Alliant 2400 and 360 DW

[trail trol]

Happy New Year to all,

Well I ended up buying the RCBS 200 grain FP along with some 360 brass for my 357 handi project. It is an awesome mould to work with I have to say. Throws them 358/359, nice and round. Cast some up and started a little work on the load bench with them. I had a hard time finding much data on the 360 dw. And I only have 2400 for magnum powder right now, although I am going to pick up some Lil-Gun and maybe H-110 when I get out to the shop. I started of with a load of 10.5 grains and ran some through at the range today. Decent results at 50. I am still struggling with the trigger on this one (gotta do the trigger job), but they were in the inch and a 1/2ish range, before I would throw one out to open it up to 2. My question is what is a max load for this bullet with 2400? Or does anyone have a good load with 110, Lil-Gun, or the like?



thanxs,

Bill

[quickdtoo]

I haven't loaded mine up yet, was waiting for the bullets to get here, got em now, but got side tracked on the extractor to ejector conversion. Here's the data source I've found, sorry, not 2400 data.

Tim

http://www.lasc.us/RangingShotDanWesson360Revolver.htm

http://www.handloads.org/loaddata/default.asp?Caliber=360%20Dan%20Wesson&Weight=All&type=Handgun&Order=Powder&Source=

[trail trol]

I saw that stuff over on LASC. great article in general! I may have to get that lil-gun sooner.

the boolit is something else when it hits the burm! i have mine cast from range scrap and they weigh in at like 213 grains! I would love to ring some steel with these loads

[WILD_WEASEL]

Hello,
My carbine is at the factory now getting  12Ga and 357mag fitted.  While I'm waiting I've been experimenting with developing dual purpose pistol/Carbine loads, using my 4" Ruger GP100.  I've worked up two loads using the Speer 158gr UCSP, a CCI550 primer, with either 14.5gr of 2400 or 15.5gr H110.  Either load should be doing around 1200fps out of my 4" barrel per the #14 Speer manual.  The loads using 2400 have a great deal of muzzel flash and concusion while the loads using H110 have notably less muzzel flash and concusion.  In the carbine both loads should gain 400fps,with the H110 pulling ahead of 2400.  Reading other posts it would appear that the factory chamber of the H&R 357 is long enuogh to take the 360DW without rechambering, is this true?
Thanks,

[quickdtoo]

There have been numerous threads on the 357 chamber being plenty long for 360DW brass, you might have to trim the brass a little, mine needed to be about .010" shorter or it would be hard to extract, others will fit fine.

Tim

http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/topic,125780.msg1098446320.html#msg1098446320

[GrampaMike]

This is all the 360 Dan Wesson data I have.  I don't have a 360 DW anymore to try, I do have a Handi 357 though, just have not tried 360 DW in it.

360 Dan Wesson
Trim to 1.410”
Bullet: 200 grain Beartooth FN GC
C.O.L. is 1.770” (this is over SAAMI C.O.L. of 1.720”)

Powder

Accurate 4100   13.7 – 13.9 grains    Velocity 1513-1532    PSI 26,127-27,223
Alliant 2400   12.2 grains      Velocity 1537   PSI 27,352
Alliant Blue Dot   10.5 – 10.6 grains   Velocity 1468-1478   PSI 26,526-27,111
Hodgdon LilGun   13.6 – 15.5 grains   Velocity 1462-1656   PSI 18,263-27,246
Ramshot Enforcer   13.0 – 13.3 grains   Velocity 1525-1554   PSI 25,587-27,262
VihtaVuori N105   10.1 – 10.4 grains   Velocity 1443-1472   PSI 24,923-26,906
VihtaVuori N110   12.2 – 13.4 grains   Velocity 1416-1540   PSI 19,128-25,015

Mike

[quickdtoo]

Man, that Lli'gun is right out there in front again, great velocity, comparable pressure.

thanks Mike!!

