Repair of Colt 51 Navies: How hard? Where to get info?

[Big Paulie]

Dear Guys,

  I collect original Colt 1851 Navies.  These are single action Colts, with relatively few internal parts.  Unfortunately, as you might expect, a large number of them (even in extremely good condition) will no longer index, or hold at half cock, or cylinder-lock in posiition at full cock.  This is not surprising, since some of them are more than 140 years old.

  A standard acceptable practice now is to simply replace the internal mechnics (trigger, cylinder bolt, hand, hand spring) to set the piece right again, using modern parts.  Generally, several external screws also get replaced in the process.   I see that Numrich Arms sells these parts (as a single kit) for repairing both the 51 Navy and 61 Navy.

   My question is this:  As a practical matter, how hard is this to do?   I am very handy with tools, have complete sets of gunsmithing tools, gunsmithing screwdrivers, a good dremel set, file sets, etc., and I have done work on my own hunting rifles for 30 years. 

   Would someone kindly let me know:

        1.    Where I can find a good instruction video or other good directional guide for learning how to do this?

        2.    Whether, as a practical matter, any gunsmiths out there think that this is so difficult, and requires such a deft touch, that someone like me shouldn't try it?

        3.  If  I wanted to do a practice run on an inexpensive modern reproduction, do you think that the internal parts/mechanics of the modern Colt 51 reproductions (such as CVA or a Navy Arms) are the same as the original ones?

        I would love to have a gunsmith do this work for me, but in my town, there are only two good ones, and the wait is about 3 months for anything at all.  Also, in collecting or trading the Colt 51s, the margins are so small, that there is really no room to add $150 of gunsmith fees to any particular piece.
 
        Thanks for all advice and opinions.

Big Paulie

[Keith L]

I can't speak for originals, but I have repaired plenty of the reproduction cap and ball arms.  Different makes of the same model reproduction frequently don't interchange directly.  Often they can be made to work with modification.  I have even had two guns of the same model and manufacturer that were slightly different.  I assume that the parts are hand fitted at the factory (as I assume the originals were) and replacements may need some filing, grinding, etc. to work correctly.  It isn't hard work, but may be fussy, and time consuming.  I actually enjoy the work, and you may as well.  I fit the replacement parts to the gun, not  the other way.  With originals that wouild be even more important.

[Cknerr]

your correct Keith.

Repairing old Colts, Remingtons, etc of that era is my bread and butter. There are many places like S&S that carry original parts and/or reproductions. But, like you said, parts are not always interchangeable. I have a trapdoor that this guy wants the trigger bow changed to one without a sling swivel. Okay, piece of cake I think...wrong! The old trigger bow has 1/4-20 threads. The new one has 1/4-28. They hard part is the nuts are very odd looking, I will have to make a pair. It is amazing where you can get tripped up. When that won't work the you have to braze or weld extra metal on, grind, file, stone what doesn't belong and then heat treat if necessary. This is especially true of muzzle loaders (off subject - I know)

Any well made firearm from those days had some "fitting" done after the dies and other equipment started wearing a little. Sure, some could be slapped together and sent on its way. Most had to have some tweaking.  If the factory didn't do it, the new owner did it or had it done. It didn't take much to get things working smoothly. Just how little they actually had to do after looking at the process and state of technology in those days is surprising.

When most parts wear out, it takes a little forethought to figure out what is wrong and how to correct them before you do anything. For example: Too often folks notice their barrel rattles a little on your type of revolver. They file a little off the end nearest the cylinder thinking the wedge will be able to the barrel back and that will tighten things better. Wrong! You have to take the stem out and play with it. Not difficult (usually) but not easy either. You have the right idea to do your research first, then start playing with them. Start with the cheap books at your local bookstore. They will have copies of "Repairing guns of the old West" and others of that ilk. They will help by pointing out the basics. Then as you get more and more exposed to all this, you'll find more sources and understand what people are explaining.

Big Paulie, if you want to get immersed, tell a few gun dealers you want to repair some on the side...they always have some junk gathering dust that you can use to learn on. Then prepare to get run over. It is a niche market that doesn't have a lot of participants. There is always a lot to work on! It is intimidating at the beginning when you realize what history you have in your hands, and then there is that price tag. It too will pass, or at least subside enough to allow you to enjoy your work.

Take care,
Chris

[gunnut69]

It as does much gunsmithing requires a lot of patience and some knowledge. It can be learned.. It's not simply replacing parts though as was already noted. They will almost certainly require fitting and sometimes the best bet is to repair the existing part. If welding is not one of your skills you will likely need to find a friend willing to help out. I have a friend/relative who was a body man for years. He can do amazing things with a MIG welder and my father-in-law can do anything that can be done with an acetelene torch.. I would advise a FEW trial runs on imports before working an old Colt.. Of course that somewhat depends on the prooblem with the old colt!  It can add an entirely new demension to your hobby.