Author Topic: 7mm BR/TPP Preliminary Report  (Read 7365 times)

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Offline PJ Smyth

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7 mm BRis the perfect Centrefire Silhouette Caliber
« Reply #30 on: October 04, 2005, 11:31:18 AM »
Hi Dan  This article helped me tremendously to set up  loads for my new 7mmBR. After testing, I settled on 30.5 of2208 / Varget for the 175 Finn Ram kings and every hit belted them off the stand with some shots middle between the legs and 6" up and pushed the straight off. For Chickens Pigs & Turkey's I used the145 gr Finn's the projectile is exactly the same dimensions as the 175 's but the 175's are double jacketed for better hang time on the rams as they  thump compress and Drive the rams. Anyway back to the 145's I used 29.5 of Bench mark 2 and they Clobbered everything shoving them straight back off the stand.
  I would love to see some photo's on here due to not having precision Shooter in Australia. This site is being monitored by more and more Australian Silhouette  Shooters and we thankyou all for your information. We had our Nationals from the 29of September to the 3rd of October in Varying conditions. Some fine shooting by all grades was seen, especially by the juniors 12-14 years  and 15 up, and thanks to your help and some great advise on practice, follow through  and your load and set up advice I won the B Grade and now move up  aa grade.

Offline PJ Smyth

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7MM BR AtAussie Nationals
« Reply #31 on: October 06, 2005, 01:59:25 AM »
Troy and AJJ i tried to reply to your messages but they kept saying an Invalid Session and lost them 3 times so her goes again. The rifle is a Paul Kovacs design, remington 700 Trued,  flutted 24" True Flight Barrel (NZ), pesco 3 lever Trigger length of pull adjustable,in a HS Precision PSC14 Thumbhole Silhouette stock that felt perfect.
The loads where as Dan had advised  for 175 and 145 Finn HPBT  Both projectiles are exactly the sane dimensions with the 175 's double jacketed for longer compression and hang time on the target I set up the Redding Seater for the 175 and it was perfect for the 145's as well.
I worked  the loads up to where the bullet holes stop rising as I checked the primmers pitting, started at 32.5 of 2208 in cold windy and rainey conditions.  So I worked back to 31 with not pitting and then came back .5 to allow for the weather to heat up on the sunday as was forecast. I did the same with the 145's. On peper on Sunday morning at 100, 200, 300 both 175 and 145 had 3 leaf clover groups I was rapt. After checking the setting on the sunday i had to come back two clicks on Rams  one on windage to the bull, and one back for c/p/t. I shot at two Rams with the 145's in the middle of the body and they fell well. Next I shot the 175's and aimed at the pizzle and a black splat  as it shoved it backwards with the head and the top of the body hitting the two stands so I know it push it straight back  the next was 3" Higher same again splat  and shoved it backwards and the last another 3''to 6'' Higher al still below half way up the body. The 7mm BR was a gem to shoot and the feel of the 175's with 30.5 of 2208 / Varget was a slightly nicer feel than the quicker powder Bench mark 2 so I am going to do some testing for the 145's with the 2208/ Varget and see how tight it is. I had quite a few people interested in how it went and felt so They were all invited to shoot a few rounds  one of the testers was a women who  just  missed the first Ram and clobbered the next two her and her husbands comments where wow thats beautiful. So once again Thankyou  Paul Kovacs and Dan for your help and advise in helping me win my first Nationals in centrefire. Regards Phill

Offline ajj

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7mm BR/TPP Preliminary Report
« Reply #32 on: October 06, 2005, 03:02:46 AM »
I have mentioned before that I'm a fan of Finn bullets. The 145 takes rams with excellent (but not perfect) reliability at 2530 fps from my 7BR and the Finn 123 at 2500 is VERY accurate, has a high BC and drives pigs and turkeys HARD off the rails with what amounts to a moderate pressure load. Looks like I'm going to have to try some 175's. My rifle has a short throat so the bullet is deep in the case and I'll be surprised if I can get over about 2250 fps, but nothing ventured...
Thanks, Phill, and congratulations.

Offline Troy G

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7mm BR/TPP Preliminary Report
« Reply #33 on: October 10, 2005, 06:51:25 PM »
Dan,

Is your 7mm barrel from Shilen a special order barrel or has Shilen just not updated there barrel twist?  I just checked the Shilen site and they do not list a 1/8 twist in 7mm.  I tried emailing them as well about this and have yet to get a response.

Just curious.

Offline DanDeMan

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7mm BR/TPP Preliminary Report
« Reply #34 on: October 11, 2005, 07:35:59 AM »
Troy,

Marvin Pearson ordered the Shilen 8-twist, 7mm barrel so he is the one to ask the question of.  The rifle is not mine.  Jared Perry is the proud owner.  I designed the 7mm BR / TPP reamer and did the barrel break-in and load development.
All the best,

Dan Theodore

Offline Troy G

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7mm BR/TPP Preliminary Report
« Reply #35 on: October 11, 2005, 02:42:21 PM »
I apologize if my last question offended either you, Dan, or you, Marv, as this certainly was not my intention.  I just do not see where Shilen lists their 1/8 twist in 7mm.  http://www.shilen.com/#

I was not trying to discredit either one of you in any way.

Offline DanDeMan

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7mm BR/TPP Preliminary Report
« Reply #36 on: October 11, 2005, 02:50:26 PM »
Troy,

No offense taken.  It was a reasonable question.  Maybe Marvin will let us know how he ordered the barrel and if it was a custom order.
All the best,

Dan Theodore

Offline Metalhead

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7mm BR/TPP Preliminary Report
« Reply #37 on: October 11, 2005, 03:27:35 PM »
Ok Troy...there is nothing special going on here...the barrel for the now infamous 7mm BR TPP is nothing more than a # 5 contour Shilen Select Match Stainless steel barrel...

