I have several 1885's. I have a 17Mach 2 that shoots about like G Curtis"s. My 223 shoots 1/2' GROUPS WITH MY RELOADS, 1' with most factory loads. My 270WSM does real well to. They are great rifles. I used to be a Ruger No 1 fan but went with the 1885's because my friends that had them could all outshoot me.