AD Incidents as Reminders

[rimfire]

Ladies and Gentlemen,

As I have gotten older, and presumably [arguable] wiser, I have become convinced that the chances of never having an AD if you handle firearms enough are zero.  We are all human and it happens.  Whether tragedy or learning experience depends on your discipline regarding muzzle awareness.  Ten years ago I would have argued with you that with the proper mindset it would never happen.  Well I was ignorant.  Thankfully,the relatively few incidents [not all by me thank God] that have convinced my otherwise have all been learning experiences.

If you truly believe you are immune I beg you to continue to practice muzzle control so WHEN it happens you are simply embarrassed as hell. 

Among close friends I have direct knowledge of two trucks being shot and three holes in the ground not dug by shovels within the past two years.  No one was hurt in any case, but the impact on our psyches was significant.  I personally was somewhat devastated with the idea I was that human [!] in all seriousness.

If you are so inclined I would like to hear of other's experiences with ADs.  Guys and Gals I know they can be embarrassing, so feel free to e-mail me separately from separate accounts to wfngc@yahoo.com with AD in the subject line.  I will summarize without names and add to this string in a week or so if I get a few responses.  I assure you I will double, triple and quadruple check and make damn sure no names or e-mail addresses show up in the posting of your story.

Sincerely, humanly,

Barry aka Rimfire

[jhm]

@ times a AD occured that I am aware of a individual entered the Pawn Shop I am involved with wanting to Pawn his rifle, My buddy ask him if rifle was unloaded and of course he answered it was and then it went OFF they didnt see where the bullet went and it scared my buddy so bad he told the fellow to leave his shop, the next day the police came in and asked if their had been a AD in the shop and he responded YES yesterday but he didnt find the bullet hole, they told him it went out the front of the building across a major hi-way and had struck a pick-up truck sitting in the Sonic parking lot.  The other one is the one that got one of our local police officers the nick-name of DOORKNOB, as he was behind the police station draying his weapon and pointing it at the door knob on the back door, yes you guessed it the weapon fired and he did get the door knob, I believe he almost lost his job over it.   JIM

[Ole Man Dan]

Rimfire:

I've been a Policeman for more than 30 years, and a Firearms Instructor since the early 80s, I go to 'Cowboy shoots' every month.  So... I've seen too many examples of ADs.  (Scares the crap out of me...)  I've see cars shot, an elevator, a homicidal closet, and lots of holes punched in the dirt.  You are so right.  Its all about everyone paying attention, and keeping the muzzle pointing in a safe direction, and most important to "Keep your finger off of the trigger untill you are ready to fire".
I'll get off of my 'soapbox' now.  (The very best safety device is located behind the gun)

[quickdtoo]

Here's one...

http://dishhead.home.insightbb.com/leg.html

[corbanzo]

Few years ago a roommate of my brothers had an AD, shot through the ceiling (downwards) and into my brother's closet, through a pair of pants.  He still has those pants.  Always looks at the holes and says....  thank god those weren't the one's I was wearing....

[Luckyducker]

I have an embarrassing story about an AD that happened when my kids were all still home.  My wife and I took our two sons and one daughter and another boy who is a friend of my boys to shoot some clay pigeons in the country.  They were all teenagers at this time.  My kids had their own shotguns and my wife doesn't shoot much so we just share our guns with her.  I let the friend use an old 12 Gauge pump shotgun that had been my grandfathers.  After we had been throwing and shooting for a while, Dave (the friend), came to me and said the gun he was using jammed so I traded with him so he could continue to shoot.  The jammed gun's bolt would only open about an inch and would close but not lock shut.  I messed with it a little and asked Dave if there was a live round or an empty in the chamber, he said he wasn't sure.  When we were done shooting we packed up the van and went home but when we started unloading we found that my daughter had left her shotgun leaning against a fence post so my wife took her back to get it.  My oldest son went into my wife and I's bedroom to call his girlfriend in private and Kyle and Dave were in Kyle's room.  I laid the jammed shotgun on the kitchen table and starting trying to get the action open on it.  BTW, I had tried to fire the gun before bringing it home to no avail.  The safety was engaged and wouldn't release and I tried several times to get it to switch to the fire position and the last time I really beared down on that switch.  Well, it finally moved and when it did the gun discharged without my finger or anything else touching the trigger.  I forgot to mention that Kyle and Dave had migrated to the kitchen to find something cold to drink.  The shot blew a hole in Dave's baggy shorts but didn't touch his leg, thank God.  The shot then entered a lower cupboard and went into a box of microwave popcorn which stopped it from going through the wall into the garage.  I had to buy Dave new shorts and make a new pair of  cupboard doors and am so thankful that was all the damage.

