Author Topic: WHICH gps to purchase  (Read 1926 times)

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Offline Shooter.250

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WHICH gps to purchase
« on: March 22, 2008, 01:56:13 PM »
I'm sure the topic of GPS's have been beat to death with the same questions, but hear goes.
I've asked several people about GPS system and everyone I have talked to have a different one they think is the best,, Garmin, Lowrance, Magellan.

I've looked at Garmin and the Lowrance and I like the key pad on the Lowrance better than I do on the Garmin Vista.
Has anyone had the chance to use different GPS makers and which ones were the most user friendly?

Also how does the Topo map overlay work, Will the unit show you were you are on the map?

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Offline Siskiyou

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Re: WHICH gps to purchase
« Reply #1 on: March 22, 2008, 05:55:13 PM »

It is hard to give you a complete answer to your questions.  All three makes you have named make good products.  Each manufacture makes a number of different models that have different features. 

The Garmin Vista is a good “older” technology gps unit.  I had a similar Garmin Legend and after some practice I could operate the unit with one had and shoot a pistol with the other if need be.  When I refer to older technology I am writing about the chip (processor).  The newer eTrex Vista HCx has the High Sensitivity receiver and it takes a micro SD card that allows you to store many-many times the maps. (84X) If you want to spend a little less money go with the Legend HCx.  If the Garmin Legend HCx  or the eTrex Vista HCx had been out at the time I purchased my last unit that is the direction I would have taken.  With the updated chip and Micro SD card the unit(s) would fit my needs.  The lighter eTrex model hanging around my neck when out fishing in the Sea of Cortez and marking fish 8 is ideal.  The down side to the eTrex models is they would sink with me if I landed in the water. 

In the Garmin lineup I prefer the layout of the keys on the GPSMAP 76Cx or 76CSx over the 60Cx or 60CSx models.  You might find that you prefer the keyboard layout out on the 60 series more to your liking.  It is a personal preference. 

One of the reasons I like the Garmin 76 series is that they float.  As a boater, fisherman, and hunter I consider a floating unit an asset over a sinking unit. For an internal standpoint the 60Cx, 60CSx, 76Cx, and 76CSx share the same chip.  The main difference is one floats and the other does not.

At one time some of the low-end Lowrance units were not rated as waterproof.  At this time it appears that Lowrance map coverage outside the United States is not as good as Garmin and Magellan if that might be an issue.  Hopefully a Lowrance owner will let us know if he has any problems with transferring maps from his computer to his unit.

Most gps units will display your location on the screen.  Many times I will save the tracks and print them on a map when I return home or in the past I would display them on Google Earth Plus.  Only Magellan and Garmin interface with Google Earth.  Before the opening of the 2007 hunting season I did a fair amount of scouting,  I studied game trails, and the whole scene, and on return home I would place my data from my Garmin 76Cx on a map and download it to Google Earth Plus.  This allowed me to give my wife a map of where I would be hunting in case my old butt did not make it home, and it allowed me to study my hunting area on maps and Google Earth.  This paid off when the old buck made a run for it and I was able to run to a location where I knew that he had to cross a small opening.  A gps does not guarantee a deer but it helps the hunter better understand the lay of the land.

You might want to include the DeLorme GPS PN-20 in your search.

http://www.pobonline.com/CDA/Archives/BNP_GUID_9-5-2006_A_10000000000000222177

Currently I have a new technology unit and old technology unit.  The new unit always receives more satellites and under difficult conditions.  The old unit is receiving more satellites now then it did new because of additional satellites, updated satellite programming, and the new satellites have more powerful transmitters.

There are a number of good Internet stores where you can buy a gps unit at a reasonable price.  Watch out for some retail outlets that sell discontinued models for original manufactures prices.

Even with the new chip sets I prefer a unit which can use an external antenna if needed while traveling.  When traveling in the Redwoods, or in the concrete jungle of a large city the external antenna makes a difference.  I place mine inside a window, and then hide it when parked. 








