun Runner,

The "Argentine" model 1891 Mauser is usually found in 7.65 Argentine caliber, but was also re-barreled or factory original in other calibers.  It was called the Argentine model because that was the major customer that gave mauser it's biggest (?) order at the time.

That 7x57 barrel with the markings you've described show that it is a Belgian manufactured and proofmarked military barrel, originally made for the M1893 and M1895 Mausers.  The markings indicate Liege manufacture, the center of the Belgian gun making industry.

The threaded shank is standard Mauser, and fits the M1891.  Probably fitted as part of the "bubbaized" work, but POSSIBLY original!  I remember reading from some very knowledgeable folks that the Orange Free State (Boers) during the 1898-1901 Boer war purchased and used many rebarreled M1891 rifles in 7x57mm.

While functional, I'd be very careful about firing that M1891 with military surplus 7x57 ammo.  That model lacks the strength and safety refinements of the later mausers.

If you care to post or email pictures we will gladly help you further research this piece.

HTH
John

[gunnut69]

The '91 is a well built rifle and probably as strong as any mauser.  It's most serious lacking is it's handling of gases from a pierced primer or a ruptured case.  Usually a large part of it ends up in the users face and eyes.  Very Very bad indeed.  The '91 uses an extractor similar in function to the sako or m16 extractors in that it is pivoted in the face of the bolt.  It does NOT block gas escape and rotates with the bolt.  The bolt shroud doesn't have the gas stop lip and escape holes for leaking gas are small or none existant.  That said the rifle you have, shile it should be checked for headspace, is likely safe for limited use.  Modern US commercial 7x57 ammo is loaded to lower pressures for the '93/'95 type rifles.  If the crest on the receiver has not been ground off it's greatest worth may be in use as a donor in restoring a military configuration '91 that has had it's crest ground off the receiver ring.  The early mausers are all pretty much made in the same way.  The action is case hardened mild steel. Some of the copies were made of different materials.  They will usually set the locking lugs back before any catistrophic failure.  In other words the rifle will become unusable before blowing up..

[S.S.]

Crest on barrel is not Argentine for sure,
Post a picture of the receiver.

[S.S.]

Forgot something,
The Belgian 7.65x53 is different than the 7.65x53
Argentine. The Shoulder angle is different and the
case head is a tiny bit larger diameter.
Also, The Orange Free State Mausers I have seen
have all been stamped O.V.S. in the side of the receiver.
This is a nice historic weapon if you have one.
The Germans Backed the Boers to piss off the British
and they made sure the Brits. knew where the Boer
weapons came from so they were well marked.
The Boers tore up the Brits. pretty
bad with those Mausers because they used smokeless
powder and the Brits. could not tell where the Boer
trench works were. The British were still using semi smokeless
propellant at that time.
I am a History Fanatic as well as a firearms fanatic, I
love this stuff.