357 Hunting Loads

[IC Cowboy]

I am the proud new owner of a marlin 1894 Cowboy in 38/357, I have waited for some time to finally get this rifle. My ? is even though I have much better suited rifles for deer/hog hunting (30-06, 300WSM, 30-30, 444); and even though this gun was purchased for Cowboy Action Shooting 38s, if I should elect to take it whitetail deer or wild hog hunting what would be a good hunting load in 357, I know someone here has taken their Cowboy gun deer/hog hunting. Also am curious would accuracy be effected by shooting alot of 38s and then on occasion shooting the 357s will 1 form a groove in the barell and have negative effects on the other?
 Thanks in advance for the Opinoins and advice.

[Jerry Lester]

As far as the 38's hurting your chamber, contrary to popular belief, yes, if you shoot enough low pressure, or reduced 38's in a 357, they can, and definately will cut a nice ring in it right where the case mouths stop. If anybody doubts this, load up some 140-158 grain bullets in 38 cases with IMR-4227. Even fast burning powders will do it eventually, but that powder will burn a fairly deep ring usually within 100 rounds or less.

If you're wanting a good load for deer, try 158g Remington SP's with about 16g-17g of Lil' Gun, and CCI 550 primers. In that rifle, you should get somewhere around 1950-2100 fps with that combination, and it'll do excellent on deer up to 100 yards.

[timothy]

Will 38's cut a ring or deposit a ring? And what kind of effect will it have? Feeding/extraction or accuracy or even danger?

[Jerry Lester]

38's will "cut" a ring into the chamber. Usually it'll be most noticable in the upper third of the chamber. I'm not talking about a carbon ring from powder residue. I'm talking about a groove that can be several thousandths deep.

I know that it's common belief that this is impossible, but I challange anybody that wants to see to load up a couple boxes of 38's with IMR-4227, and light bullets. I know this is to the extreme, but it'll speed up the proccess, and allow you to see results without having to go through as many bullets.

[cwlongshot]

If I had to use it for Mr. Whitetail I would use a Hornady 158FP XTP bullet over a max load of H110 powder.
 I shot a couple deer a while back with a 140SP over a max load of H110 with excellent results.
But I have always had a un confident feeling when i bring it in the woods...like its not enough gun for a big deer ant a marginal angle. As a matter of fact, I did not take a shot at a monster of a buck with this rifle, just because of that....

It was a drizzly/rainy day, kind of day when the woods are silent to walk in. I decided to just walk some tote roads thru a piece of land we hunt. Well long story short, I got the the top of a ridge and had to cough. I did so into my elbow as quietly as I could. When all  H E double hockey sticks broke loose. Not twenty yards to my right under some laurel busted out one of the biggest bucks I had seen to date. Down the side hill he ran. i jumped to the edge with just enough time to get the front site on his shoulder, but I hesitated. Thinking ABOUT THAT LIL BULLET AND THAT BIG DEER. Foolish I know, but I didn't and HATE to take chance shots. Let alone do so with marginal calibers.  One of my hunting memories that will haunt me till the day i meet the man upstairs....

Haven't shot much with this bullet in a mag, but it preforms VERY well in my MAXI!!!

CW

[S.S.]

My Rossi Model 92 .357 mag. has probably 5 to 7 thousand
HOT .38 rounds through it and there is no sign of any cutting
at all ?  Is the steel in Marlins softer I wonder?
I have also used Very Hot loaded .38's in my Dan Wesson
.357 revolver for probably 20 years.
(Ten Thousand rounds would be a conservative estimate)
No cutting at all?
I do however have an old S&W revolver that had a nice dish cut in the
Topstrap from the Cylinder Gap Flash. Cleaned it out good, filled it with JB WELD
and filed it smooth. Cant hardly tell it was there
Aparently the damage that gets done depends on the Gun.

