Author Topic: Avian Flu  (Read 1368 times)

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Offline Brett

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Avian Flu
« on: October 21, 2005, 09:34:37 AM »
TOP OF THE FOLD
Pandemic kills ??? million worldwide...
In recent weeks, news of the latest outbreak of "bird flu" has gained currency in the mass media. Some suggest there is nothing to fear, while others warn that hundreds of millions may be in peril. The truth is that either scenario is possible—which is to say, the real issue is one of probabilities.

The avian viruses exist in nature mainly in bird populations, both wild and domestic. They are constantly mutating, or, in scientific terms, undergoing antigenic drift and shift. Some of these viral changes can infect other species; this includes mutating into a form that can be passed to and, potentially, among humans.

Most avian viruses are not transmissible to humans, and the few that are generally occur where large numbers of birds and humans live in close proximity and contact. Infection is more likely when the virus has mutated into a form that infects other mammals, such as pigs. Conditions favorable to such mutation did exist widely in the Western world but now are found to a much greater degree in Asia. This is particularly the case in China, which is why so many new influenza strains, like the one in question, H5N1 type A influenza, first surface there.

 
Is there nothing to fear, or are hundreds of millions in peril?

H5N1 has been a source of concern since it was first detected in 1997. If it mutates into a form that is highly transmissible among humans, rather than only from direct contact with infected animals, it could set off a pandemic. This is precisely what scientists now think caused the 1918 influenza (Spanish flu) pandemic. World War I accounted for some 16 million military and civilian deaths from 1914 to 1918, but in 1918 alone, there were more than 40 million deaths from influenza. The U.S. saw 600,000 flu deaths that year—roughly the same death toll of the entire Civil War.

Victor Vaughan, Surgeon General of the Army at the time, said in October, 1918, "If the epidemic continues its mathematical rate of acceleration, civilization could easily disappear from the face of the earth within a few weeks." Fortunately, it had run its course in less than a year, having killed off most of its hosts. Notably, the pandemic of 1918 infected mostly those aged 20-40 and spared the young and elderly. The mortality rate was 40 percent for those infected.

American scientists have just revived an active specimen of the 1918 influenza strain for research purposes (our global adversaries have taken note). Rutgers bacteriologist Richard Ebright hopes that this strain does not find its way into the hands of a "disgruntled, disturbed laboratory employee," as may be the case with the military strain of anthrax that found its way into mail circulation shortly after 9/11.

The H5N1 shares some virulence factors with the 1918 strain.

Research on the 1918 influenza genome suggests the H5N1 shares some virulence factors with the 1918 strain, but it is clearly differentiated because the H5N1 infectious rate has remained contained for eight years—accounting for fewer than 100 deaths in that time period.

Johns Hopkins University's Donald Burke, MD, says, "We're seeing lots of these cross-species interactions now in Southeast Asia. I call it 'viral chatter' because it's like the terrorist 'chatter' that goes on over the airwaves and suggests something serious is just around the corner."

Indeed, new studies from the Armed Forces Institute of Pathology, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and Mount Sinai School of Medicine conclude that real trouble may really be just around the corner. Modeling of the H5N1 infectious rate should it become transmissible among humans indicates that the loss of life could be in the hundreds of millions, particularly in Third World populations.

Since 9/11, our nation has undertaken massive civilian and military planning and preparation to enhance our response and recovery capabilities in the event of a catastrophic attack—including an attack utilizing biological WMD. These efforts have collateral benefits for a pandemic of natural origin, as the response and recovery protocols are very similar. But one is left to wonder whether a national response, which must be massive and swift, would be more effective than, say, the national response to Hurricane Katrina?

The disconcerting answer is, maybe.

A pandemic, by comparison, would make Katrina's wrath seem trivial.

President George Bush, himself recovering from substantial criticism (much of it unwarranted) that the central government did a miserable job responding to Katrina, is staying well ahead of the H5N1 potential pandemic curve. He should, given that a pandemic, by comparison, would make Katrina's wrath seem trivial.

Noting that the response and recovery efforts to Hurricane Katrina congealed only after military leaders were deployed to the region, Mr. Bush said this week, "If we had an outbreak somewhere in the United States, do we not then quarantine that part of the country, and how do you then enforce a quarantine?... And who best to be able to effect a quarantine? One option is the use of a military that's able to plan and move."

Of course, there are some constitutional questions regarding the use of military forces in domestic civilian operations. President Bush signed an executive order that, in effect, bypasses the Posse Comitatus Act in the event of a national crisis, though it comports with the U.S. Constitution's Article IV, Section 4 and the Tenth Amendment. (See The Patriot's commentary on new momentum to rescind the Posse Comitatus Act, below.) However, if a pandemic does reach North America, don't expect an outcry about military occupation and quarantine.

The 1918 pandemic ripped apart the basic humanitarian fabric that binds civil society.

John Barry, distinguished visiting scholar at Tulane University's Center for Bioenvironmental Research and author of The Great Influenza: The Epic Story of the Deadliest Plague in History, told researchers this month that, in addition to the mortality outcome of the 1918 pandemic, one of its most alarming features was that it ripped apart the basic humanitarian fabric that binds civil society.