[Dusty Miller]

There's no such thing as an "accidental discharge" (when it comes to firearms!).  What you are really talking about is "mishandling a firearm" and the two are very distinctly differents things altogether.

[rockbilly]

I fully concur there is no such thing as an AD, plainly and simply, someone done something stupid!  I speak from a personal experience of being stupid, but since that incident I have become overly cautious with a firearm, and all are loaded until I have personally checked to ensure they are are not, I TAKE NO ONES WORD FOR IT!

Back in the mid-sixties, while in the Air Force, I earned a spot on the base pistol team.  We were each issued two .45s and a .22, we also had an unlimited supply of ammo, which I took advantage of.  I had been to the range and had taken a couple of personal revolvers with me for practice.  When the practice was finished I checked the guns, put them in the pistol box and went home to get ready for a party that night.  When I arrived home I went into the bedroom to put the pistol box in a closet, I remembered my personal guns were in the box so i opened it and removed them.  I placed the .22 on the shelve in the closet, in doing so I noticed one of our kid's toys in the hallway just outside the bedroom door.  I aimed the .357 at the toy and pulled the trigger..........bang, the gun was loaded.  The bullet struck the floor in the hallway, ricocheted and hit the base of a commode in the bathroom across the hall, it exploded into a million pieces.  I had water running everywhere until I could get the valve turned off, and then a hell of a mess to clean up.  At that time we only had one bathroom, it was near 6 PM on a Saturday, and at that time nothing was open on Sundays.  I am luck I had a five gallon bucket and some plastic bags.

This act of stupidity almost cost more than I was will to pay, when I fired the gun my 4 year old son was in the hallway playing with the toy, I couldn't see him at the time, but he was less than four feet away.  Today, with the exception of my carry gun which is always loaded, I check each gun at the range or in the field before going home, and I check them again before taking them in the house.

[Dusty Miller]

Pulling the trigger on a gun whilst in the house for anything other than a legitimate self-defense shoot is verboten!!  If one just HAS to pull the trigger then simply take the gun outside and point it at the ground (assuming you are living in a rural area). 

[odoh]

I was air force but was atchd to the army w/McNamara 100,000 sub-standard draftees (spin-off from the Cassius Clay thingy) for a yr in 'nam. There were always 'friendly rounds' sailing around not to mention artillary and mortars even.  Invaribily, it was determined 'cleaning' on the small arms and damp powder on the heavier short rounds.

When it was finished for me I was back w/the normal AF in Japan and back to my radio maint afsc. One night the radio opr was 'cleaning' his 38 revolver and shot the stablized master osc on one of the HF sets. In panic, he tried tuning another radio set to cover the freq rather than call me out and it was like dominoes. When I arrived in the morning, all the rigs were down except for a suit case set. HQ SAC was on the secured line trying to find out what was shaking.

Finally, for a really shumdit situation; as a recently discharge vet in the early 70's trying to hold everything together, I had traded for a 308 Rem Mohawk. I knew of rem recall for triggers and dutifully called in the s/n of my new found treasure. The temp help chkd the s/n and said it was safe and not subj to recall. I had loaded up some shells and rather than pay fees at the range and find them not to chamber (Dad had, about that time went hunting w/reloads that weren't correctly/fully resized and had to sit out) I decided to cycle them thru while sitting on our sofa. Some were snug and then one discharged ~ sailed thru 11 Gospel record albums, and keyholed thru the wall and over 2 cars in the drive.

