.45/70 for beginner?

[hazey]

hey all,

I am new to gun hunting and looking to purchase my first riffle/shotgun.  I have been impressed by all the good said here and elsewhere about NEF/H&R singleshots, and really like the barrel program and the prices are really reasonable.

I am looking for a gun that will allow me to hunt for deer this fall, but will also offer some versatility to hunt other game in different seasons.  This is why I am looking at the NEF/HR systems.  

I originally thought of getting the Topper Classic deluxe shotgun with interchangeable chokes... however the local pawn shop has an NEF .45/70 in my price range with a scope mounted (not sure what type).  The barrel of this gun looks small and might be smaller than the 22" on the factory models.

I live in GA, and would mostly be hunting in shorter rifle distances... my major question is whether a .45/70 is a good rifle to start shooting with?  I have only shot shotguns before, but am responsible (taken hunting safety class and bowhunter)... I am average build and athletic adult.

  Any comments or advice is welcome.

[AZ223]

Welcome!  
I voted Yes, with some hesitation: The .45-70 can thump you pretty good, but those with access to relaoding or who can buy lighter loads would do okay with one. It's an excellent cartridge out to about 150-175yds, then the trajectory begins to drop off more rapidly after that. Others here have experimented with different loads; obviously the hotter loads (~2000fps) will shoot a bit flatter, but tend to beat you up pretty good. The slower loads (~1300fps) most people can shoot all day, but the trajectory is more like a .22lr  The recoil is more an issue at the range, especially off a bench. When hunting, most don't remember the recoil or even the shot.

As far as barrel length, I think H&R only offered the 45-70 in 22", not including the Buffalo Classic which is 30 or 32". They tend to look a lot shorter because you don't have the extra 4-5" of action between the barrel and receiver, which also makes them lighter to carry. My .223 has a 24" barrel, and looks like 20".

Good luck, and if you get it, let us know how it shoots!

[Dr. A]

Go get it!  I love mine, and am amazed it took me so long to catch on.  There are limitations to the cartridge for sure, but it can be used for anything.  If not a handloader, I highly recommend starting with a good plinker.  Its the PMC Cowboy load.  It has a 405gr. cast bullet going about 1200fps, and is effective killer and mild on the shoulder.  It will allow you to learn to handle your gun before you get into the higher velocity/higher pressure cartridge loadings.  My very young son (6yrs), can handle a 405gr. 1100fps load in this gun, and is quite accurate with it.

[Savage .250]

Single shot weapon is not for me nor  would the 45/70 be my first choice
  in a weapon. That`s just me so who cares.
   In your case The H&R/NEF "system" might be the ticket though.
   As their ad says.... What ever your quarry, from squirrel to buffalo,
   H&R/ NEF has exactly the caliber for you.
   Looks like lots of guys have-um so that speaks well for the "system".
   Might want  to shoot one of those 45/70`s before you buy to see what you think.

  " The best part of the hunt is not the harvest but in the experience."

[bajabill]

If I were in your current situation, I say no.  Especially if you only reaon for choosing it is because it is there.  The 45/70 is special, look into it and its history.  If then you are impressed by it (you will be), get the buffalo classic version.

But for my first, and maybe only rifle, I would choose something more conventional, for lack of another word.  The 45/70 is more than adequate for your needs of course, most cartridges are in actuallity, but just not the first thing to come to mind for your situation.  Hopefully, you have time to explore other options and decide.  Just my thoughts however.

You do know that you can get multiple barrels for these guns  

[Haywire Haywood]

I voted no.  You'd be better off with a 308 I think.  Recoil will be much less, so you would be more likely to practice with it.  The 45-70 off a bench can be downright abusive depending on the load you buy.  There is nothing in Ga that warrants the punch that a 45-70 has to offer.  It is a fun caliber, I have one and a Buffalo Classic reamed out to 45-90 too but if you plan on this being your main rifle, I'd have to recommend the 308 instead.

Ian

[hazey]

You do know that you can get multiple barrels for these guns  [/quote]

Yeah, the multiple barrel program is what really impressed me about the NEF/HR's.  Especially that you can get shotgun barrels.  I don't think it would be worth the money to get the gun and then buy another barrel to learn on though.  

Thanks for your advice  :-)

[sureshot2040]

hey pard
what part of ga you in??
im in athens
there is a nice pawnshop in d'ville that has a big selection of handis and he has some good prices on em to
i love my 45-70 and you probably would to but if this was gonna be my first deer rifle purchase i would say go with a 30-30 or a 308  probably the 30-30 cause ammo is a little cheaper than 308 at wally world
that is if you dont reload  :grin:
sureshot

[hazey]

Sureshot.

I'm also in Athens.  The gun I was looking at was at the Athens pawn on Hawthorne.  I think I will continue to look around for a better starter after all the advice.

