12ga shotgun loads

[DECKAPE]

i have a 12 ga side hammer shotgun never fired it i would like to how to load it.........(how much powder   how much shot) can i use regular shotgun wads like the plastic one piece jobs??thanks

[DanielWGriggs]

Deckape,
a moderate 12 ga load is 90gr bp and 1 1/4oz of shot. What are your intended uses? Yes you can use a plastic sleeve these are usually reserved for waterfouling loads.

How familiar are you with muzzle loading firearms?
abrievated is powder/nitro wad/feltwad/shot/overshot card. prime and ready to fire. Need more info? I'll be watching after 6 pm

[slayer]

Very good starting point, 90gr and 1 1/4 oz shot. Also, a very simple loading is just using (2)- 1/2" Fiber Wads. 1 after the powder and 1 after the shot, no nead for cards and such. They only work in Cylinder or Imp Cylinder bore barrels, because they don`t have any memory and to hard to load thru modified and full chokes. Jack.

[DECKAPE]

im giong to use the shotgun for turkey hunting.......how do you measure out the shot????to get 1 1/4 oz...........i hunt deer with a lyman great plains rifle.......have couple inlines ..... not the same with the pellets......kinda like the side hammer better ( shotgun is a side hammer)

[russianblood]

The rule of thumb is equal amounts of powder and shot by volume. I just use the same powder measure for my shot.

[slayer]

What Choke does your shotgun have? You may have to go with the Felt Wads instead of the Fiber ones. Jack.

[DanielWGriggs]

A Great reference for this and other BP loads is the Lyman black powder handbook. It has steel shot loads also. For turkey hunting you can use the plastic shot cup it will tighten up your pattern just a bit even though it may be hard to load.  You may be able to access a copy at the library. Our local library didn't have one but could get one in a week interlibrary loan.
A lot of good info.

[Rustyinfla]

One of the classic works on shooting the muzzle loading shotgun is by
V.M. Starr. Try looking it up at http://members.aye.net/~bspen/starr.html

     Starr recomends equal volumes of shot to powder.

             Rusty <><

[crow_feather]

Rusty,

Great article/information - thanks

C F

[fffffg]

whether the gun is choked or not is quite important to the type of load you use.. if it is choked you can use   powder/nitro card /two  lubed felt wads/ shot /over shot card..(bend the nitro card to get by choke..... if it is not choked ive gotten best results with  powder/nitro card/1/2 inch fibre wad (with large glob of tc yellow lube, bore butter, in the tube on the bottom)/shot/ over shot card..  track of the wolf or ballistic products, or precision reloading has all the components   except powder... put any of these names in your search enging and they will pop up...  sxs can be dangerous if you mix up your load, measure the length of ramrod sticking out of barrel after each loading  by looking at the number of fingers it covers on your hand.... reseat the load on the other barrel after a  single shot, i usually remove the live  cap to do this.. .. if you take a shot or two and the load works down barrel from recoil  it can be dangerous..  72 grains of shot in standard black powder measure is one ounce..   72 times 1.25 is  or 90 grains on a powder measure is  1 1/4 ounce  lead shot..  pack the powder and wads not the shot for best patterns.. .  number 6  magnum shot should be good for turkey.. get a turkey target and pattern, pattern and pattern..   the rule of the thumb is that if it will give you a killing pattern on paper, and pennetrate one side of a campell soup can that will be sufficient for a good hunting/ killing load at that range.. if you need more shot in the pattern you can go smaller to get  a killing pattern at that yardage..  then shoot the can.. if it wont pennetrate youll need to get closer or get larger shot..  adjust this back and fourth  and you will get your maximum range..  when you take your stand be aware of your kill circumference in your shooting lanes and wait for the turkey to be inside that..  ....preassures will rise in hot weather drop in cold weather so some adjustments can be made but it takes charts to do this well.............larger shot, less powder, harder shot, choke, more shot  will make patterns tighter........ in my 16 gauge 42 inch non choked smoothbore the best patterns are shot with  72 grains powder, 1 1/4 ounce shot... id start with 2fg until youv shot for a while, as faster powders, 3fg, can be unforgiving if you make a mistake..  have fun..  dave

[slayer]

Great info Dave!! Thank you-Jack.

