Hollow Pointing Cast Lead

[scout34]

Browsing through the Midway catalog the other night, I noticed the Forster Hollow Pointing setup.

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=371968

Wondered if I could do the same thing with my RCBS trimmer.  I found that a 5/32 drill bit fits in the pilot hole perfectly, and will drill a hole as neat as you please.  I could use the Lyman 170gr SWFP mould and make 158gr SWC HP bullets too.

Does anyone have any experience with this technique?

[Lloyd Smale]

how does this work? What holds the bullet while you drill it?

[BCB]

This is a test.  If the picture shows up, I will try to discribe it...BCB

Part2...You may have to click on the URL to see the actual hollow pointer set up.  It is used with the Forster Case trimmer.  You hollow point the bullet after it is loaded into the cartridge.  The loaded round is held in place as it would be if you were trimming it.  The black sleeve slides over the bullet and centers it while the drill bit is in place.  They you just turn and drill a hole in the bullet.  I will post a picture of a finished round if someone requests it or if I get ambitious.  It is labor intesive, but the finished product is O.K...Maybe.  Good-luck...BCB

Let's try this again...

[quickdtoo]

BCB, I fixed it for ya. Click modify, and you can see what I did to fix it. The Image URL needs to end with .jpg or other pic file extension to work with the Image tags. To get that .jpg URL, right click any pic and choose properties. Hunt101 has the image URL already formatted for ya in your gallery there.

Tim

[BCB]

quickdtoo,
Thanks, but I will have to study what you did a bit more.  I just entered 2 more URL's to my previous post.  Someday I might learn to do this picture posting correctly--ain't too computer knowledgeable...BCB

[scout34]

Yep, that's the one.  However, being that I am notoriously cheap and didn't want to spring for a Forster trimmer, I just chucked a loaded round into my RCBS trimmer, and loaded a 5/32" drill bit into the pilot.  I don't actually have the #6 collet needed for the .38/.357 case, so I used a #3 for .308.  Results in an off center hole, but this is just a test.  Correct collet is on the way and we will see if it is able to stay centered.  Lead being as soft as it is, I anticipate no problems with drill deflection like you see when drilling harder materials.

Do these bullets work well like this though?

[quickdtoo]

BCB,

Down at the bottom of those link pages you added, you'll see instructions on how to post those pics. To use the "Image Link" just above those instructions, you would paste the image link(http://www.hunt101.com/img/486511.jpg) between the image tags and  using the Insert Image button above the post window so that it looks like this {img}http://www.hunt101.com/img/486511.jpg{/img} but replace the { } with [ ]. Notice your cursor will be between the image tags when you hit the Insert Image button, that's where the image URL needs to be placed and it must end with a .jpg or other image file type like .gif.

You can also attach the photo as a clickable thumbnail if the pic is saved on your PC, use the Additional options below the new post text window, just hit the browse button and find it on you PC and select it.

Tim

[BCB]

quickdtoo,
Yep, I figured out to paste between the brackets!  I did get the 2 other pictures posted on my previous post.  I didn't know if a thumbnail could be posted or not.  I will give that a try in the test page section and see what happens.  Thanks again...BCB

[BCB]

scout34,

The setup on the left of my photos is for the 357 Magnum.  Years ago, the hollow pointer was specific for cartridge, i.e., 38 Special or 357 Magnum and I suppose, 357 Maximum would work in the one indicated.  The one on the right is what is offered now and it is to be “universal”.  Well, I guess it is as the sleeve is tapered in the inside and it will center whatever bullet is place again the interior.  The drill bit helps align it to center as the collet that holds the loaded round is tightened.

Both of these types are extremely labor intensive and quite slow.  I use them for specialty rounds only.  I have had the 357 Magnum one for a good many years and yes, the hollow pointer does help to start the cast bullet to expand on impact.  I have tested a good many shooting into catalogs and expansion is fair.  I was only using wheel weights as the alloy back then. 

I purchased the “universal” one to test 44 Magnum cast slugs. (I was hoping they had the old style hollow pointer, but it is discontinued.)  I am using it with the RCBS 44-250-K bullet—a Keith style slug.  These bullets are cast from pure lead, so I am hoping for good expansion—we shall see as the weather improves a bit.