In other words, military deployment will be critical to the success of any response and recovery effort, and continuity of government and commerce.

On average, pandemics have occurred in 40- to 50-year intervals. The Institute of Medicine of the National Academy of Sciences reports, "[A]nother influenza pandemic is possibly inevitable and even overdue."

So, how vulnerable are we now? We are back to the probabilities question. While a pandemic is not likely, we are overdue. Right now, H5N1 is akin to a tropical depression far off in the Atlantic—one with little likelihood of making landfall in the U.S. On the other hand, it could well become a category-five storm that threatens the entire nation.

If H5N1 or a future influenza strain does become highly transmissible among humans, we have far better epidemiological tools to track infectious outbreaks. We also have anti-flu drugs and can develop specific vaccines more quickly. Further, we have isolation protocols and can utilize resources appropriated for bioterrorism response and recovery.

An outbreak could become pandemic before we contained it.

Though it has been suggested that 100 million doses of H5N1 vaccine be stockpiled, this would be both exceedingly expensive and possibly ineffective, depending on the form the virus takes if it becomes highly transmissible. Of course, many thought that improving the levees of New Orleans would have been exceedingly expensive.

There is the theoretical possibility that an outbreak could become pandemic before we are able to contain it, even with all of our improved tools for recognition and response. That possibility is far higher today than in 1918 because population centers are far more dense, and one infected individual can travel halfway around the world in a day—as visitors from Asia and Africa regularly do. That visitor, landing in a major air-traffic hub in the U.S., could pass the infection to hundreds of people who are traveling to other urban centers across the U.S. Within a matter of hours, the nation could have pockets of infected citizens coast to coast.

The bedrock foundation of survival is individual preparedness.

All this having been said, the most effective measure—the bedrock foundation of survival—is individual preparedness. Being prepared is not difficult. The primary means of protection against pandemic infection is sheltering in place. To learn more about preparing your family to shelter in place, link to this Recommended Action Plan for Mitigating the Consequences of Natural or Attack Catastrophe on Your Family and Community. As for when to implement your family preparedness plan, in the words of Benjamin Franklin, "Have you something to do to-morrow; do it to-day."

Quote of the week...
"It will be a race, a race to the death." —Tulane University's John Barry, insisting that governments of industrialized nations should make major improvements to their vaccine-producing infrastructure

Open query...
"[H]ow do we encourage the manufacturing capacity of the country...to be prepared to deal with the outbreak of a pandemic? In other words, can we surge enough production to be able to help deal with the issue?" —President George W. Bush

For the record, the answer, currently, is NO!
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Offline FWiedner

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Avian Flu
« Reply #1 on: October 21, 2005, 11:40:51 AM »
IMO, this whole avian flu scenario is a government orchestrated "Booger-man" story intended to keep the public frightened and off-balance so that further unconstitutional and draconian violations of civil liberties can be put into place.

They are attempting to herd the public into a blind compliance using fear as their weapon.

 :?
They may talk of a "New Order" in the  world, but what they have in mind is only a revival of the oldest and worst tyranny.   No liberty, no religion, no hope.   It is an unholy alliance of power and pelf to dominate and to enslave the human race.

Offline IntrepidWizard

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Avian Flu
« Reply #2 on: October 21, 2005, 12:43:27 PM »
Well now that we have heard from the ignorant allen tx libertarian I guess we don't need to discuss it anymore.Brett I read the same article and am familiar with Pandemic episodes and the Avian Flu will be so withing 16 months and by then the chances of a vaccine are very good ,if not we don't need to go back to the plague of the 15th century when we had the Spanish Flu episode in 1918-19 with over 600,000 dead Americans and millions world wide.
Government is not reason; it is not eloquence; it is force! Like fire, it is
a dangerous servant and a fearful master. -- George Washington

Offline Brett

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Avian Flu
« Reply #3 on: October 21, 2005, 05:13:01 PM »
TM7;

You should get a job writing for Hollywood.   Maybe Michael Moore is looking for a sidekick to help him write his next "documentary" :roll:

What kills me is if we do have a pandemic and there is not enough vaccine available, you will probably be among the first to whine that 'Booosh' didn't do enough to prevent it.  I guess either way he's damned. :x
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Offline FWiedner

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Avian Flu
« Reply #4 on: October 21, 2005, 05:37:12 PM »
Hey Roland, what are they putting in the water in Groveland, CA to make you all such gullible little sheep?

It aint making you look any brighter.  The plague of the 15th century when you had the Spanish flu in 1918?

Was that when George Washington stopped the Cuban missle crisis?

The government just wants to get all the the little hand-wringers in line to pump drugs into them to get them used to doing what they're told in an "emergency".

I'm sure that they'll come up with some exotic swill that will neither cure nor prevent anything other than non-cooperation and continued good health.

You want hundreds of thousands of Americans to die?

Put the federal government in charge.