The kids were young enuff to think 'kool' excitement happening around here. Denial set in instantly. Naw, that didn't happen. The possible consequences was too horrific to accept. BUT the gunsmoke was burning my lungs and reality had to be accepted.

Over the next couple of yrs as the various evangelists cycled back thru our church, I was able to replace the record albums but not one of them could fathom how/why their music got shot.

The law of averages has pretyy much been concluded as having no basis in fact but looking back over my life in the solitude of my own thots ~ I shutter.

[corbanzo]

You know, I was thinking about the accidental vs the mishandling thing.  They are the exact same thing.

An accident is something you do unintentionally.  And it can be prevented, and it because somebody did something they were trying to do, or in other words, did something wrong.

So calling something an accident isn't an excuse.

My nephew took a metal clasp out of a hardware store without paying for it, and I looked at him, and asked him why he stole it.  He said, "I didn't mean to, I forgot, it was an accident!"  I told him accident or not, he still did it, and made him walk right back in, give it to the lady at the register, tell her what he had done, and apologize.

Just because it is something like this that didn't really hurt anyone doesn't mean that an "accident" is acceptable. 

So yes, I'll call them accidents.  But no, I will not call them acceptable. 

There comes a time when instead of saying you had an "accident," you say, "I screwed up."

I accidentally almost shot one of my best friends in the foot.  I didn't mean to fire the round.  It was an accident.  I didn't mean to.  The first thing I did was apologize like hell and admit to screwing up. 

Don't let your eight year old nephew redefine the definition of accident for you.  It don't make it OK, but it doesn't mean you meant to do it.

[odoh]

Works for me ~ w/o intent, w/o malice, w/o excuse and acceptance of accountability and responsibility. Sure, why not?

[no guns here]

Had a S&W 1000 20 gauge go off one time without my finger on the trigger.  Just normal carry but I jumped across a puddle in the field and the landing jarred it enough to go off.  Didn't hurt anyone... was pointed safely up and away.  It wasn't loaded again until it was sent for repairs.  It was broken but S&W fixed it.  I think this one qualifies as an "accident".

Accidentally (negligence is the correct word here) shot my F-150's tailgate.  Through and through from the inside out.  Shooting prairie dogs with my AR-15 from the bed rested on a blanket on the cab.  Didn't safe the gun, tried to get out of the truck.  Stumbled over a cement block in the bed and wounded my new truck.  That one was fun to explain at the body shop...  Thank goodness no one was around.  I was by myself and miles from town.  The tailgate was down so the bullet went into the dirt behind the truck.  I got lucky all around.  Body shop wanted big bucks... I just hammered the metal back down as flat as I could with a block of wood to prevent more dents.  Had a high school kid weld up the seams in class as a project.  Then he took a grinder to it to smooth it down.  A couple reps of primer and sanding, then a coat of white paint.  It didn't look real good but a bumper sticker fixed that.  I think he got a "B" on his project.  And yes I did tell the guy who bought it the next year about the "wound".  He happened to like the Sooners too so he didn't mind the bumper sticker.

[odoh]

I could be wrong but I see accident as an event. Negligence as a cause ~

[44 Man]

It's called an 'accidental' discharge when the firearm malfunctions and fires without the trigger being pulled.  It's a 'negligent' discharge when our finger is on the trigger.  And yes, I have put a couple of unintended holes in the dirt myself.  44 Man

[irold]

At 16 years old, hunting bunnies with my Dads double barrel Fox, single trigger.........bunny hops out, I shot it...dog comes immediately to get my bunny, I'm holding the bunny up high so the dog won't eat it with one hand...the other is holding the gun..with a live round in the other barrel....yep, it went off ! about 2 inches from my right foot, big smokey hole in ground.   Scared me to death ...only AD I've ever had.   That was almost 40 years ago

[warrior1]

always think safety.

[Wingman26]

I had a cousin that had a negligent discharge while he was rabbit hunting, it was his first, and last...they buried him a few days later.