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Offline Arkey

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scope vs. red dots
« on: May 20, 2003, 03:10:06 PM »
Hey guys, me again.  Thanks for the help on the other scope issue.  What do you think about a red dot vs a scope under 100 yds.  How are tough are they on a ruger redhawk 44 mag?  Thanks fo rthe help again.
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Offline Chris

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scope vs. red dots
« Reply #1 on: May 20, 2003, 07:20:44 PM »
Arkey:

Red dots used to target under one-hundered yards, in low light conditions, or in the deer woods...are hard to beat.  Here's some info that might help with your decision/search:

http://www.ultradotusa.com/

http://www.ar15-rifles.com/shop/index.php?shop=1&cat=5&cart=11361

Be Safe!   ...Chris    :D
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Offline Questor

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scope vs. red dots
« Reply #2 on: May 21, 2003, 03:13:06 AM »
I use the red dots almost exclusively for competitive pistol shooting. I use scopes almost exclusively for hunting.  That's a good system. Field of view is a huge problem with many red dots.  But there are some, like the Docter sight, that has excellent field of view. Unfortunately that sight is not weather resistant.  If you're just getting started in this, then take note of what the most experienced people are using. You'll find that the great majority are using scopes specifically designed for handgun hunting.  

My preference for that gun would be the Leupold 2x. It's a light, tough scope with crosshairs that are heavier than most handgun scopes, and that helps when hunting in dim light.
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Offline HoCoMDHunter

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scope vs. red dots
« Reply #3 on: May 21, 2003, 03:59:00 AM »
I'm not sure I agree with Questor on the FOV issue.  In my limited experience the red dots have had greater FOV because they have no magnification.  Otherwise I agree.   I have a nice little BSA red dot on a 22 pistol.  It has great field of view and fast target acquisition.  The red dots allow for a faster acquisition because there aren't any eye relief issues.  However, there is no way I would put that scope on a 44 mag. I doubt it would hold up to the recoil.   I would suggest that you try both before you decide.  For under 100 yds a red dot would do fine.  The 2x leupold would be an excellent choice though.  Check out Ebay, they usually go for around 150.
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Offline HoCoMDHunter

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scope vs. red dots
« Reply #4 on: May 21, 2003, 05:03:47 AM »
I stand corrected.  Wow! If a $35 red dot can handle real recoil then I would say it is an excellent value.  Wonder if it would work on my 454...
BTW the 454 has a Bushnell Elite 2-6 on it and I love it.
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Offline Ron T.

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scope vs. red dots
« Reply #5 on: May 21, 2003, 06:59:57 AM »
I’ve got a red dot sight on my Ruger Mark II bull-barreled target pistol and I’ve shot scope-equipped handguns and rifles for many years.

Frankly, in low light conditions, the red dot might be great for hunting.  However, I’d prefer to have a 1x-4x variable scope with heavy “plex” crosshairs than a red dot scope because batteries don’t last forever… and it would be just my luck to have the battery go “bad” just as a trophy buck appeared within range.

Hopefully, some smart scope manufacturer will come out with a LIGHTED, heavy-to-thin plex crosshair scope in a long eye-relief pistol scope… perhaps it will even be available in a 1x-4x or a 1.5x to 5x variable, eh?

As for target shooting, it’s the shooter’s preference.  Again, I’ve shot both and each has their advantages & disadvantages.

Good Shooting!

Ron T.
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Offline Questor

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scope vs. red dots
« Reply #6 on: May 21, 2003, 07:26:50 AM »
HoCoMDhunter:

What kind of red dots are you using? Mine are made for target shooting and I get just enough FOV to see the bull and the target and not much else. I've used Tasco Propoint, Aimpoint, Ultradot, and Docter. The first three are about the same for FOV.  This is for pistol shooting only. I haven't tried red dots on rifles.
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Offline HoCoMDHunter

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« Reply #7 on: May 21, 2003, 08:02:02 AM »
I have this one on a Beretta Neos:
http://www.bsaoptics.com/productdetail.asp?ID=358&Prod_Code=RD30SIL
The site doesn't give a FOV so I couldn't give you a number.  There is no magnification on this and unlimited eye relief, so the FOV kinda depends on the distance of your eye to the scope.  I'll pull it out tonight and give my best estimate of the FOV at say 25 yds.
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Offline HoCoMDHunter

