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Offline SDN921

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« on: February 20, 2006, 12:19:00 PM »
New to NEF/H&R and group

I ordered and am waiting for a H&R 223 Fluted Rifle.
I already got a Shooters Ridge Bipod
and 3 - 9 40mm Burris scope to start with.

I plan on getting a 308 Bull and 12ga barrels.

I am looking for advice on either getting the 450 Marlin or 500 s&W
I am not planning on reloading.

Any comments on the advantages of either of these over the other.

SN
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Offline quickdtoo

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« Reply #1 on: February 20, 2006, 12:55:44 PM »
Welcome aboard!! :D  I can't recommend either over the other, but do recommend the 45-70, specially if you don't handload. Ammo for the 45-70 is cheaper and a lot more common than either the .450 or .500. Recoil is less for standard ammo, too!! :eek:

Tim
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Offline 45/70fan

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« Reply #2 on: February 20, 2006, 01:58:04 PM »
I agree with Quick, 45-70 IS THE ONE. The 450 is just a hot loaded 45/70 with a belt added. The 500 I think is a novelty, I see lots of used ones for sale.  45/70 loads are available from 243 recoil to knock your socks off. From my experience and reading other posts the 45/70 handis are among the most accurate right out of the box.  Come on over to the 45/70 side!!!
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Offline knight0334

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« Reply #3 on: February 20, 2006, 02:00:50 PM »
45-70 for sure..   it can be cranked up alot farther then and 450 Marlin..   the 500S&W is already working at it's peak pressure.
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Offline 45/70fan

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« Reply #4 on: February 20, 2006, 02:03:08 PM »
DANG COMPUTER DOUBLE POSTED ME!!
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Offline quickdtoo

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« Reply #5 on: February 20, 2006, 02:22:52 PM »
That's ok 45/70fan, that's worth saying twice!!! :agree: :agree: :agree:

Tim
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Offline SDN921

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« Reply #6 on: February 20, 2006, 02:48:29 PM »
Thanks for the replys.

I will take a look at the 45-70.

I can't wait to get my 223 to get started.

 :grin:
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Offline quickdtoo

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« Reply #7 on: February 20, 2006, 02:56:11 PM »
Here's one reason why you would want to go with the 45-70 if you don't handload.....This is a 2003 list of 45-70 factory ammo offerings....I'm sure there are some changes, but......

$41.54 250g @ 2200fps, 2687fpe, Barnes X Flat Nose (Conley)
$??.?? 300g @ 1810fps, 2182fpe (Remington @ Remington web site)
$20.39 300g @ 1880fps, 2355fpe (Winchester JHP, Natchez)
$20.60 300g @ 1880fps, 2355fpe (Federal, Natchez)
$29.81 300g @ 1880fps, 2355fpe (Winchester Partition Gold, Natchez)
$22.84 300g @ 2100fps, 2938fpe, HP (Conley)
$44.66 300g @ 2100fps, 2938fpe, Barnes Original Flat Point (Conley)
$32.50 300g @ 2100fps, 2938fpe, Nosler Partition (Protected Point) (Conley)
$41.54 300g @ 2100fps, 2938fpe, Barnes X Flat Nose (Conley)
$25.08 350g @ 1970fps, 3017fpe, Hornady JFP (Conley)
$34.89 350g @ 1800fps, 2519fpe, BCSP (Corbon @ Corbon web site)
$19.47 350g @ 2025fps, 3188fpe, PMC @CheaperThanDirt.com)
$39.99 350g @ 2150fps, 3593fpe (Buffalo Bore Ammo @ Cabelas)
$24.99 400g @ 1250fps, 1388fpe (Black Hills @ Cabelas)
$44.66 400g @ 1900fps, 3207fpe, Barnes Original Flat Point (Conley)
$54.46 400g @ 1900fps, 3207fpe, Swift A-Frame Flat Point (Conley)
$12.99 405g @ 1350fps, 1639fpe (PMC @ Cabelas)
$18.99 405g @ 1100fps, 1088fpe (Ultramax @ Cabelas)
$22.50 405g @ 1325fps, 1579fpe, RNFP (Conley)
$18.99 405g @ 1330fps, 1590fpe (Remington @ Cabelas)
$24.50 405g @ ??? (Winchester @ Cascade Ammunition web site)
$35.57 405g @ 1700fps, 2600fpe, FPPE (Corbon @ Corbon web site)
$22.99 405g @ 1900fps, 3247fpe, JSP (Conley)
$39.99 405g @ 2000fps, 3597fpe (Buffalo Bore Ammo @ Cabelas)
$41.99 405g @ ??? (Obsolete Ammunition @ Cabelas)
$50.00 420g @ 1850fps, 3200fpe (Garrett)
$39.99 430g @ 1925fps, 3537fpe (Buffalo Bore Ammo @ Cabelas)
$34.50 460g @ 1650fps, 2780fpe, HC (Corbon @ Corbon web site)
$41.99 500g @ ??? (Obsolete Ammunition @ Cabelas)
$52.99 500g @ 1625fps, 2931fpe (Buffalo Bore Ammo @ Cabelas)
$50.00 540g @ 1550fps, 2880fpe (Garrett)
$180.00 500g @ 1530fps, 2600fpe (Speer AGS Tungsten, Garrett)
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Offline MSP Ret