One bit of information—the Forster case trimmer has different length bases.  I have all 3 lengths.  I think you need the middle length or possible the longest length to have enough distance between the collet and the drill bit.  I had the longest on in place so that is why I used it.  The short one won’t work.  So, all of this can get expensive if you haven’t previously acquired the case trimmer for its intended purpose.  I have had mine for dozens of years, so an accessory is just a bit of upgrade.

I would be surprised if you can keep the drill bit centered without some type of support.  I am not real familiar with the RCBS case trimmer, but maybe it is better equipped to do this rather than the Forster.

Maybe as I try a few of the slugs for expansion, I can post some pictures in the future.  Good-luck…BCB

[HEAD0001]

We(couple of friends and myself) have been playing around with hollow pointing cast bullets for quit some time.  We managed to get good results(consistency).  We managed to shoot a few deer over the years with these HP"s.  We could not find any difference.  IMO our tests were in no way scientific, just a few experiences. 

When casting pure lead, and keeping velocity below 1400 fps, we could not find any expansion differences.  It did seem that the HP's retained less lead, but we only found two bullets.  When we bumped velocity up to 1600 fps we went to a #2 alloy.  Then we hardened our bullets as we stepped up to 1800 fps.  Our experience was that the harder the bullet, the more the HP bullet would not hold together.

We ended our HP exploits, and went to larger meplat molds.  Again our experiences are far from scientific, but IMO the larger meplat is the way to go.  I am ordering a 500 S&W barrel for my Encore.  I am looking forward to playing with this baby.  It should have a large meplat area, and I can not imagine this size hole we will get.  I am going to keep velocity around 1300-1400 fps with as large of a bullet as I can get to that velocity.  This should be alot of fun.  Tom.

[BCB]

HEAD0001,

You are correct about the harder bullets not performing well when hollow pointed.  As I mentioned, wheel weights were all I used with the 357 Magnum and I think that alloy is too hard for expansion even when hollow pointed.  It did expand, but it was not the classic “mushroom”.  Hollow pointing bullets with a BHN of greater than 8 or 9 are most likely a futile effort.  And, as you mentioned, hard bullets will not maintain integrity when hollow pointed.  The alloy becomes brittle and instead of peeling back and forming a mushroom, it shatters and shards of lead separate from the original bullet.

Some time ago, a person who posts on another website sent me some lead tips he makes that will fit the nose profile of the Lyman 429650 (315 grains) and the 44-250-K bullets.  I would drop the tip in the hot mold and fill the rest with Lyman #2 alloy.  These bullets could be pushed at near top 44 Magnum velocity and expanding was quite acceptable, even though the tip was not hollow pointed.  This person cast some very nice tips and I mentioned that if he ever decided to produce that mold to cast those tips, I wanted to be 1st on this list…

Now, I do think the pure lead bullets when hollow pointed will expand.  I am hoping to get 50% larger diameter of the expansion than the actual diameter of the bullet.  That equates to around 0.65”.  If I can get that, I will be happy.  Whether that can be done in actual hunting practices, I don’t know and it will be extremely difficult to tell.

A large meplat is indeed the way to go.  After all, did Elmer know that many years ago?...BCB

[scout34]

I was looking for a way to make some hollow points for a 2" snub in .38.  I've been loading the inverted HBWCs but the more I look at it the more gimmicky that seems.  Lyman makes the "Devastator" mold in 124gr HP, but it is a single cavity and that seems pretty labor intensive.  I think that the easiest way to go would be to buy HP bullets for carry loads and cast equal weight bullets for practice.  I already go with SWCs and wide meplats for hunting.

[RamSlammer]

G'Day All
           Some time ago I cast some pure lino hollow points for shooting Wallaby(small kangaroo). When head shot it would look like a hand grenade had gone off on their neck and then you would see the base?? of the bullet hit further up the paddock. I can tell you that lino woun't hold together when hollow pointed.
Juddy

[BCB]

Here are a couple of pictures of the results of hollow pointing some pure lead bullets and fired into newspaper (wet and tied together loosely) at 50 yards.  The velocities are noted on the picture.  The slower velocity is basically a plinking load using WW-230 and the faster is a heavier load using a near maximum charge of 2400.  I was going to try the same test at 25 yards, but the results at 50 indicated I would do as well or maybe better at 25 yards.  I guess I can say that the hollow pointer seems to do what it was designed to do.  It is labor intensive to hollow point the bullets, but for my use they are specialty reloads and hollow pointing bunches of them won’t be required….BCB