Why a 405G bullet in the 45/70?

[Ranger J]

This question doesn’t amount to much but it has been bothering me for some time.  Why the odd weight for the bullet in 45/70?  Was 405G originally the weight that the military loaded them at and if so why did they choose this weight?  I’m just curious, does any out there know for sure?
RJ

[Almtnman]

I think the 405 grain bullet was the standard size when the 45/70 came out. It seems to do better with that size or at least in mine it does. You can get an even larger bulllet, I think a 500 grain. I load mostly the 405 grain and 300 grain bullets in mine. I liked the 405 grain better but the 300 grain hollowpoints serve my purpose for deer hunting and don't have as bad of kick.

[moxgrove]

Believe it or not the dept of the Army used exhaustive testing to determine the proper weight to put the right compression on the black powder in the cases. They apparently went up and down in weight after dterminin the powder loads they wanted and then went from there as far as accuracy and variance on the pendulum. I read this in an old American rifleman about 25 years ago in my high school library when I was supposed to be studying. Who says I was wasting my time? Anyway that's what I read. I haven't looked in any other sources to verify. It seemed logical and wouldn't surprise me in the least if the Army did spend months and months working on it. Some things never change.

[ggeilman]

The military chose 500gr originally. It was changed late to 405. As to why, it was tested at the Sandy Hook Trials:

http://www.researchpress.co.uk/targets/sandyhook.htm

[ihuntbucks]

I'm like Almntman.I load 300 and 405 also.The 405 is more accurate in my 95 Marlin.A buddy of mine and myself shot 10 rounds each 3 times from !00 yrds. and both of us were better with the 405.Of course we were only off an inch or so.Probably doesn't matter cuz inch off or not,what you hit is going down anyway ........Rick

[jhalcott]

  ihunt ,please do NOT say that! I helped find a deer that was shot with a 45-70 trapdoor rifle. The shooter hit it behind the ribs with a 405 factory load from less than 100 yards. We tracked it for over 300 yards and the shooter MISSED . It jumped up and ran another 200 yards ,dropping gut contents along the way..Another hunter killed it with a 243 as it staggered past his stand.

[Almtnman]

Them gut shots hardly ever put a deer down no matter what you shoot them with. ihuntbucks was talking about an inch off, not way off. Sounds like the problem wasn't the gun or the load, it was the shooter. 

That shooter would have probably got the same results using a 155mm howitzer. 

[swampthing]

500 was the original, as time went on it was determined that the 405 was "the best compromise," if you could call it that, offering good accuracy, takedown power at range, and more managable recoil.
  405g was probably what fell out of the particular mold they were using during testing, with thier particular alloy of choice. This weight in a hardcast LBT and I would hunt anywhere I want.

[ihuntbucks]

  ihunt ,please do NOT say that! I helped find a deer that was shot with a 45-70 trapdoor rifle. The shooter hit it behind the ribs with a 405 factory load from less than 100 yards. We tracked it for over 300 yards and the shooter MISSED . It jumped up and ran another 200 yards ,dropping gut contents along the way..Another hunter killed it with a 243 as it staggered past his stand.

Factory load...trapdoor...that's the two keys here.I have NEVER use a factory load in my 95.Mine are load 1 step from "top load".I promise you 1 inch will not make any difference ........Rick