There is a learning process to effectively using a gps.  Do not throw your compass and map away!

Boycott: San Francisco, L.A., Oakland, and City of Sacramento, CA.

Offline Shooter.250

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Re: WHICH gps to purchase
« Reply #2 on: March 24, 2008, 01:37:56 PM »
Siskiyou; Thanks for the info. I had hope someone else would give some advice I could chew on. It looks as though people that have Lowrance or Magellan aren't to proud of their purchases, although I would have liked to hear the draw backs that they had with them.

So I looks as though I may stick with Garmin. You seem to be quite versed in the use of this one, what would be your suggestion.
I would like to use the map over lay you discussed. Is this fairly simple to do as the last GPS I had was a Garmin 38 and I didn't use it much as every time I would get into heavy wooded area I would loose the signal. it sounds as though this isn't the problem with the newer GPS systems?

I would like to use it with all types of maps Marine and topo. If the GPS you are using isa capable of map over lay, I take it you can tell wre you are at on the screen on the topo overlay?

Some of this may seem repetitive, but I'm in a hurry and didn't get much of as chance to prof all my questions.

Thanks again for you time.

Offline Siskiyou

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Re: WHICH gps to purchase
« Reply #3 on: March 24, 2008, 04:47:12 PM »
A lot of water has gone under the bridge since the Garmin 38 came, in fact I had not gone gray yet.

Check back on VictorCharlie post I believe he purchased the Legend CHx and is happy with it.  It uses the same software as my Garmin 76C and 76Cx.  Sounds like you are going to be on the pond.  I like my 76C and 76Cx because they float.  I have not tried to sink them. 

What fits in your budget $$200 to $300.  PM me if you want, I am working ten hour shifts in an emergency dispatch this week so I might be slow getting back.
There is a learning process to effectively using a gps.  Do not throw your compass and map away!

Boycott: San Francisco, L.A., Oakland, and City of Sacramento, CA.

Offline Siskiyou

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Re: WHICH gps to purchase
« Reply #4 on: March 27, 2008, 03:38:06 PM »
Shooter.250

Have you found what you wanted yet? 

There is a learning process to effectively using a gps.  Do not throw your compass and map away!

Boycott: San Francisco, L.A., Oakland, and City of Sacramento, CA.

Offline EsoxLucius

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Re: WHICH gps to purchase
« Reply #5 on: March 31, 2008, 06:10:32 AM »
It looks as though people that have Lowrance or Magellan aren't to proud of their purchases, although I would have liked to hear the draw backs that they had with them.
I had the Magellan Meridian GPS which I upgraded to the Magellan Meridian Gold four years ago.  I have nothing but good things to say about them.  They work well for me.  However, the advances in features and technology passes one by rapidly.
We learn something new everyday whether we want to or not.

Offline Siskiyou

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Re: WHICH gps to purchase
« Reply #6 on: March 31, 2008, 09:07:41 AM »
EsoxLucius is correct Magellan makes a good product and if you purchase a Magellan he could be helpful.
A few years back I started cornering professionals who work in the woods for their opinions regarding gps units.  This included fire fighters who rappel from helicopters in remote locations to fight forest fires, to fire managers, and foresters who map fires, timber sales, and other locations in the woods.  I also checked with the local game warden that bought his own gps.

At that time the majority of wildland fire fighters who purchased gps units with their own funds purchased the Yellow eTrex and they were happy with it.  One of my early orientations to a gps was from a lady fire fighter from Arizona.  We were on a remote helibase in Idaho and we needed to become orientated to the terrain.  She pulled her own Yellow eTrex out of the bag and we were able to map the temporary helibase for safe operations.

A couple of years later I went to a helibase manager on a major fire that was burning in Southern Oregon.  A large helibase was being setup and we needed to map the base and orientate weather instruments for safe operations.  Radio operators also needed this information to guide helicopters in and out of the busy base.  I knew the manager had one or two gps units of his own.  We had discussed gps units on an early incident a few weeks earlier.  He had graduated from a university and mapping was one of his specialties. 

