Pre 64 appeal

[Don Fischer]

I have listened for year's about the late great pre 64's. What's the appeal of those thing's? I've shot a couple and they were nice but I don't think they are any better than the mod 70's that came later. Of course those 64 model's stocks left a lot to be desired. Yet today many accuracy nut's float their barrel's much the same.

[PA-Joe]

Claw Extractor and Positive Feed System. After 64 they shifted to the Remington type push feed system. Then in the 90s they went back to the claw and a positive feed system. Better workmanship and fit also. The other advantage was the three position safety that did not exist on the push feed models.

[dukkillr]

i have nothing positive to say about any pump shotgun produced by winchester after 1964 and i have nothing negative to say about any pump produced before 1964.  If you can't hold a M12 and 1200 in your hands and see the difference you don't know guns.

[jeager106]

i have nothing positive to say about any pump shotgun produced by winchester after 1964 and i have nothing negative to say about any pump produced before 1964.  If you can't hold a M12 and 1200 in your hands and see the difference you don't know guns.

Man ain't dat da truth!

The best thing that ever happend to Remingtons great 870 was when Winchester quit the M-12 and brought out the 1200/1300 junk.

[Don Fischer]

Guess Ishould have said rifles. I don't even like the model 12 but, the 101, 23,and 21 were great.

Bring's a story. Back about 1974, give or take, I was at a training day on Sauvies Island outside Portland, Ore. with the Springer Spaniel club. Present were Dr Christensen and his wife Janet. We had just finished a hunter class, where the handler shot their own bird's, with Janet running one of her great dog's, Misty Muffet. Walking in I was visiting with Janet and noticed she was using a model 21 Grand American. Now that is one hell of a gun to use in a field trial hunter class. I remarked that it was beautiful and asked how she liked it. Hope Chris isn't listening. She hated it! I asked why she used it and she said it was a present from Chris and he really wanted her to! She let me carry it for a way's, only one I ever saw and I got to touch it. By the way, it was not pre 64!  Another time I was out with a client working with his dog and he whips out a Model 23. I got to use that one! :agree:

[CowboyEngr]

I have to somewhat disagree.  I'll be the first to admit that I liked the pre-64 design better, but I have and have had several post 64 mdl. 70's that were fine rifles.  The issue of cut checkering vs. pressed checkering had a lot to do with the overall attitude of quality of post 64 guns, but nearly every gun manufacturer had an affair with the pressed checkering junk.  The pre64 guns and pre64 type guns will always have more "value" than the post 64 stuff, but if anyone want to give some away just send them to me.

All model 70's have always had the 3 position safety.  That part did not change.