445 supermag carbine conversion

[Nebraska Kelly]

I got the reamer Jeff. Thank you. It will be in the mail on its way back to you on thursday. I am letting my gunsmith do the conversion for me. I have decided to go ALL OUT to make this new 44 mag rifle into a 445sm carbine.  After the rechamber to 445sm the barrel is being cut off to 16 inches. Then the stock is being shortened and the recoil pad put back on. The entire length of the rife will be 27 1/2 inches from muzzel to shoulder. I have decided to keep it open sights. The rear sight is being replaced with a Thomson Center peep sight. The front sight will be the original patridge type that is on the rifle.  The rear swivel stud is being put back on. The muzzel will be target crowned. This is going to be one cute little rifle with a big punch. I am also having the barrel slugged while he has the gun. I will order the 290gr bullets from beartooth once I know the true diameter of the rifle bore.  I will be ordering brass from starline in a few weeks when I can afford to spend more money. They want around a hundred bucks for 250 pieces. I will be looking for everyones load developement over the next few weeks to get an idea where to start. The entire cost so far to me is   Rifle $210   Gunsmith work $150  Reamer $15
That is $375 for a powerful little rifle. I will have the only one on the block.
I will post pictures of the rifle when I get it back. That will be in 3 weeks. It will be a month or two before I have time to load for and shoot this gun. I will post my results when I get that done.  I will let you know if it was a wise idea to make it this small or not.  I dont know if recoil will be an issue or not. I am expecting to develope a load with the 270gr or 290gr bullets at 2000fps. I would be happy with that.  Who knows? Maybe this is a mistake. But if it works out as I and my gunsmith expect it will be a great little gun.

Kelly

[Ditchdigger]

I'm not sure about this,but I think the minumum length for a rifle is 32".You might check this out before you shorten it. The BTF might be at your door asking about it.   Digger

[Markus]

I thought minumum barrel length was 16  and overall had to be greater than 26". I am be no means and expert though.

[Datil]

Barrel lenth for a rifle must be 16 inches, If  I was cutting a barrel
 But ( I ain't) I'd make 16 1/2 inched. Shot gun must be over 18 in.
 over all length needs to be over 26 inches. Marv.

[Nebraska Kelly]

The barrel can be no shorter than 16in and the overall length must be 26in or more. My gunsmith and I tried diffrent stock lengths and at 27 1/2 inchs overall it felt perfect for me. He did say that he wont make them shorter than 27 just to be on the safe side of things. Also barrel will actually be 16 1/8 inches. That was my idea just to be on the safe side.  I like the idea of a short handi rifle. I know everyone is talking about wanting 24 and 26 inch barrels. But not for me. I find the barrel lenght of 22 inches to be all I want. But I am not looking for every fps out of my rifles.  This little carbine should not lose that much velocity over a 22 inch barrel. I am guessing around 150 fps or less.  I can live with a 2000fps load. My only concern is will the recoil then become an issue. Well its to late to think about that now. The deed is done. I did go online to midway and bought 100 rounds of brass. I should be able to shoot this thing in about 3 weeks. Everything should be done by then. I will chrony the loads. Should be interesting.

[Datil]

nebraska Kelly I'll bet a 16inch barrel will  be a loud mouth.
 Sure hope you report back after you shoot the little bugger :eek:
 It sure made a Handi rifle for a truck gun Best of Luck.
 Marv.

[Ditchdigger]

I guess whoever told me 32" was the minumum was wrong. I had a 243 that had a 17.5" barrel and a survivor stock and it measured 31.5" and he said that it was 1/2" to short for minumum spec's.   Digger

[mt3030]

Kelly:
I agree with you on barrel lengths. I have a 18.5 barrel on my 30-30 SB2 Carbine and in the past have had several 16.5s on Contenders. I have never missed the extra lengths.

Wally

[Markus]

I have a 16.5" .223 barreled handi that is great to carry and though I havent really shot it enough yet to atest to it's accuracy it ventilated a few beer cans pretty well.