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« Reply #8 on: February 20, 2006, 03:11:28 PM »
The 45-70 is the way to go!!!!....<><.... :grin:
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Offline knight0334

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« Reply #9 on: February 20, 2006, 04:22:26 PM »
If you go with the 45-70, I can attest to the Winchester Super-X 300gr JHP's...   I shoot them in my 22" Handi.  50yard clover leaf holes..  

They work pretty good in my 32" BC too.  And they dont kick the snot out of you(depending on your tolerance for recoil).
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Offline Hunternz

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« Reply #10 on: February 20, 2006, 08:02:51 PM »
45-70 is great fun, and before you know it you will be reloading for it, then casting bullets and then putting big holes in targets and meat on the table, when I drag some of my non hunting shooting mates to the range what do they wan't to shoot, my .243 nup, the rifle with the big hole in the end, the cartridges with the big bullets and smacks their shoulders the hardest my 45-70.
Regards Howard.
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Offline myarmor

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« Reply #11 on: February 21, 2006, 03:00:44 AM »
Welcome to the forum, it's good have'n ya.
By all merits it sounds like you made a great choice fixing up your 223 for the range. Follow the guides in the FAQs and Stickys and chances are you will have a great shooter on your hands. The 223's seem to be one of the most accurate calibers in a Handi thats for sure.
As for the Big Bore, I don't have either 450, 45-70, or 500. I find that some good 12ga Slugs handle all I need up close. Not the range of these other guys but a lot of Umph out to 100 and a little beyond.
Where you looking to buy the 450 or 500 for hunting or just for fun?
If your not reloading, and want a cheap trill, a good 12ga Slug barrel would fit you nicely. You can pick up boxes of 15rds of Remington Sluggers and Winchesters for about $6-8 at Walmart. A lot cheaper than a box of any 450, 45-70, and 500 Shells.
Just something to consider 8)
-Aaron
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Offline SDN921

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« Reply #12 on: February 21, 2006, 04:41:16 PM »
I am looking to use the 45-70 or 500sw for target mainly but probaly a couple of deer when I go back to Wisc. each year for deer season.

I am going to take another look at the 45-70.

What is the peformace differance between the the 22" Handi and the 32" Buffalo classic?

Now you all got  me thinking that direction.

 :grin:

Scott
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Offline quickdtoo

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« Reply #13 on: February 21, 2006, 05:01:16 PM »
Quote from: SDN921


What is the peformace differance between the the 22" Handi and the 32" Buffalo classic?



Scott,

That's a good question!! I shoot a 300gr Nosler partition in my 45-70 Handi at approx 2425fps, same load in my BC runs just ~2450fps, so it depends on the powder you choose, H4198 doesn't seem to be the best choice for taking advantage of the extra 10" of barrel.  I have chosen H4895 for the BC, so far it seems to be a good choice with what little I have shot it, but I need to do some more range work with a chrony set up.

Tim
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Offline Norseman112

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« Reply #14 on: February 21, 2006, 06:21:48 PM »
Welcome  :D

John
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