[Jerry Lester]

My Rossi Model 92 .357 mag. has probably 5 to 7 thousand
HOT .38 rounds through it and there is no sign of any cutting
at all ?  Is the steel in Marlins softer I wonder?
I have also used Very Hot loaded .38's in my Dan Wesson
.357 revolver for probably 20 years.
(Ten Thousand rounds would be a conservative estimate)
No cutting at all?
I do however have an old S&W revolver that had a nice dish cut in the
Topstrap from the Cylinder Gap Flash. Cleaned it out good, filled it with JB WELD
and filed it smooth. Cant hardly tell it was there
Aparently the damage that gets done depends on the Gun.

The reason you didn't get chamber cutting is because you were shooting "hot loaded" 38's. If you shoot mild 38's, or reduced 38's you'll see what I'm warning him about.

[HAMMERHEAD]

The last issue of Rifle magazine had an article about hunting loads in .357 leverguns. A max load (Hodgdon data, rifle section) of Lil' Gun under a158 grain  XTP or Gold Dot looks like a winner.
I have been shooting .38s's in various .357's (Marlins, NEF, Ruger, S&W, T/C, Rossi, even Freedom Arms) for 25 years and have never had a problem.
I believe Jerry, and have seen slight erosion, but never enough to cause a problem with accuracy or reliability.
Now I'm strictly a handloader with .357 brass - the only way to go.
Save you brass, you may want it someday!

[Mikey]

357 magnum cases, 12.4 grains of WW296 powder, Winchester Large Pistol Primer and a 200 gn cast semi-wadcutter bullet - somewhere around 1335'/sec from a revolver, I think.  Mikey.

[single action]

I have used stock remington 180 grain soft points for the last 8-10 years with good success.

[Don-T]

I second Lil Gun and XTP's.  I use 15.0 gr Lil Gun under 180 gr XTPs and get around 1750 over my Crony out of a 18" barrel.  No problems on PA deer (can't see more than 50-60 yards anywhere around here)!

[Star1pup]

The new issue of Shooting Times has a good article on the .357 with some loads I want to try.  They have a chart of loads and some are specific for the Marlin 1894 C.

I wonder just how accurate we could get with this gun.  Maybe if I used it as a 75 yard gun instead of a 100 yard gun it would be pretty darn accurate.

[pastorp]

Mikey, how do you get those large primers in a 357 mag. case?  Byron

[Jerry Lester]

I wonder just how accurate we could get with this gun.  Maybe if I used it as a 75 yard gun instead of a 100 yard gun it would be pretty darn accurate.

I've killed a slew of groundhogs past 150 yards with mine(open sights/lot's of practice ), and quite a few past 200 yards, with a few past 250 yards. These little rifles will shoot a lot better than they get credit for.

[Mikey]

pastorp - Ooooops!  Thanks for catching me on that one.  They are, of course, the small pistol primer.  I must have had large cups on my mind (lololol).  Mikey.

[bfpgw]

I have had an 1894C for four years.  Don't do any reloading.  I've used store bought 357 Remington 180gr SJHP and Federal 180 gr HC for hunting.  Hard cast would be best for hogs from what I've heard (don't hunt hogs, yet).  The Remingtons shoot a little straighter than the Feds and more consistently for me.

I can't imagine why anyone would want to shoot .38 in it anyway.  Target grade (price level) .357 158gr SJSP are available from Sellier & Bellot via Natchez Shooters Supplies for about $9 a box.  I wish they were 180 grain because these things are really hot.  They shoot as flat out to 100 yards as my .243 with no adjustment for 50 or 100 yards after sighting in. 

This combination works so well it was confiscated by my better half this dear season.  The recoil is like a .22 and the gun is so well-balanced that she shoots it better than anything else we have.  She was tired of using a scope on her .243 so I lost my gun.  It was a good reason to go out and get a new 336 in .30-30 and use the Leverevolution rounds.  Still would like to have my 1894C back.  She gives me the evil eye when I just walk past where she keeps it for home security.  I pity the fool that tries to argue with her on a dark night.