Tim

[trail trol]

wild weasel------ the 360 brass drops in my chamber NO PROBLEM at  all! I am really wondering if I can get away with Max brass in there!

Grampa ---- Thanks for the data,,,, I was guessing about ten percent up for 2400 from the regular mag loads. Gonna try some at 12.5 and see how they are.

Also saw some info re: extruded vs ball powders and want to look into this a bit. Does the ball cause more erosion? I read something about it being linked to gas cutting in the revolvers? Would it effect the throat in a handi? And which type is less temperature sensitive?

The tinkering will never stop!

thanxs bill

[safetysheriff]

john taffin's website which is either sixguns or sixgunner .com might have an article that will help.

i would use a slower powder than 2400 by Alliant if looking for max' velocity with heavy-for-caliber projectiles.   

ss' 

[trail trol]

Here's an update on the 357 DW load development.  I went al the way up to 15 grain of 2400 with decent results,,,see first target below. But pressure signs where getting there,,flat primers but no cratering. I tried some imr 4227 today and I like the results. See next target.

[coyotejoe]

I see a lot of interest in Lil Gun powder and I understand why, I tried it because it does show higher velocity than other powders from small capacity cases. My experience with Lil Gun has varied from disappointing to down right scary. In the .22 K Hornet I got extreme velocity spreads of more than 300 fps and some shots showed mild pressures while others showed cratered primers. Likewise in .30 carbine, .357 mag and .357 Max, all showed wide variations in pressure indications. All were under maximum listed loads and some primers came out nicely rounded and indicating mild pressures while another primer may be flattened, cratered and even pierced, this in three different rifles and four different calibers, accuracy was poor in all cases. I'd like to hear of others' experience with Lil Gun but my own feeling is that stuff is an unpredictable witch's brew.

[MSP Ret]

Wow, now this is of interest to me, I have been waiting to pick up some Lil'Gun for my .22 Hornet. I have only heard great things about it before for the Hornet. Does anyone else know anything of what coyotejoe is experiencing? Is it an anomaly or could it be a bad a bad batch of powder? OR is it something I can expect from Lil'Gun?....<><....

[quickdtoo]

I used and love Li'gun in the Hornet with the 35gr Vmax, also use it exclusively in the 45 Colt with 2 different bullets and in the 500 S&W with 3 different bullets from 350gr to 700gr, with no issues in any of them.   There is a recall on a batch of Lil'gun powder, it's on their home page.

Tim

[coyotejoe]

Thanks for the heads up on that recall Tim, however mine is a different lot number. The photo, if I managed to get it posted, shows two .357 Max cases, both loaded with 20.0 grains Lil Gun, 180 Remington JHP and CCI small rifle primers, in new, unfired Remington brass. Both were fired in the handi rifle rechambered from .357 mag. I also miked those cases and the one with the rounded primer went .381" at its' largest point while the one with the pierced primer miked .386"

[quickdtoo]

Dunno, but Hodgdon doesn't list Lil'gun for any rifle data and only with 3 bullets in their pistol data, 16-18gr w/158gr XTP, 15-17gr w/Sierra 170gr and 13-15gr w/ a 180gr Nosler PT, maybe they know something. 

Tim

[coyotejoe]

Well no Tim, I just rechecked their website and they do list Lil Gun for the .22 K Hornet and .30 Carbine, that's where I got the data in the first place.  They list a maximum load of 13.5 grains with a 45 grain bullet in the K Hornet but I got cratered primers with the starting load of 12.0 grains.
The .357 mag data was on the handgun side but if safe in a handgun why not in a rifle? The .357 Maximum data was from the web.
 I could post similar photos of .22 Hornet and .30 carbine brass but the .357 Max was the most recent and I felt one photo was enough.

[quickdtoo]

Dunno, but Lil'gun works great in the Hornet for me and a ton of other people here and elsewhere, Hodgdon doesn't show it in their 357Max data, maybe you should give them a call or email and ask why you're having trouble with it using their data. 

Tim

913-362-9455

help@hodgdon.com