12 0r 20 gauge for woods gun?

[KPD]

OK, here's the plan:

I want to buy a standard pardner single-shot shotgun and cut the barrel to 20", add a recoil pad, and sling swivels. This gun will be my walking-around/truck gun. The game encountered could be anything from squirrels and rabbits (most common) to deer, or the very slight chance of self-defense from bears. I am undecided between the 12 and the 20 gauge.

Here are some pros and cons that I came up with:

12ga Pros:

-more avaliabe, and slightly cheaper ammo, with more variety
-more avaliable power in the off chance of a bear encounter

12ga Cons:

-HEAVY RECOIL!

20ga Pros:

-Lighter Recoil (not sure how much lighter?)= more fun to shoot
-Lighter overall weight of gun and ammo

20ga Cons:

-does it have enough power??


So, which do you think would best suit my needs, 12 or 20? Also, would it be worth it to have the barrel threaded for chokes, or should I just leave it as a cylinder bore?

Right now, the only models avaliable to me are the standard pardner single-shots, so I will have to make something out of one these.

Your comments are appreciated. Thanks!

KPD

[gould]

The only thing wrong I see is you have no chock at all so its going to be a very short range gun. I would go with the 20ga and have a 22inch youth barrel fitted to it then you can have a nice short gun and still hit at farther ranges.Or better yet get the new 20ga Tamer.
Good luck
Jason

[kid_couteau]

Hi

I have made a few legal sawed offs (19" barrel)

12 gauge ones (guess I had better mention that.)

Using a piece of printer paper for a target I get the following:

10 yards 7 1/2 birdshot ok, most on paper

20 yards birdshot not so good

10 yards buckshot most on paper

Up to 50 yards slug worked real well

Hope this helps

Oh yeah...on the recoil with the 12.  Its not so bad with lighter loads but the slugs and buckshot let you know you are alive

Kid

[mt3030]

....This gun will be my walking-around/truck gun. ....undecided between the 12 and the 20 gauge.

KPD:

You are doing it for the same reasons I made mine (Savage Model 94) when I lived in Anchorage. I decided on the 12 gauge, just because of the bears. Found out that the recoil wasn't a bother except while shooting from the bench. Fit a GOOD recoil pad. With the adjustaqble sights it will keep three Winchester or Remington slugs in 4" /100yds, which is the furthest I'd expect to use it anyway. And don't skimp on the sights. If needed, you can further dampen the recoil by installing a mercury compensator in the stock.

I have considered having the barrel threaded for chokes, but haven't made the move yet. Too many other projects in the fire.

[Cookiemann]

There you go with that darn pic again, Wally.  You must have that on the express enter button.LOL  I gotta get it done.

Anyway, KPD, check out the Bug OUt link in this forum.  I posted the catalog link to the new Pardner Synthetic.  22" Youth Model.  It has choke tubes.  Just what ya need.

cookiemann

If you are worried about bear encounters you could always add a PolyChoke II so ya wouldn't have to worry about doin' a choke change on the fly.

[Woodbutcher]

 This one made me thimk! Trouble fer sure! I figgured I needed a turkey gun, and so got the TDC 12 ga. It wasn't available in any other size at the time. It's my go to gun now! That vent rib is just great! The older H&R 20 ga. sits at home, no vent rib.
 There is a weight difference between the two, but it's not much of an issue at all. The 12 is pretty comfy carrying all day. I used high brass 5's in the 12, and it worked fine for squirrel. Reached out there and did the job. I really can't remember if the recoil was whatever it was, cause I was huntin. The 20 doesn't recoil much even with slugs off the bench.
 I've given thought to working with my 20 to add rifle sights and use it with slugs for deer. For a walking around gun, I think the old 20 would be the best, for me. About like carrying a BB gun, but it sure works on deer. Gotta get close when using shot for smaller critters, though.
 Of course you had to add bears to the mix. I hope your chances of bear encounter are very slight. Have you ever considered an anti-aircraft gun? A bit heavier, but would be a better choice for bear!   
 

[SDS-GEN]

The 20 will work great unless you have lots of mad bears in your area.  The 12 may be more versatile (more load offerings)?  As far as recoil in slugs - have you tried the new reduced recoil slugs?  I have a couple of sawed off 12's and with bird shot recoil is no big deal, buck shot & slugs definately kick but its not unmanageable.  Once you cut the choke off I bet the slugs are fairly accurate.

[Markus]

I can tell you what I came up with as the best combination. I got an old 12ga survivor with a nickle 22"mod barrel Changed ou the survivor stock for a standard synthetic stock and kept the store arm fore end. It is a great little gun to carry but not the most fun to shoot slugs out of. I shot a couple slugs through it today off hand at about 50 yards and both were within a minute of deer accuracy. I shoot this gun very little but carry it a lot. The 22"barrel and the synthetic stock make it ballance right at the receiver.  My wife saw the way it rocked me on recoil and said I'll never shoot that! A recent post talked about bug out gear and this gun is definetly part of my kit. I took a pic today I'll try to get posted tomorrow. Chance of a bear encounter would definitlly lead me towards the 12ga.