7mm bore diameter with an 8 twist barrel....I finished it off at 26 " just so Nomad could question the finished prodout as being way to much weight forward and never win a big match.......

My point... for three years in a row...what machinist has built the rifles that have won the U.S. Nat's in High Power Hunter Rifle ?....

As Pharr as it's not a custom barrel, look closely at the Shilen website and you see that it is a standard offering....What else can I say ?....Marv

Offline Tony Tello

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7mm BR/TPP Preliminary Report
« Reply #38 on: October 12, 2005, 05:25:14 AM »
Hello every one, I called Shilen this morning to ask if they make 7mm barrels with 8 twist and the answer was yes!

Offline nomad

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7mm BR/TPP Preliminary Report
« Reply #39 on: October 12, 2005, 06:14:19 AM »
How the heck did I get involved in this thread? :eek:
E Kuney

Offline Metalhead

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7mm BR/TPP Preliminary Report
« Reply #40 on: October 12, 2005, 03:02:36 PM »
Hi Ernie...you got involved because, like I told you before...I think you are a very nice man...a guy with some very keen insight to the sport...which I like very much...Plus...I like the way you make short work over a piece of fried chicken....M.

Offline nomad

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7mm BR/TPP Preliminary Report
« Reply #41 on: October 12, 2005, 03:31:58 PM »
Marvin,

You need to talk to Imas...   :wink:
E Kuney

Offline DanDeMan

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7mm BR/TPP Preliminary Report
« Reply #42 on: October 13, 2005, 03:45:35 PM »
OK All,

Several that read this site have asked me what I'd build if I was to design the ultimate 7mm HP Hunter silhouette rifle.  Well, it would not be much different than the one MetalHead built for Jared Perry, a 7mm BR/TPP.

The Pearson/Perry rifle is pretty close to optimum for me and should be about optimum for MOST.  What I mean by that is barrel heaviness.  The use of a # 5 contour barrel with a very light stock like the Pharr Hunter HP and Ti Remington action means one can place about 1 lb of weight were ever they like to make the rifle hold just right for them.

I'd like a # 5.5 counter at 26" with an 8 oz recoil suppressor in the butt stock, which is what I've got for my Brown Precision Kevlar stocked, Ti Rem actioned rifle.

If one uses the steel Remington Short Action they probably need to go with the # 5 contour even if they have a light stock for Hunter HP.
All the best,

Dan Theodore

Offline DanDeMan

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7mm BR/TPP Preliminary Report
« Reply #43 on: October 17, 2005, 09:50:31 AM »
Greetings,

A few days ago DaveI and I were discussing the 7mmBR / TPP cartridge for HP Hunter Class.  We digressed to Dave’s 7mm TCU, which he shot for years back in the late 80’s and early 90’s.  I believe that timeframe is correct, if not Dave can correct as needed.  Anyway, Dave shot that “dinky” cartridge launching the 168 Sierra MK’s at rams and the 130 Sierra MK’s at CPT’s.

Bullet selection was not very good back then from a high BC perspective.  The Sierra 168 MK has a BC of about 0.485, a bit on the low side for trying to nail rams in windy conditions.  The 130 Sierra MK could reasonably be called atrocious from a BC perspective as that low of a BC has a most deleterious affect on one’s attempt to hit turkeys due to wind deflection issues.  The BC of the 130 Sierra MK is around 0.380 if my memory serves me well.  We are talking about a tough time at turkeys if there is any wind blowing about on the range.  At 7mm TCU MV’s the 175 Sierra MK has a 0.600 BC while the 139 SST Hornady has a BC in the neighborhood of about 0.495 when launched at 2,400 fps.  One could also consider shooting the 175 Sierra MK’s at about 1,800 fps for the short line.  That would give better wind performance than the 139 SST’s and very mild recoil of about 6.5 ft-lbs.  A typical 260 launching the 107 MK to 2,700 fps has a recoil of about 7.1 ft-lbs and the slow TCU round would not leave any pigs standing when hit.

Now, however, with the improved selection of high BC bullets from Sierra and Hornady the 7mm TCU is sounding very interesting when an 8-twist barrel is used.

My SWAG at projected MV’s for the very nice 175 Sierra MK’s is about 2,225 to 2,250 fps using a full case of VarGet or N140.  That will produce a terminal momentum at the ram line of about 1.22 ft-lbs, well above most 260 ram loads and my, my, my, would the recoil be mild.  We are talking about a ram-load recoil of about 9 ft-lbs compared to the average 260 load of about 12 ft-lbs out of 9 lb rifles.  Out of a Standard rifle at full weight the recoil would be about 8 ft-lbs.  Of course one could down load the 175 MK ram load for even more reduced recoil.  I’d say that even at 2,000 fps the 175 MK would still have a very high ram knockdown rate.

For CPT the very fine 139 Hornady SST would be launchable to about 2,400 fps, plenty for fine work on the short line.

Given that there is now factory brass for the 7mm TCU and that it has been chambered in rifles for years, T/C rifles, it would seem to be an ideal HP Hunter cartridge for the recoil shy shooters out there.  For those girls and boys of yours that are interested in HP Hunter or Standard this just might be the cartridge for them and they are not likely to ring rams either, a frustrating experience for oldsters and youngsters alike.

One caveat though, most 7mm TCU reamers out there were designed for shorter bullets and will not work for the above listed 175 SM bullet, which really make the 7mm TCU a viable contender for top match performance.  A properly designed reamer would need to be ground for HP Silhouette rifle application.
All the best,

Dan Theodore