[DanielWGriggs]

I'm glad somebody mentioned to use only FFG. I would forget my head if it wasn't attached.

BTW I really like GBO. There is such a wealth of information and helpful friendly people.

[captchee]

Some  things to think about .
 Just as with rifles a smoothbore  most often will like different loads . What works for one SXS may very well not be acceptable in its  twin .
 While you will fine equal parts powder and shot to be a good starting point  you might consider this  when patterning for a proper load ,from that point .
Dropping a given charge of powder will tighten up or pattern ,  adding more powder will open it up .
Changing wads , cards  and even cups if you so chose to use one will also change the  end result .

 For instance I have a 62 cal English fowler that will not pattern with a cup . I just cant get a powder load or combination  thatÂ’s acceptable using one . Dropping the cup , the pattern was better but sporadic.
I dropped the  powder charge by 10 grains and things were better but I still had holes that moved all over . The consistence I was looking for wasnÂ’t there .
 After considerable work I found my turkey load that  this fowler  liked .
 70 grains of FFg under 2  over the powder cards with the second card wet  .no cushion at allÂ….topped off with  1 ¼ oz of #7 shot and a over the shot card  . The pattern is 30/30 . 30 inches at 30 yards and will  regularly place 10 to 15 bbÂ’s  through a pop can at that range .  She has a couple of very respectable toms to her credit  at close to this range as well.

 You will have to set a range and build a load  that will work out to that . During that process you may just find that you range expectations may be more or even less . But you may just find that a cylinder bore can surprise you  on how well it can pattern with a load it likes

[slayer]

#7 shot for Turkey :eek: Wow, I use #4`s, #7`s are tiny. Jack.

[captchee]

yep have never went smaller the 7's.
when i was a kid  we  used .410  with 7's for even sand hills . i have never taken a turkey with a .410 but know of those who have

[slayer]

I don`t dought it would work, I just wouldn`t feel confident enough to use anything smaller than #6`s for Turkey. Jack.

[captchee]

the problem with small shot is you cant  point and shot , you have to have  aim and take a head shot and know your patern is right . You cant rely on shot making it through the  feathers of the wings  and breast
 last year i took 2 toms . o one a small Jake at 20 yards with my fowler . the second a big tom that a friend of mine Kelly Baurasa   called in for me using a wing bone call made from the jake . He wieght 19lbs , was a double beard  of 8 ½ and 4. Spurs were 1 ¼

 both were taken with #7 shot . The jake with my  62cal /20 gage flint locked English fowler and the tom with an original  12 gage  1890 Morgan SXS with cylinder bores.
 Kelly  also took 2 birds last year one the same day as my  bird shown above ,with an old Cresant SXS in 12 gage  with Damascus barrels .  I loaded the paper hauls for him . I use 1 ¼ of #7 shot, Remington  power wads over 70 grains of RS pyrodex.
 Both birds were well over 25 yard . the old Cresant rolled both toms DOA with no problems

  On the other had and I have never tried it even in my trusty double .410. but  back woodsman had an article on  this very subject as well as evaluating  bores from 10 down to .410 with shot ranging from heavy  magnum turkey  using mixed 2 and 4 to as light as #8 and 9 size shot .
 here is their link, it was eather an issue last winter. was very eye opening

http://www.backwoodsmanmag.com/

 Very good article with a nice layout of photos  and reports by a number of experienced turkey hunters.

 Here is a photo of my spring gobbler  




 and kelly with his fine tom

[slayer]

I appreciate the info!! Well, there is the proof that #7`s take Turkeys. I see you are using paper hulls, that tightens it up a bit? Yes, #4 hits very hard, but yes, you better know your pattern and take head/neck shots as there aren`t alot of them per ounce. Do you use Chilled or Magnum shot? Thanks-Jack.