He handed me two gps units, a Yellow Garmin eTrex, and a Magellan Mapping model.  I asked him which one was best.  He told me that both were equal at the location we were working at.  But when he was back home the Magellan held the edge because he had local maps installed in the unit.

I had met this manager earlier on a large fire in Southeastern Utah.  We were assigned to a fire in a remote location.  The fire would settle down for a few days then make a run gobbling up thousands of acres.  One day a specialist showed up at the helibase whose assignment was to map the perimeter of the fire from a small recon helicopter.  Her job was to map the fire perimeter with a Garmin GPS V, and return to the Incident Command Post and transfer her “track” to a map displaying the fire perimeter.

A few days later the fire was still spreading but the specialist had been assigned to a different fire.  The base manager went up in the recon helicopter using his Magellan Mapping gps to map the expanded fire perimeter.  The resulting map was equal to the Garmin map.  I believe the tracks created in this example were transferred to mapping software from a third party.

I talked to a few BLM and FS fire people who had mapping gps unit’s wired into their government vehicles.  This was year’s back and the primary gps unit was the Garmin Mapping GPSIII Plus.  I should note that many of these long discontinued units are still in service.  These units work great, they just lack the memory of newer units, and they do not have the high sensitivity chips which work great in heavy cover.

At this point I came to the conclusion that I wanted a mapping gps unit.  I also decided on a Garmin unit, not because it was the best, but I was entering a new world and felt that I could call up my different contacts if I had questions regarding the operation of my new purchase.  The ability to obtain support is high on my want list.  Twenty years ago we received a small colored, Easter eggs shaped Garmin gps unit on the job.  The manual was printed on two sides of a piece of paper, and required a magnifier to read.  I did not bother with it.  Now days the potential purchaser can go to a manufactures website and view the manual for a gps unit, or down load it as a pdf document.  Manuals have improved with time, but I do not consider them perfect.  I recently looked at a Magellan manual.  I believe it was better then some Garmin manuals.  When a friend purchased a Magellan eXplorist 100 I was helping him get going with it.  The manual that came with it reminded me off the early Garmin manual.

I have purchased three different Garmin Mapping Gps units and I have been happy with them.  I have a Hummingbird Fishfinder with a built in gps unit.  It is a good unit and performs great out on the water.  The downside to changing brands is that if I purchased a Garmin Fishfinder/Gps unit my US Topo software could be loaded on it.  The software for the Hummingbird is expensive because it does not cover the man made reservoirs I fish.  When I fish I have my handheld Garmin fasten around my neck.  This helps define the bottom and display the topography.





There is a learning process to effectively using a gps.  Do not throw your compass and map away!

Boycott: San Francisco, L.A., Oakland, and City of Sacramento, CA.

Offline dakotashooter2

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Re: WHICH gps to purchase
« Reply #7 on: April 07, 2008, 09:33:56 AM »
It really depends on what your demands are. I used the yellow etrex for about 5 years and it served most of my needs. I upgraded to a Vista about 9 months ago for the basemap. I basically wanted some reference points to work with other than those waypoints I put in. I also wanted the electronic compass  for plotting routes. I am very happy with the unit except for one thing.  Accuracy. Even with the WAAS enabled on the vista I find my yellow model to have more pinpoint accuracy. The best accuracy my yellow model ever shows is 27 feet and that is pretty close.  My Vista will show accuracy as close as 9' on the screen but that is rarely correct. More often it is 50-75'. I manually transfered all my waypoints from the yellow model to the Vista and they are all off on the vista many by several hundres feet. The Vista does acquire a bit faster but it sure isn't any more accurate. At least the one I have.
Just another worthless opinion!!

Offline Siskiyou

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Re: WHICH gps to purchase
« Reply #8 on: April 07, 2008, 12:15:21 PM »
dakotashooter2:

I did a little checking and it appears the Vista software has been updated to correct some satellite, and WAAS reception problems.  If you have not update your unit you might consider it.

