What's with all the family violence lately?

[ncsurveyor]

Now some lady shot her kids in Kentucky.

Seriously, I was wondering if these type of events increase during election years.

As much pandering about the collapse of the nation and the hopeless state of affairs that rolls around every four years, I wouldn't be suprised.

Or maybe its always been such that mom's kill their kids, father's kill their families.

Peace and Love be with all of you, such that you never get that far in the abyss.

[Dee]

ncsurveyor, the only thing different now in family violence is BETTER NEWS COVERAGE of the events nation wide. 20 years of L.E. (retired 13 years ago) showed me the things families do to each other. It has gone on since time began. Cain and Abel attest to that.

[ncsurveyor]

Dee, I agree with you, having spent a number of years in EMS myself.  I just didn't see a lot of "whole family" events, or murder/suicides (Wendy's, V-Tech, CO church) and the like.  Plenty of drunken father/son, or brothers type stuff.

TM, I think you may have another contributing factor here. 

Maybe some enterprising sociology student will dig up the stats.

[SHOOTALL]

DEE, it is a true shame you are correct !

[Dixie Dude]

I think people have left God out of their lives.  In 1960 50%+ of the American people attended church weekly.  Divorce rate was low, crime rate was low.  Youth in the 60s rebelled because of the Vietnam war and started questioning everything and their parents values.  Liberal college professors didn't help.  Ever since then we have been on a downhill slide.  Most people before the 60's had to work hard for the things they had.  When people become more wealthy, they have extra money, and they begin to indulge in either sinful or idle pursuits; gambling, drinking, drugs, adultry, or just going to the lake, or mini-vacations on the weekends. Things took the place of family time together. 

When I was a child, I stayed with my grandparents during summers in grade school.  They would get with my great aunts and uncles, play dominoes, checkers, and visit with each other.  Sure, they had phones, but most lived within 20-30 miles apart, so they would go visit with each other in person.  Ones living in the country would give my grandparents fresh vegetables, fruit, or nuts.  They didn't watch as much TV except for news or one or two special shows they wanted to watch.  Stores were closed on Sundays, so people went to church and visited each other.  Families seemed to be closer nit.  Today everyone is scattered, too busy, and stressed out.  I used to read a lot more than I do now.  My kids don't read at all. 

I found out also, that more people in 1960 belonged to clubs and organizations than they do now. Such as Lions, Rotary, Masons, Shriners, Exchange, Elks, etc. They socialized more,  and helped people more, without big government.  This caring and belonging atmosphere contributed to lower crime.  Just my $0.02 worth. 

[Dee]

Dixie Dude, I would have to agree with all you said. The TV has probably done as much damage to the family as any one thing. It entertains our minds, to the point of isolating us from the ones sitting in the same room with us. We live in our minds and see a distorted sense of reality according to Hollywood. It has aided in our MIS-PLACING our sense of values, and our sense of MORALITY. JMO

[SHOOTALL]

numbs us to reality !

[beemanbeme]

DD, can't say I agree. I think its a matter of better reporting; more awareness of events.
When I was a kid, you had pious people hugging and kissing all over each other. And God and the various churches played a prominant part in our social lives.  But some people were still just plain mean and vicious. Parents disciplined their kids.  And how and how much they disciplined their kids was up to them and pretty much no one else's business.  Altho I think its gone a bit too far nowadays, back then therre just wasn't anything such as a child's advocate.
I wasn't the only kid from a fine Christian family that went to school with a note asking that I be excused from gym class because I wasn't feeling well.  The real reason was my folks didn't want anyone to see me with my shirt off.  They truly believed if you spare the rod you spoil the child.

[GRIMJIM]

That's not discipline, that's abuse.

[beemanbeme]

Call it what you like, they were not unique.  My point was that "way back when" when most folks at least gave lip service to being fine Christians and the stores were closed on sundays and such, percentage wise, there were just as many mean people. There was a good deal of meanness that was done that went unreported. Also quite a few battered wives and children were taken to the emergency room after a bad fall down the steps in a single level house.
The medias then were a little more restrained, a little less competitive to see who could come up with the most shocking story.  Nowadays folks want all of the gruesome details and the media ac comadates them.

[Dee]

Call it what you like, they were not unique.  My point was that "way back when" when most folks at least gave lip service to being fine Christians and the stores were closed on sundays and such, percentage wise, there were just as many mean people. There was a good deal of meanness that was done that went unreported. Also quite a few battered wives and children were taken to the emergency room after a bad fall down the steps in a single level house.
The medias then were a little more restrained, a little less competitive to see who could come up with the most shocking story.  Nowadays folks want all of the gruesome details and the media ac comadates them.