I may have just gotten too excited by the price.  I will look further into other options, and am still thinking about the topper shotgun for now... although if I start with a NEF/HR shotgun then I limit myself from buying riffle barrels down the line....

Where in danielsville is the shop your talking about?

Thanks!

[JPH45]

I grew up in Commerce, lived in and around Athens for more than a few years, had a place in Colbert before moving over here. I worked for Franklins back in the early '90's, when Frank was still alive, was doing business there when he was on Hawthorne, and remember when he was operating out of his basement.

As to a 45-70, you'll probably like it, and like it alot. Nothing like the trill of thumping on both ends. Shot lots of 45-70 back in my youth, when I didn't have near the brains nor sensitivity to pain I have now. Another way of looking at it, there ain't nuthin' in Gawga a 45-70 won't kill. I killed three deer with a Browning 1885 45-70. I'd say get the 45-70 and then after season is over, send off for a 30-30/308 barrel or get one of those and have yourself two guns to have fun with.

[35Rem]

I would say "No" to the 45-70 to start with.  It will have a pretty good amount of recoil in anything but the Cowboy and Remington 405 gr Factory load.  I would look for a NEW 30-30.  I say new because H&R is offering a $20 rebate on new guns.  Walmart sells em for $200 plus tax.  I said the 30-30 because it's cheap ($8-10 per box), effective and rimmed.  You won't have ejection/extraction problems with the rimed cartridge, as opposed to a rimmless like the .308. (By the way I love a .308, but the rimmless cartridges my be a turn off for a new guy IF there are problems with ejection.)

If you like the gun in general, then I suggest you move up in caliber, not the other way around.  

The 30-30 is plenty of cartridge to start out with.  You can add other Rifle OR Shotgun Barrels to this frame.  You can't add rifle barrels to a shotgun frame, so I wouldn't necessarily buy the shotgun first.

Hope this helps.  Don't be afraid to ask more questions.

[Mac11700]

I say...Absolutly YES...it is a wonderful cartridge...it can be loaded for just about anything you want it to.The cowboy loads are extremly mild...and the heavy loads...well those are best reseverd till your use to the gun...and have put a great recoil pad on it.

The amazing thing about them in a Handi...it's one of the most consistant performers out of the box...and the regular factory loads for it with the gun stock(as it comes) is about what a 1-1/4oz. field load from a good 870 kicks like...yes...it's a-little stout for some who are recoil shy...but that shouldn't worry you any...it can be tamed...with a little lead shot in the butt-stock and a Limbsaver recoil pad...which I suggest you either install yourself...or have installed..it helps with all of the Handis that have a fair amount of recoil...also...add a neoprene shell holder to the stock...and a thin piece of dense foam...like Rubatex under it..it will stop the cheek slap and pain...I do this on all of my Handi's...

For ranges up to 175 yards...the normal factory offerings is more than adiquate for any whitetails around...and the beauty of is you can get much much heavier and faster loadings for it.

Are there better cartridges...sure...but...I wouldn't hesitate telling someone  to get one for their first adult rifle..

Mac

[sureshot2040]

hazey
go to d'ville, go around the courthouse and out towards royston staying on 29. steves place is the next to the last place on the left before you get to the redlight where 98 crosses 29. not even a half a mile past the d'ville courthouse
sureshot

[.308]

I voted yes, like some have said there's nothing here in GA the 45-70 won't handle and sides you may wanna take it outside of GA and it should handle most anything on this continent.

It can go from mild to wild (speaking of recoil). The factory 300 gr. rounds are pretty tame, at least they are to me. But if you want wild then you need to try some 500+ gr. cast bullet handloads and you will know what wild is. Mine is a synthetic stocked handi with aperture sights, don't weigh much, and like HH said is 'downright abusive' off the bench. First time I shot it with those cast loads off the bench I wet my pants and forgot who I was for about an hour. :eek:  :-D

[WashPa]

I agree with sureshot 2040 and 35Rem.  Get yourself a 30-30-ammo is inexpensive and available everywhere and a 30-30 won't beat you up at the range.  Hunt with it this fall then send it in for a 45-70 barrel.  You'll probably want to consider a .22 caliber barrel while you're at it!

[RemingtonMagnum]

Yes get the 45/70 it is a fantastic gun and fun to shoot.

Don Jackson Remington Magnum

[GeorgiaDave]

Hello From Augusta,
   I feel that you would do well with a 45/70 for your first Handi, but I do believe that you would be better served with a .308 or a 30/06. This is because the .30's are far more versatile and not quite as hard on the shoulder to shoot. With my .308 Ultra I can shoot 100,125,150,165,168,180 and 200 grain bullets of varying configurations to cover every type hunting from varmints to the largest game in our region. The 30/06 gives more options even going up to 250 grain bullets due to it's long case. The 45/70 has proven to be an accurate and effective round although not as versatile.With the NEF barrel program, it is inexpensive enough to have several different choices, so go for it !!
Good Luck
Dave