Author Topic: Question on double longsprings  (Read 446 times)

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Offline .17HMR

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Question on double longsprings
« on: December 01, 2005, 08:33:30 AM »
I plan to use #3 longsprings next year for yotes but will they cause too much damage to accidental fox and coon catches?

 Also I'am going to use #2s at my fox and coons sets will the hold they occassional coyote?
total for this year so far
3 grinners
2 coyotes
4 coons and
1 skunk

 so far :grin:

Offline Bobber

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Question on double longsprings
« Reply #1 on: December 01, 2005, 09:07:26 AM »
[/URL][/img]This is one of my #2 B&L double long springs set up for fox with possible coyote in mind. It is center swiveled with PIT pan kit installed. The chain is made up of links of old car tire chain and has  PIT shock spring installed, and MB crunch proof swivels installed. Total chain length is about 12-13". I just caught a fox in one of these traps and he was held by both front feet. There was a slight cut on one foot. I my opinion this trap will hold  the ocassional coyote, but the frames and jaw metal on these traps are light wieght. The #3 version of this trap is really to big for fox and coon. Any trap bigger than # 1 1/2  size (the #2 dls has same jaw spread as #1 1/2 coil) is really not a fox or coon trap. Another problem with these traps is the thin jaws that are rather sharp edged. Be sure to turn up the jaw tips on them and de-burr them with a shiv or file. You could also laminate the #3's with 3/16" rod also to lessen jaw pressure on the small stuff. Here's another view of the trap. [/URL][/img]

Offline .17HMR

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trap
« Reply #2 on: December 01, 2005, 09:34:18 AM »
Thanks Bobber

 Thats pretty much what I thought I have 2 dozen victor #2s that I what to set up like yours

 thanks -Derek
total for this year so far
3 grinners
2 coyotes
4 coons and
1 skunk

 so far :grin:

Offline Bobber

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Question on double longsprings
« Reply #3 on: December 01, 2005, 09:52:57 AM »
Derek, the kit I used was the PIT-33. The humped frame Victor and B&L were the same trap. The Center locator is the PIT-16 and the long yoke swivel is the PIT-20. I got mine from M-Y Enterprises phone #(724) 479 -9442. Those PIT kits really work and they cut down on snapped traps and incidental small animals, compared to the nite latched ones I used to use.  There is some welding involved to install the kit but it is very minor, just a couple tacks.

Offline cattail

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Question on double longsprings
« Reply #4 on: December 01, 2005, 01:30:52 PM »
Sorry but I must politley disagree with this. Living in an area where almost 100% of my traps come up through the snow a guy can expect to see more misses using a 1 1/2 with fox most of use use nothing less than a #2 and alot use #3s I will say that in pictures viewed over the years I am of the opinion that our fox tend to be larger overall as I have looked at the pictures and find myself thinking man them guys are small. Now that being said we don't have the huge populations like parts of the east coast nore grey fox and our critters have to run longer circuits to make a living . I have nothing but my casual observation to base this on and a dim memeory of seeing a grading scale for red fox many years ago that had all our sizes a few inches larger then those from the Lower 48. For those wondering properly set a #3 will take a fox on the pad remember he is walking in the snow and sinking in much of the time and that trap is expanding engery to come thru the snow

Offline Bobber

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Question on double longsprings
« Reply #5 on: December 02, 2005, 05:34:25 AM »
Good point on the effects of snow Catail. The  jaw spread of the#1 1/2 traps are a handicap in the deep snow and the #2 dls that part of the question was about ,has really a #1 1/2 trap's jaw spread, which is  about 4 7/8". I have to say though, that I have to work under a jaw restriction here which is 5 3/4" inside. That makes the #3 double long spring barely legal here. There are also pets and mostly negative attitudes towards trapping here. A #2 coyote trap looks like a bear trap to some these landowners that see my traps. I'm not saying anyone is wrong and as you say you have to base your opinions on your own observations. I keep a notebook with me and record stuff like trap performance and foot damage with traps. As you see from the pictures I posted , I'm very serious about trap perfomance, and reasonable modifications. I also wish to point out the wide difference in jaw spread among #3 traps. The #3 dls is about 5 3/4" , the coils 6", the #3 soft-catch is 5 1/2" with pads on, ( it's Ohio legal,  I checked a couple months ago when researching #3 size traps and the new four coil soft- catch for my own use in tough snow conditions here, where a politically correct trap can gain me permissions ) and the #3 jumps are around 6". That further screws up the equation. So though not right for you in Ak,  I still stand by my statement that a # 3 trap is generally a bad thing for fox and coon here. If we didn't dis-agree, we wouldn't have much to talk about. :-)

Offline cattail

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Question on double longsprings
« Reply #6 on: December 02, 2005, 06:04:51 AM »
You make very valid points fortunatley we do not have all the resrtictions that some of you do . I will not disagree with teh fact that for alot of places the 1.5 is a good trap for fox but am certainly glad I don't have to depend on a #2 to hold a coyote though we have few in my neck of the state. As far as the politically correct part man I knew there was a reason I lived here  :grin: Hope your season goes well mine is about to

Offline Bobber

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Question on double longsprings
« Reply #7 on: December 02, 2005, 06:23:53 AM »
Your very lucky Catail to live where you do . Been trying to convince my wife we should get out of NY but I'm afraid I'm stuck here. Would love to at least vist Alaska someday though. We actually have very good trapping opportunities here. It's just that we have the albatross of a few huge urban liberal millstones around our neck here in NY , with places like NYC. Only been there once, what a people trap! Glad it's on the other end of the state.  Just wish the people there would not push their values and moralities on us, but sad to say they control the votes with their numbers. Take care and good trapping. :-)

Offline jim-NE

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Question on double longsprings
« Reply #8 on: December 04, 2005, 12:56:30 PM »
We have little coyotes here, little fox, lots of coon, and some areas lots of dogs afield, too. I run mostly #2s (longs and coils both) and lose precious few coyotes from my #2 longs. Jaw spread is about same as 1.5 coil, but much better mechanical holding power over that similar-sized coil. However, once the snow flies, I go to 1.75 or #2 coiled 4x4s. They seem to bust crust and snow much better for me. I can add beefer springs to my #2 longs, but by design of that trap, once the trap jaws are fully opened up, you don't need to exert much force to keep the trap "open" and you only have to do that really to the one jaw. If it doesn't take me that much effort to keep it open, then a slight freeze can do it too. But, a stoutly springed coil gets harder to hold open the more you open up those springs.
Its simple mechanics, by design a coil has the least spring resistance once the trap is fully closed, more and more resistance as the jaws are forced open and the spring levers pushed down. But, a long spring has more holding power on the top end at closure mostly because of how high they tend to lock up on the jaws when the trap is closed. open up the jaws, and the springs can be held at full compression easily with just the one power driven jaw much more easily than a coil at this same point.
When I do use longs in late season, I really make sure that no moist soil touches the jaws or top of the springs so that if things freeze up my trap won't also.