Recoil with the 45-70

[bub524]

Before we get started here I already know all you guys are tough and can take the recoil. So lets say I'm asking what you do when your wife shoots.
My BC in 45-70 kicks so bad its no fun to shoot! I been shooting for 35 years, so I did some range time. I'm loading 350 cast with 22g 2400--tolerable same bullet w/41 g R7--okay. When I get to out of the box 405s or hand loads with anything over a 350g the recoil is really bad. I used to have a Ruger No. 1 in 45-70 that I used to load to the max and I don't remember it kicking like this one. But, I was much yonger then too.
Anybody have any secrets out there on how to tame this thing down a little and make it fun to shoot. I tried a sand bag against my shoulder which helped a lot but its very difficult to shoot that way.
Any help at all would be appreciated.

[quickdtoo]

I shoot 555gr Saeco #20 gas checked at 1690fps and 525gr Beartooth Piledrivers at 1800fps bullets in my .45-120 BC, recoil is tolerable from the bench with a Galco slip on pad, a pipe filled with 2lbs of lead in the stock bolt hole and I wear a Past Magnum shoulder pad. Sitting as upright as possible also helps a lot so your upper body can move back with the recoil.

Another option is to cut the stock off square, and installe a small Limbsaver grind-to-fit recoil pad, the slip on works, but is a little loose.

Works for me!

Tim

Galco pad

[canon6]

I have a very bad shoulder,and to shoot my 45-70 I put a    piece of copper pige in the butt  stock hole  put ona Limbsaver grind away recoil pad.With a ammo cuff ot weighs@ 11.15pounds,feels like a 243  HTH  Doug

[stuffit]

Quick has given you some very good recommendations.  My initial impression of my BC was exactly as yours was.  In my early 60's, I'd been shooting a good while and hadn't ever paid much attention to the "kick".   Weatherby Magnums..... bring 'em on.  I'll sight em in for your and then shoot 'em for fun for a while...... back then.  LOL   That steel cresent butt plate and the light weight of the BC had me in an entirely different state of mind very soon.  Of course, like a lot of Southerners, I was shooting in shirt sleeves (never wise with a .45-70.   My right arm was blue from biceps to shoulder.   Here's what I did:

1) Got a new (and heavier) Montecarlo buttstock and a beavertail forend from GunStocks Inc.  These are partially finished and I enjoyed the process of finishing it up.  

2) The buttstock came with a Limbsaver recoil at my request.

3) My better (and wiser) half sewed a recoil absorber on a web shooting jacket and I also got a Past strap on recoil absorber. (talk aboiut over kill.  I wanted to leave nothing to chance.  I'd waited most of a lifetime for this rifle and, by golly, I was going to shoot it.

4) I ordered a Mercury Recoil Reducer to install in the buttstock (I'd used the lead and the MRR works just as well; maybe a little better and is lighter).  

Here's a few pics of the things mentioned here:
An early pic of "project - don't let the BC get you shelll shocked" before some of the final finishing work.


Later on at our range in the country.  I never did put the gloss coat on.  I liked the flat less reflective stage and left it there


The Past:


The other recoil absorber she sewed on the shooting vest:


It shot real good:


The recoil will never be in the .22 rimfire category but now the rifle is a joy to shoot with loads at several different levels.  I mostly keep my reloads below 1800 fps and bullet wt at 435 grs or less and the  rifle is now a pleasure to shoot.  Good luck and enjoy your Buffalo Rifle
 
stuffit

[Swampman]

Strangely I've always felt the recoil was worse with the lighter bullets.

[Scibaer]

a pipe filled with 2lbs of lead in the stock bolt hole

does that actually help ? the pipe filled with shot, to reduce recoil.. how ?

glenn

[bub524]

Thanks for all the good ideas.

[quickdtoo]

a pipe filled with 2lbs of lead in the stock bolt hole

does that actually help ? the pipe filled with shot, to reduce recoil.. how ?

glenn

Yes it does, increasing the rifle weight decreases felt recoil. Some use shot or melted lead poured in copper tubing. An old sock full of lead shot works in the syn stocks. Or you can spend about $35 on a mercury recoil reducer, I have one in one of my .45-70s, but haven't shot it yet. I have about 200 rounds loaded up to shoot in em, but waiting for the sight in crowds to dissipate.

Tim

[Ed Hill]

Bub, if you're not hunting, why not just load the bullets down? I punch paper with Laser cast 405's at 1100 fps with Unique or XMP5744.
Accurate, and very light on the shoulder. If I'm shooting over 50 rounds I'll put a recoil pad on, but it's not really necessary.
Ed

[bub524]

What kind of load w/ Unique and XMP5744? (XMP5744? never heard of this, who makes it?) If posting the load is against the rules then just PM me.

