A bit of a paper patch problem

[crow_feather]

O K,  I'm at the range, I load my first pp cartridge and shoot - no problem.  Try to load second one and it won't go in the last .020 unless tapped in with a flat dowel.  I clean the bore and the first round goes in easily again.  After tapping the second round into the chamber, I pull it out and find that the paper is slightly rubbed away.  So I cut the paper from around the  exposed lead in front of the case so the only patch is covered by the case.  It goes in easily but accuracy is terrible.

After I make the cartridge, I wipe residual lube from the paper in front of the case.  Does this paper need to be lubed in order for the cartridge to seat, or do I need to reduce the cartridge length?

[arnie19]

You need to clean between shots or use a slightly smaller diameter bullet which can also be done with thinner paper ,or seat the bullet deeper in the case .I vote for cleaning between shots and a little lube rubbed on the paper just before you fire them .Arnie

[Castaway]

I lube too.  Are you shooting black powder or smokeless?

[Lead pot]

You need to wipe or use a blow tube with PP, or at least make a chamber swab.
If you dont want to blow or wipe the bore you will not get the accuracy your looking for.
You can put all of the lube in the case you want it wont help, in fact you might be better off not using any lube at all, but regardless your patch will be damaged and pore accuracy.
If you want to shoot a PP bullet you must control the fouling!


Kurt

[arnie19]

Kurt ,I'm glad you said that ,i have always thought that PP bullets needed clean barrels to get the best accuracy There have been so many claiming  great  accurracy with dirty barrels that i was hesitant to say any thing.I never could get target accuracy from pp loads with grease wads  .My 45/90 Pedersoli shoots paper patch real good and the same load wont shoot in my sharps .The guy i shoot with is thinking that its probably the taperd or chocked barrel on the Pedersoli that helps to cut the paper clean and makes the PP bullets work better than in my sharps.They both shoot the same grease groove bullet about the same .Arnie 

[Lead pot]

Arnie,
I use a 3/16 lube wad but it needs to be on the soft side.
Using lube like SPG sandwiched between two .020 cards I find them with in 50 feet just like they were loaded except for the land cuts on the sides.
I use a 50/50 mix of hard tallow or soy wax and Jojoba oil or Mineral oil. The wads I find are just about void of lube maybe the thickness of a dime will still be between the two cards.
When I breach seat some times I use no lube and no wads but I swab the barrel when time allows.
It's interesting when you use no lube there is a brighter barrel then when you  use lube. I found that last fall when I was fighting a lead problem with one of my rifles and I took a Haw-key bore scope to the range to see what was going on from shot to shot.
When I used a round with lube the lube collected on the leading edge of the land and groove with heavy fouling and with out lube the bore had very little.
But in a short time lead starts to build up unless the bore was swabbed. It's best to use lube, a little 3/16" lube cookie will do just as much as 1/2" will.
Some place here I have a picture posted using a lube wad with the .50/90.
By the way my lead problem was from cases to short for the chamber.


Kurt

[arnie19]

Kurt ,i wouldn't think you would get leading with a paper patched bullet.That's why i started using them in my 45/90 .Absolutely no leading .I lube my bullets after they are patched and dried .I use Dans white lightning lube for dipping ,i lube them as close as i can to match day so the lube doesn't creep through the paper to the bullet.Arnie

[Lead pot]

Well Arnie I dont anymore.
My patch was getting cut off right at the case mouth and that left the back 1/4" of the bullet exposed. I have a chamber that is 2.412" long and the cases are 2.395".
That cut the patches at the case mouth and also the obtruded lead that was pushed in that gap was shaved off and that was ironed to the throat all the way to were the back sight is.
Now with proper fitting cases the problem is gone.

Kurt

[crow_feather]

Thank you for your input.  My bullets are store bought .452 diameter in 410 and 450 grains, that go to .457 diameter after 2 wraps of buffalo arms patching paper.  Before, I was unable to wipe the bore except from the end of the barrel.  Now that I have scoped the rifle, I will try wiping the bore/chamber from the easier side.  I can also try the tube now.

C F