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scope vs. red dots
« Reply #8 on: May 21, 2003, 08:21:30 AM »
Found the FOV specs here:
http://www.bsaoptics.com/comparisonchart.asp
About 3/4 the way down the page.  68ft @ 100 yds.
Like I said the FOV depends on the distance of your eye to the scope.  The stated spec may be with the eye at 3".  I suspect that it will be about half that when used on a pistol.  Still not too shabby.
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Offline Raging480

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scope vs. red dots
« Reply #9 on: May 22, 2003, 02:51:30 AM »
I like my Ultra Dot on my .480, I have been shooting it for over two years, with no recoil problems.  I even dropped it out of a tree while bear hunting!  When I am in the woods, I usually don't leave it on, or I will leave it on a very light setting.  If things are slow, I will then turn it on for the last half hour of light before the sun goes down.  I have never had a problem where I spooked game by adjusting the dial before a shot.  And I am still on the original battery.
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Offline Hcliff

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scope vs. red dots
« Reply #10 on: May 22, 2003, 04:32:37 AM »
Like like scope better.  Fine point for accuracy.  My Dad like red dot.  THey don't show the "shake" as much as a scope and don't "black out" when not in the correct focal plane.

RonT I think that TC makes lighted recticle scope for hand guns (I could be wrong using my brain but saw one a gun shop a year ago)

Hcliff
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Offline Ron T.

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scope vs. red dots
« Reply #11 on: May 22, 2003, 05:10:34 AM »
Thanx, Hcliff......

Someone else told me that Bushnell has a scope with an illuminated crosshair.  The crosshair is "charged up" by shining a flashlight through the scope for a minute or so which causes the crosshair to "glow".

But thanx for being so kind as to mention it...

Strength & Honor...

Ron T.
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"The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government."  - Thomas Jefferson

Offline c mac

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scope vs. red dots
« Reply #12 on: May 22, 2003, 06:20:12 AM »
every one is talking about field of view. What about depth of field. With a red dot you can shoot with both eyes open. With a scope you lose your depth of field. Is that tree that deer is walking toward going to be behind or in front of him???? My vote is for red dot for hunting.
c mac
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Offline Raging480

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scope vs. red dots
« Reply #13 on: May 23, 2003, 02:15:21 AM »
Hey C Mac, are you still looking for a 4" 657?  If so, I know where one is for sale, out here near Syracuse.  My e-mail is REO341@aol.com.
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Offline c mac

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« Reply #14 on: May 23, 2003, 03:08:59 PM »
No. But thanks. I picked up my new 657ch tonight.  Hope none of my neighbors want to sleep late tomorrow.
c mac
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Offline Big

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UltraDot
« Reply #15 on: May 27, 2003, 06:36:07 PM »
I have an UltraDot (1" tube) on my Ruger Super Red Hawk (.44), and it works great.  Hasn't changed zero after a few hundred rounds (not all in the same day, thanks!), and I'm still on the original battery after two years (I'm sure this varies for others; I always carry an extra).  Still waiting to hunt with it, though; can't use rifles/handguns for deer in my county.

FOV should be a non-issue with a red dot.  If you keep both eyes open and focus on the target with the scope in front of your master eye, the dot will appear to be "out there" at the target.  I don't "look through" the tube in the same way as with a regular scope.

Ron, UltraDot, among others, makes a crosshair/magnified scope with an illuminated reticle.  And no, I don't work for UltraDot!  :)
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Offline les hemby

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lighted scope
« Reply #16 on: June 08, 2003, 02:13:41 PM »
ron t check out T/C 2.5x7 lighted reticle pistol scope in fox ridge custom T/C shop i think this is what u r looking for mine is great
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Offline Ron T.

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scope vs. red dots
« Reply #17 on: June 08, 2003, 04:12:48 PM »
Thanx for the suggestions, guys... I appreciate your efforts.

Ron T.
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"The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government."  - Thomas Jefferson

Offline WildBill

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scope vs. red dots
« Reply #18 on: June 11, 2003, 09:10:37 AM »
I have a bushnell halosight on my 454 Raging Bull And it works great. My nephew has a BSA on his 44 Mag Smith which he shoots hot 300 grain loads in to hunt with which also works fine especially for the price. By the way we both shoot ALOT !!
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