All you say here is true, but I would inject a few true isms here also. Take wife beating for instance. It went unpunished occasionally no doubt, but as I recall, a father of a daughter, or brother of a sister or several family men sometimes administered a little FAMILY JUSTICE to the beator, on behalf of the beatee, and many times his bad habit went away.
I also remember girls back in the fifties and sixties coming up in the family way, and via the father, brothers, and maybe an uncle or cousin or two intervened, and two things happened. A good ole fashioned a#@-kickin and then a wedding. Today the fathers seem gutless, and brothers don't seem to care. This to me is moral decay.
There used to be a time when blood was thicker than water, but today the kids want to fight with their parents, not the enemies there of.
Times are changing and morality has taken a leave of absence, as God has been kicked out of our lives, and the Devil has been invited in. JMO

[beemanbeme]

There is some truth in what you say, Dee. But this "georgia justice" you talk about is more a thing of folk lore and story than reality. Too often, the people looked the other way and wondered what the beatee did that was so bad to provoke the head of the house to such actions.

Perhaps a spin-off of the rapidity of the spread of news, more folks know that justice in America is largely a joke. And you can do pretty much what you want to without worrying about anything remotely swift and sure.

 Not to say that many a fine prospect of a young man hasn't been tolled to the alter by an "innocent" young lady that was taken advantage of. Then and now.

The question begs to be asked, why was God kicked out of the American family?  Who wasn't doing their job?  The preachers? The parents? Did the children that were raised in fine Christian homes wake up one day and say, "I'm gonna kick God out of my life and follow the ways of the Devil"?  I thought that the Bible taught that if a child was trained in the ways of righteousness, he wouldn't stray from them as an adult.  Do you think maybe the parents were talking that talk but not walking that walk?

 

[SHOOTALL]

beemambeme , you raise a good question . One with more than one part to the answer . the generation you single out as failing to pass on Religion is the generation that saw 2 world wars and a depression . Their children was most likely the first to be handed the most change and progress coupled with the first time world destruction was a real threat . Now is it any wonder these two generations have split ?
But why ? if i had to guess , i WOULD LAY BLAME ON THE EROSION OF THE FAMILY . It seems the ways of the world have changed so fast that the old was not respected by the new and religion is part of that .
The doom and gloom of today will surely bring about a return to religious values , as has happened through out history .

[beemanbeme]

Thanks Shootall. Quite a bit to think about.  We've cut so many lifelines without anything else firm to tether to.  I think the young folks are gonna be fine.  They've floundered around some and will more but I think, from the ones I've known, they will find a morality, a code of conduct, honour. What they find may not please us: but then, we haven't exactly pleased them. 


I certainly hope we don't go back to burning Witches and Warlocks. I'd probably be one of the first to be smoked.

[SHOOTALL]

I agree we don't need another Dark Age !

[GRIMJIM]

I think erosion of the family is a good place to point the finger. A lot of kids don't have a father around to put the fear of god into them when they do bad things and consequentially we have a group of young people that think they can do whatever they want and get away with it.

I think they should bring back mandatory military service to give kids a sense of self discipline and respect for others. Either go into college or two years of service after high school.

[deltecs]

I cannot find the source now, but yesterday I read in Fox News that over 20 major cities had a high school graduation percentage of LESS than 50%.  As these children are minors, it is the parents who have not controlled their children by instilling in them family values, responsibility for their own actions, and belief in a Supreme Being.  If the parents do not show by example responsibility for their actions, then how can we expect their children to do so?  Also, the lack of punishment is prevalent in our society, so the children tell parents and those in authority to shove off and then do it their way.  This is obvious in campaigning for votes by promises of giving them something for nothing.  What do we expect.  Detroit city schools had a graduation percentage of 38% of those students who enrolled in high school to graduate.  Cleveland was at 36%, Baltimore was at 34%, Indianapolis was at 47%.  This a serious condemnation on our education policies in general.  When less than half of all students who enroll in high school graduate, where do these young men and women expect to make a living or do they?

[ncsurveyor]

I think they should bring back mandatory military service to give kids a sense of self discipline and respect for others. Either go into college or two years of service after high school.

Kids fall off the grid before they get to graduation.  Not sure mandatory military would do it.  By the time they reach that age, the damage is done.

Greg, I don't know if those kids intend on making a living.  Maybe some will take one of the many easy way outs they are afforded.  Welfare, gangs, or suicide.

I remember the outrage that the guy got when he came out with the shirt that said "If you can't feed them, don't breed them"  I would submit that the word "feed" applies to their need for mental and emotional food also.

[torpedoman]

I think it is the loss of the extended family and the network of support that went with it.My great grandparents on down lived near me as a kid and great grand ma would take a switch to your rear end in a heartbeat then turn you in for another one from ma or dad. You would never do anything that would bring discredit on the whole family when they were that close. They were always there to help and guide you something we have lost in this age.

[SHOOTALL]

Not sure about military service only but public service for 2 years might take the ME of of the attitude so many have

[beemanbeme]

I believe every young person should at 18 spend 3 years in the service!  NO college deferments!  If the young person wants to be a CO, then he can spend his time as a medic or a aid or orderly in a VA hospital or doing public works or such.  But he/she will be away from his family, being held accountable for his actions and being treated like an adult. I can't believe the 20 to 30 to 40 year old bums still living at home with some pissy little job or living on welfare.  Sometimes with their commonlaw wife and kids but no job.  My B-I-L has a 40 yr old son and his live in at home.

[Chilachuck]

Back to the original question, I think the added tension created by negative campaigning creates a peak, on top of whatever the violence level is in the off years.