[Sourdough]

A few years ago I wanted a short little carbine to carry when down on the coast.  Down there the alders and willows are pretty thick and it rains almost alo the time.  I had a Mauser action, so I sent it off to Shaw and had them put an 18 inch barrel chambered for .35 Whelen.  I dropped it in a Bell and Carlson stock.  So far I've used it to kill two Moose, and one grizzly (an emergency shot) and have not missed the velocity that I am supposed to lose.  I don't think the bear or the moose missed it either.

[Nebraska Kelly]

Hello everyone. I will let you all know how this project turns out. I have no reservations about anything I have done to the rifle exept maybe keeping it open sighted. Although I am able to shoot a good peep sight pretty well. Considering the range limits of the cartridge it should be ok. With a 300gr beartooth bullet at as close to 2000fps as I can get it   this will be an absolute SLEDGE HAMMER of a carbine. I expect that veloicity should be easily achiveved in 16 inches of barrel since the 445 was designed for a six or eight inch barrel. As an emergency gun it should be worth its weight to carry. I expect it would shoot completely through anything I point it at. Even big mean bitey scratchy things. Heard a member say that on this sight and liked the sound of it. But it is true. This will be a very powerful little carbine.  I will be able to load it down and make it a gun my kids will enjoy or load it up to get some real protection from it. I may be moving to Denver in a few months and this would be a great little close elk gun.   When I get the gun back in about 10 days I will develope a load and test it for accuracy and speed. If it works out GREAT. If it dosnt I will tell you that too. But one thing is for sure this could be one fun gun to play with.  I was hunting in northern minnesota about 18 years ago and came across a HUGE grey muzzled black bear sitting in the tree next to my tree stand. I walked up under it and (like an inexperienced fool) I stood right under the tree and shot an arrow with a small rather poor broadhead (90 gr wasp) into it. I have never seen anything move so fast after that. This huge bear came down the tree breaking off branches six inches across. It hit the ground and ran right past me. I could not have stopped it if it had attacked me. It ran into the alders bordering the swamp. I went to the truck and got my colt trooper mark 3 pistol with 8 3/8 barrel in 357 mag and went back to the swamp and started following the blood. I could not see more than five feet in front of me. After going about 20 feet I realized this was not a smart thing to do. I started thinking about the reports of bears turning on the people tracking them. I decided that 357mag was not going to be any real protection. So I got out of there. I was thinking of this event when I put this little carbine project together. Little gun with big power.  This gun will be of such a handi size that I will be able to take it everywhere. I would rather have this little thing waiting in my truck or taken apart and put in my pack than take nothing. Most of the time I dont need a gun when I am out in the woods. But since this will be easy to carry I will have it with me now.   I sure liked the looks of that laminated green stock 30-30 carbine you have there MT3030.  Now cut about 3 inches off the stock and you will have an idea of what mine will look like.  I will be posting pictures for you to see when I get in back in about 10 days.  I was wondering if any of you think this is a worthwhile project? I havnt really gotten the feel for whether you like it or not.  I know it is only important that I like it but it really sparked my imagination and I thought there would be some real enthusiasm for it out there as a unique way of modifying a handi in 44 mag.

[MtJerry]

As you may have already noticed, several of us recently took on the 445 Super Mag as a project just a few months ago.  As a part of that group, and someone who has taken game with it already, I'd say you are on the right track.

Those of us using 22" barrels and 30gr. bullets are getting just under 2000fps now.  With 265gr. bullets we are getting right at 2050fps.

For the application you have described, and going on the data JHP45 came up with in velocity vs. bullet weight in a 1:38 twist barrel, I'd stick with the 265gr. bullets.

I amd SERIOUSLY considering an attempt at an Elk with this cartridge and a 265gr. Beartooth WFN bullet.  If I can get a shot under 200 yards, it will be done.