Loading difficultly?

[flyboy]

Veral:
'Nother dumb newbie question:

I have always loaded my .357 Magnum cartridges, both jacketed and cast,  crimped in the groove, as close to my manual's maximum recommended length as I can get, and notice they will have a slight "bounce" and give a slight "plunk" noise when I drop them into the cylinder.

I figured that was good, because that meant nothing was hung up, and was operating freely, and it worked great for speedloading at IPSC matches.

Would it be better, accuracy wise, to increase the length in slight increments, till I feel slight resistance to chambering?

Would it follow that both ends of the cartridge are now supported, not rattling around in the chamber, and hopefully, will give better accuracy?   

Thanks

[Sweetwater]

Not Veral, but will offer my two cents-

Limiting this note to revolvers - Assuming you are a handloader, not simply a reloader, your objective is to make it fit YOUR cylinder, not what the book says will fit your cylinder. The book is GREAT, but it is only a guide, your gun is the law.
Let's say your cylinder is short. When you seat to the book length, the bullet may hang out the end of your cylinder, preventing the cylinder from rotating into battery. If your cylinder is long, capitalize on it and get a little more performance from the increase in powder space. Your gun dictates what is too long or too short. As a general rule, too long won't fit and too short wastes space. That is probably an over-simplification, but it works. If you are looking for ultimate performance, you need all the case space you can get, so seating the bullets shorter than "cylinder length" can and does waste valuable powder space. If you are making plinking loads, this is probably not a consideration.
If you shoot cast bullets in cases 'too short', you can develop a ring of lead in your cylinder, making it difficult to chamber a standard case i.e. if you use 38Spl cases instead of 357cases. They work fine, but you stand to develop a cleaning situation that you won't get using standard 357cases. Assuming the use of standard 357cases, you have a choice. You can seat your choice of bullet 'where the book says', where the crimp groove is cut, or where your bullet just barely stays inside the cylinder. That's where I like them - filling the cylinder. These choices are yours - with your gun as the final stage of acceptance. Your gun says if your choice fits or not - the book doesn't. Your gun will tell you when it's happy with your 'choice' and for sure will tell you when it's not! Listen to it!

Years ago when I was shooting 357's, I got into all these scenarios. I had S&W's, Ruger's, TC's and Dan Wesson's. One of them would not chamber 'by the book' to save it's soul. It was simply short in overall length. A couple of them were long enough to gain me some real powder space by seating the bullets to fill the cylinder. I stopped using 38Spl cases, as I chose to not spend time cleaning what was otherwise unnecessary. I once went to an IHMSA shooting match and my buddy had made a batch of 357's 'by the book' for his Wichita single shot. Ooops! He failed to check them for fit in the gun, and the bullets were seated too long! I had some extra loaded for my 'short cylinder' and they fit OK in his gun. He went on to beat me by two targets, with my ammo.
Now that's gratitude! LOL!

Guess I've strayed from your basic question, but I hope this helps you make your 357 what 'you' want it to be.

Regards,
Sweetwater

[Sweetwater]

Rereading your original post, I noticed I missed Question #3 altogether.

In reality, the cartridge should be supported at both ends, because it should fit your chamber, and the bullet should fit the cylinder throat. It is possible that your cases are getting overly sized and are actually small in your chamber. If this is the situation, try backing out your sizing die and check if that reduces your 'case rattle' that you described. By the same token, in your speed matches, you don't want 'anything' slowing down the cases from entering the chambers. I doubt you'll see any change in your accuracy.
So, again, I state, make it fit your cylinder, shoot it, keep it clean and be happy.

Regards,
Sweetwater

[Veral]

  Up front, understand that revolver cartridges must fit the chamber loosely enough that they drop against the cartridge rim of their own weight.  If they are snug when chambered then can lay back against the breech block, then when the hammer falls have to be driven forward, against the soft chamber resistance, until the rim makes contact with the cylinder and supports the cartridge well enough for the primer to be indented.  --  To make that a bit more simple.  If rounds have to be pushed into the chambers you are asking for misfires.

  Now, about fit for accuracy.  -- I've recommended for years that bullets be a close slip fit to the cylinder throats, and when fitted so, the loaded rounds will in most guns lay free in the chamber.  This the largest bullet diameter that can be made to chamber with bullets seated out for maximum powder room and minimum bullet jump to the rifling.   Max powder room is benificial in that the lowest pressure can be obtained with any given powder charge, or more powder can be burned before max pressure is reached, which corresponds to maximum power potential.

  As for the rear of the cartridge being supported.  A close fit is good, but don't overdo it as described above.  Also, I've made most of my recommendations based on the use of LBT bullet designs which all have a heavy bearing band outside the case.  However, many shoot cast bullets without the heavy bands up front.  When using these, keep diameter as large as possible while staying in the above criteria.  Diameter will of coarse be limited first by what the mold will cast, and second, by maximum diameter that will chamber easily.  The object here is to have the bullet aligned in the chamber as precisely as possible.

  Understand that when a cartridge fires the ctg neck expands out against the chamber walls before the bullet ever starts moving.  If everything is fitted closely to begin with, the bullet can't yaw very much while getting jambed into the cylinder throat.

   Don't mess with trying to seat bullets out farther to improve accuracy if the crimp doesn't allow it.  A good crimp is essential to top performance.  If you are using commercially manufactured jacketed bullets, none of the above is possible, but I learned much of it almost 30 years ago when I built some custom swage dies which I reswaged factory jacketed bullets with so they fit the gun snugly.  Groups went from 2.5 -3 inches at 25 yards to a tight cloverleaf.

   If the bullet can tip during takeoff, it cannot be straightened out by the forcing cone when it hits the barrel of a revolver.  Same for fixed barrels of all calibers and chamberings.