[quickdtoo]

Accurate Arms makes XMP5744, it's a real popular powder with large capacity cases and reduced loads. I use it in my .45-120 BC a lot, it's not position sensitive like a lot of other powders. You can also find lots of low velocity data at Greg Mushial's web site.

Tim

http://www.accuratepowder.com/loaddata_caliber_rifle_standard_458cal.htm

http://www.gmdr.com/lever/lowveldata.htm

[Swampman]

http://forums.handloads.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=11897&PN=1&get=last

One of main things I like about the Handi is that it's handy.  I'd rather endure the recoil than carry usless weight.

[RemingtonMagnum]

What I do for recoil.

I use #6 steel shot. Before installing the shot in the stock I coat my hands with Refrigeration oil because it is non detergent and non acid. Coat the steel shot by roilling them between your hands.  By using Steel Shot the shot will slide when the recoil impact fires against each. The oil helps prevent rust that would slow movement. This acts a lot like the Mercury system. Lead will actually pack like sand on a beach. Two Cents.

[Grizz_]

Before we get started here I already know all you guys are tough and can take the recoil. So lets say I'm asking what you do when your wife shoots.
My BC in 45-70 kicks so bad its no fun to shoot! I been shooting for 35 years, so I did some range time. I'm loading 350 cast with 22g 2400--tolerable same bullet w/41 g R7--okay. When I get to out of the box 405s or hand loads with anything over a 350g the recoil is really bad. I used to have a Ruger No. 1 in 45-70 that I used to load to the max and I don't remember it kicking like this one. But, I was much yonger then too.
Anybody have any secrets out there on how to tame this thing down a little and make it fun to shoot. I tried a sand bag against my shoulder which helped a lot but its very difficult to shoot that way.
Any help at all would be appreciated.

Recoil? What recoil?

OK, I shoot 525gr and 425gr with no discomfort. The 525 is running around 1500fps, the 425 is less but I don't know how much less. I would not let my wife shoot this because she is recoil sensitive, but I let my daughter, she loves those loads. It's a personal preference and how you shoot.

My H&R 20ga Pardner Youth recoils harder than either of the 45/70 loads I mentioned.

A lot of it has to do with how you hold the gun and how you hold yourself. If you use a military hold you will get hurt.

Best,

Grizz

[Ed Hill]

Bub, as Quick mentioned, 5744 is AA, and they post from mild to pretty stiff loads. Quick also noted Greg's levergun site that has lots of low velocity loads listed, including some with Unique. Overall, I have found better accuracy with the 5744.
ED

[bub524]

Well, I've done some modifications. I took an unused buttstock, mounted it to the BC and drilled a couple of extra 5/8 holes , then filled them and the bolt hole with #8 shot and added a Limbsaver. I think the difference in the BC butt and the standard butt may make a difference in configuration and felt recoil. I'll try getting some of that 5744 and trying that as well. The weight and slight change in butt stock geometry should make a difference though.

[poncaguy]

My 45-70 killed my shoulder until I installed the Choate Varmit stock, can shoot it from bench now with no pain..........try it, yo'll like it

[Bear Rider]

Before we get started here I already know all you guys are tough and can take the recoil. So lets say I'm asking what you do when your wife shoots.
My BC in 45-70 kicks so bad its no fun to shoot! I been shooting for 35 years, so I did some range time.

I'll wager that you're shooting the gun off the bench. The classic style stock is better suited to off hand or sitting with cross sticks due to the extra drop.

Also, you may be pulling the stock in too close. That curved butt plate fits on your arm, not flat on your chest as some do.

Finally, if you ARE shooting off a bench, make sure that the rifle is high enough that you are sitting with your spine vertical, and nut hunched down and forward as you would if the bench is too low. You may have to add an extra bag at the muzzle because of the extra drop in the classic's stock.

[bub524]

Bear you're right on all counts. I lean into the rifle and should know from years of shooting from the bench to sit upright. And the stock is part of the problem. It seems the standard stock works better. I've taken a stock from another Handi and added some weight. I'll also add some more bean bags to my range box to get that rifle up where I can sit straight. I'll have this thing tamed soon. Thanks to all the help and good advice from all you guys.

[Bear Rider]

I don't see the classic stock as a problem, but then I'm used to stocks with crescent butt plates and a lot of drop from my years of shooting flintlocks. It's just that you can't shoot them using the same techniques that are used with straight stocks and shotgun butt plates. It can be a rather painful experience.

Frankly, the only time that a modern stock has an advantace is when the rifle is shot on the bench. The older stocks are better in all other positions, particularly regarding steadiness.