[captchee]

I see you are using paper hulls, that tightens it up a bit?  .

.

I reload the old paper for my old breach loaders .  i love to shoot the old SXS more so then new ones. the feel and balance even with the cheep warehouse guns IMO is much better then with todayÂ’s lines .
 because most all these have Damascus barrels  of different grades and quality  I only used paper . Not only for the nostalgia of it but also because I find they seal the chambers better with the lower pressures of BP  in some of the  guns that are well over 100 years old  . I have a preference for the  thicker federals over the Winchester  .  With the Federal I can often  get a crimp to hold  with the above loads . With the Winchester I can not and must hand load them with a roll crimp  or drop the cups and used cushions  or drop the charge .
 I have not found a lower charge then 70 grains of 2FF   or RS pyrodex to  give as good a pattern

Do you use Chilled or Magnum shot? Thanks-Jack

 i been using magnum shot from west coast  for most of my cartradges . this next spring  though  I plan on trying   cut shot .
 there used to be a company that made a product called the little shot maker. a person could make there own shot . i had one and eventually it grew legs and hit the road i guess .
 then a few years back i was reading an article on  wing shooting at the end of the 1700Â’s  or what is called the golden age of the SXS .
 There was a description of  how as to make cut shot  used back then .
I have made a couple trys at it and found that  it doesnÂ’t pattern to well past about 15 yards  but inside that its deadly.
 So  with a .410 SXS flintlock on the works  on my table  and if I get time  from customers work to finish it, I figure maybe I will give a try at getting a spring tom in close enough to give it a try

[slayer]

Good info. I don`t want to use any plastic, so it is either Paper Cups or just 2-(1/2") Fiber Wads, which I curently use now in a Cylinder bore T/C New englander. I will try the Paper Cups and see what happens. Someone sent me instructions on how to make them. What is your style of making them? Thanks-Jack.

[captchee]

i use brown paper bag  wrapped around a wood dowel that is bore size .
  i then glue the edge to make a tube .  before pulling the tube off the dowel i push down an over the powder  card as a base with  another dowel i have measured and marked to the depth of 1 1/4 oz of shot .
I leave this dowel in the cup and pull the first dowel out  a little and cut the cup off , leaving the paper for the next cup on the first dowel .

 i then glue the  bottom  shut  by folding the excess paper over and flat to the over the powder card . now this step is important and you will have to do some shooting to find out how far to score the sides   of your cups.
 as im sure you know if  the cup does not open up and fall away it will act like a slug and keep everything together .  i score mine 1/2 way down  

i then take a wood pecker  found at tower hobbies .they are used for  RC aircraft covering  and perforate the wood so as to cut down on air bubbles in the plastic covering

 I use one of these to perforate the paper down 3 sides  about ½ way down ..  You then pull off the cup an waaaalaaaa  a paper shot cup .
 Using post it note works well to  and is faster but I donÂ’t think holds up as well in your shoot bag

[russianblood]

In Michigan, No.6 shot is as small as you are allowed to use for Turkey hunting. Top end is No.4s.

A duplex load of 4 and 6 would be a nice load from a front stuffer. (Remington makes a commercial Turkey load with that same shot mix)

[slayer]

great info!! I actually have some of those 4x6 duplex Rem shells. I am going toexperiment making paper shot cups and see what happens :grin: I shot my Turkey this Fall with a 3 inch 12 ga. Winchester #4 Turkey 2 oz. load thru a full choke in my Mossberg 500. Next year I want to try with either Blackpowder shells or with my New Englender. I am going in progression Jack.

[captchee]

In Michigan, No.6 shot is as small as you are allowed to use for Turkey hunting. Top end is No.4s.

A duplex load of 4 and 6 would be a nice load from a front stuffer. (Remington makes a commercial Turkey load with that same shot mix)

yep each state is diffrent .  i seem to recall someone telling me their state didnt alow hunting with a .410 eather ?? dont remember which one .