 :?
They may talk of a "New Order" in the  world, but what they have in mind is only a revival of the oldest and worst tyranny.   No liberty, no religion, no hope.   It is an unholy alliance of power and pelf to dominate and to enslave the human race.

Offline Brett

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Avian Flu
« Reply #5 on: October 21, 2005, 06:03:22 PM »
Quote from: FWiedner

The government just wants to get all the the little hand-wringers in line to pump drugs into them to get them used to doing what they're told in an "emergency".

I'm sure that they'll come up with some exotic swill that will neither cure nor prevent anything other than non-cooperation and continued good health.

 :?


FW;

That's absurd.  The FDA is already treating the meat & produce you get at the grocery store with those drugs.... you aren't getting your food from the grocery store are you FW?  Oh my... :eek:  :-D

P.S.; This little fellow  :arrow:  8) works for the government and he has his eye on you right now!
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Offline dukkillr

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« Reply #6 on: October 21, 2005, 06:38:39 PM »
Trying to argue logical thought with a paranoid fanatic is like wrestling a pig in the mud:  Nobody wins and the pig enjoys it.

Those who have died from the avian flu have shown us that is a very serious disease.  Fortunately it is not yet hearty enough to transfer human to human.  Pray it never does (unless god is a crazy government conspiracy too  :wink: )

Offline Graybeard

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« Reply #7 on: October 22, 2005, 04:16:58 AM »
And I used to think this place was inhabited by ADULTS and folks who were able to follow the GBO rules. This thread proves I was wrong on all counts I guess. It ends NOW and I do not want to see a repeat of this behavior from you folks. You all know better.


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Offline Nixter

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Avian Flu
« Reply #8 on: October 22, 2005, 10:43:10 AM »
Without regards to politics or conspiracy theories.

Perhaps a pandemic (Avian Bird Flu) or a strain of the Ebola virus is what this world needs.

Mother Nature has a way of correcting imbalances. A pandemic or plague might be another trick up her sleeve.

Reduce the human population to where it is no longer straining it's natural resources. A reduction of the world population by an outbreak of some virus would be a good start.

Natural disasters are another population control. Earthquakes, hurricanes etc... All out war is another but less popular means of population control.


I guess what I am saying in short is that a pandemic might be part of THE PLAN. A correction by Mother Nature or God or whatever to balance the population with the resources of this world and perhaps bring the world peoples together.

Am I a fan of the One World Order? No.

Should we look to a bit more cooperation amongst nations and peoples? Yes.

Ok, this post has gotten a bit off my intended track.
Go back to the natures balance thing. That is easier to wrap your head around.


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Offline BamBams

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Avian Flu
« Reply #9 on: October 22, 2005, 10:54:23 AM »
This thing is in China correct?   What are we complaining about then?
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Offline Nixter

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« Reply #10 on: October 22, 2005, 12:05:08 PM »
Bam Bams, international travel is a snap.

Countries outside of the US have lighter restrictions on travel (regarding health) than we do.

One or two carriers of an active virus could spread so quick it would make your head spin.

Chances of a rural chicken farmer traveling to the US? Slim.

Could a person infected with a form of Avian Flu that could jump to humans come to the US or Europe? Yes.

After that who knows.
True, much of this is conjecture and speculation but who knows for sure?

Not trying to sound lke a doomsayer, just looking at what if...


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Offline FWiedner

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« Reply #11 on: October 22, 2005, 12:06:06 PM »
Quote from: BamBams
This thing is in China correct?   What are we complaining about then?


China?

Try to find something in your house that didn't come from China.

This country is saturated with Chinese trade goods, and since China is a most favored nation trading partner, that stream ain't gonna dry up any time soon.

I seem to recall a few history lessons wherein one of the tried methods of reducing the the excess Indian population was infecting blakets with smallpox and then distributing them to said Indians.

Americans can't help but buy Chinese junk, and illegal immigration from China is nearly as bad in Kalifornicate as it is from Mexico.

 :x
They may talk of a "New Order" in the  world, but what they have in mind is only a revival of the oldest and worst tyranny.   No liberty, no religion, no hope.   It is an unholy alliance of power and pelf to dominate and to enslave the human race.

Offline BamBams

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Avian Flu
« Reply #12 on: October 22, 2005, 02:12:30 PM »
I guess you're right Fwed.  I was just thinking, hmmmmm......when there are too many rats, then they get diseased and die - nature's way of handling things....etc etc.  It's not that I wish ill will on the Chinese, but golly, there sure is a lot of them.

I guess I should be thankful that my x-wife made it impossible for me to eat chicken for next 20 years or so?
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Offline Brett

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Avian Flu
« Reply #13 on: October 22, 2005, 03:09:58 PM »
Quote from: Graybeard
And I used to think this place was inhabited by ADULTS and folks who were able to follow the GBO rules. This thread proves I was wrong on all counts I guess. It ends NOW and I do not want to see a repeat of this behavior from you folks. You all know better.


Aw-shucks GB... I think that the verbal sparring on this thread was all meant to be in good natured fun.  I don't believe anyone meant their comments to be taken too serious, at least I didn't.  But you is the man and if you say the sparring ends here you got it.  :D
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