[LEO]

I have a 22" "youth" 12 gauge barrel fitted to my handi-rifle.  It is a modified choke and does really well, I have a Sims recoil pad on the stock so the recoil even with slugs is manageable.  I have thought about cutting it to 18.5 fitting rifle sights and choke tubes but haven't so far (to cheap to spend the 80 bucks to have the chokes installed).  The 22" is handy enough and shoots shot, buck and slugs plenty good enough for a walking around gun.  The only modifications I have made is I burnished the bore, instructions can be found on this forum, and the blue was pitiful on the barrel so I used spray paint to camo it, did this about 6 or 8 months ago and it is holding up well with no rust issues anymore.  Previously every trip a field would result in a orange tinge to the gun by the time I got back home. I also intend to put a barrel band sling swivel on it because the forearm one doesn't allow the shotgun to hang correctly when over the shoulder, not an issue on a hunting gun because it is in hand but for a walking around gun it would be more comfortable.  Another route I am thinking about and probably will do is having one of the 22" 20gauge barrels with screw in tubes fitted, I don't worry about bears where I am at so the extra power of a 12 gauge is not an issue.  Also if you are talking about black bears, the 20 should be plenty for defense situations as your only real hope would be a head/cns shot anyway and the 20 gauge slug is up to this, I don't know enough about brown bears however to say one way or the other.  Either way you go though you will probably be happy with your shotgun because they make great woods loafing guns.

[Markus]

I finally figured out how to post a pic. Here's a pic of my truck/woods gun.

[Swampman]

For general woodsbummin' I prefer the 20.  If I'm serious huntin' I take the 12.  I have a 16 too.

The ammunition weight is a factor I consider.  When woodsbummin' I carry 25 rounds.  When serious hunting I carry 5.

[KPD]

Thanks to everone for your response!

The other day, I went to the gun shop (still undecided). The only modles that the gun shop had were the .410 and 20ga. Needless to say, the 20 followed me home. For the price, I am quite pleased with the quality, it handles nicely, and locks up tight.

Question: where is the best place to mount a front sling stud? On the forestock, or on the barrel with one of those clamps designed for a mag tube?

Thanks!


KPD

[Swampman]

Here's one I built from leftover parts.  I believe this picture also appears in this issue of "The Backwoodsman" magazine.

[FOX22250]

go with the 20ga

[Cookiemann]

It may just be me, but I too, find the sling carry uncomfortable with the front swivel on the forend.  I want to get a barrel band swivel and try that.  The only gun of mine that I have used a sling on is my Tracker I.  It is also possible that my choice of sling was not the best, as I have never purchased or used one before.  The Uncle Mike's kits are not too expensive.  If I had to start from scratch, I would opt for the barrel band set up.  Just my 2 cents, since you asked.

cookiemann

[Markus]

The sling mount is in a lot better place IMHO on the store arm forend. You should give one of them a try Cookieman.

[Cookiemann]

Yeah, I think that forend is a bit longer than the standard wooden one, and also its placement puts the swivel a couple inchs more forward, too.  I really like the looks of your truck gun.  I will just have to play around with my stocks and see what I can come up with.  Can ya order that forend by itself from Choate or must you order the set?

[Markus]

Last time I looked you could just order the fore end. I bought an old survivor and just didn't like the stock for a gun with that much recoil.

[gimphunter]

You can order the forend by itself from Choate, or, maybe cheaper, from Midway.

Markus, I managed to smack myself in the head with the scope on my light-kicking 20 ga Tracker II with the Survivor stock, when I forgot to put the Limbsaver large slip-on pad on it. The length of pull is too short, and the narrow, round, hard plastic butt is hard on the shoulder. The Limbsaver pad fixes those problems, and I actually like the two together for hard-kicking 12 ga magnum turkey loads. I hope I like it on my new 30-06 Ultra Survivor.

[dpastordan]

Understand your dilmenna.  The 20 gauge is a good choice.  I had to make a choice one time for different reasons.  In 1980 I had a deer hunting trip planned and three days before some thug broke into my house and stole all four of my fiirearms.  I needed a gun fast so I went to KMart and bought an H&R Topper in 12 gauge for 45 bucks and picked up a box of 00 Buck and 3 boxes of slugs.  It has a modified choke and 3 inch chamber.  At 30 yards the 00 buck patterned well - all within a 12 inch circle.  At 45 yards I could put the bead on the top of a 9 inch target and hit the bottom - in a 3 inch group.  I was living in North Carolina where buckshot was legal. The patterns at 25 yards were acceptable with 6 and 7 1/2 shot.  That was my woods gun, truck gun, teach my boys to shoot skeet gun, and go-to gun for self-defense.  The only drawback was the recoil with 3 inch shells and slugs.  In 20 years I had to replace the transfer bar twice.  After the second time, I sold it.

I now have a 20 gauge Tracker I with a cylinder bore and sights.  Don't have bears in Southern Maryland and the deer tend to dress between 90-120 pounds.  It will be my new woods gun, go to defense gun, and teach my grandson to shoot skeet.