An example of the updates:
        
  Specifications Testimonials   Accessories Manuals Updates & Downloads FAQs        Home > Outdoor > Products > eTrex Vista > Updates & Downloads
              
 Updates & Downloads        
 

 eTrex Vista software version 3.80 as of March 18, 2008         

      Download Preloaded Marine POI Database for eTrex Vista
 
If MapSource data is loaded to this unit, this unit's preloaded Marine POI database will be erased. Please download the file below to recover this Marine POI database. If you currently have MapSource data loaded into your GPS unit, it will be erased and replaced with this POI database. Download (2.32 MB)

    Download (1.84 MB)
    View download instructions and system requirements
Notes:·   Reverting back to previously released versions will clear user memory. ·   Users are strongly urged to back up any user data they wish to save. ·   WARNING: If your current software is version 3.02 or lower, this software will clear all unit data including alamanac information, tracks, waypoints, routes, and settings. Back up all user data before upgrading. After installation is complete, place unit with a clear view of the sky for 15-30 minutes to re-acquire almanac data. ·   This Vista firmware now includes a Jumpmaster accessory. This accessory is intended for trained military jumpmasters. To learn more about this accessory, please download our supplemental documentation:  Download Jumpmaster PDF
 Change History         

Changes made from version 3.70 to 3.80:·   Updated WAAS. ·   Updated GEOID model.

Changes made from version 3.60 to 3.70:·   Changes to support manufacturing.

Changes made from version 3.50 to 3.60:·   Improvements to RCV_CPO support. ·   Added Croatian language support. ·   Updated various translations.

Changes made from version 3.40 to 3.50:·   Fixed potential memory corruption problem that could occur when tracking more than one WAAS satellite simultaneously.

Changes made from version 3.20 to 3.40:·   Updated French translations. ·   Improved WAAS/EGNOS satellite selection algorithm to select the satellite with the most beneficial corrections given the unit's current position. A unit will not use a WAAS/EGNOS satellite if the unit's current position is outside of a given WAAS/EGNOS satellite's service volume. ·   Added support for RCV_CPO data. ·   Improved external power detection.

If you have not updated your yellow eTrex you might want to check the Garmin support page for updates.  A quick look shows that Garmin has not updated the Yellow eTrex for five or six years.  You might want to compare software versions to see if you have the most current. 

(WAAS) A lot of people do not understand that to receive there are two-master and a twenty-five ground reference stations that transmit a corrected signal.  Ground reference stations do not support all locations. In many countries there are not ground reference stations.   WAAS reception has improved a great deal the last few years and Garmin has updated some of their units so they can receive two WAAS Satellite signs instead of one.  I am currently setting in our computer room with my old Garmin 76C turned on.  The gps is currently receiving six satellites.  The satellite page signal bars show the letter “D” in three of the bars.  This indicates to me that I am receiving a differential or corrected signal.

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Differential_GPS

I hunt a lot of broken topography, what is not up is down.  I have found that on many high ridge tops I will receive a corrected signal, but as soon as I drop behind the ridge I loose the corrected signal.

If you are in an area that you do not receive a corrected signal or a signal from Satellite 35, 48 or 51 I recommend that you turn the disable the WAAS option in you unit.  At least two negative things can be happening, you accuracy is actually declining, and your unit is using more battery power searching for a WAAS satellite in cannot find.

As I have typed this I am now receiving seven satellites with the letter “D” in each bar.  I am receiving among other satellites #48, and #51.  My level of accuracy is varying from 8 to 10 feet.

I normally do not start my gps out in the woods.  Either I plug my unit into the lighter for power in the pickup, or start out with it powered up with re-chargeable to be changed out with fresh batteries once the hunt starts.  When I first fire up the gps the accuracy maybe 200-feet but that increases rapidly as it finds it’s location and addition satellites are locked in.  The best situation when you view the satellite page is look at it as a target, but in this case you do not want a tight group.  The best situation is an open scattering of satellites that provide good triangulation from three or more of the satellites.

I have a number of fixed locations near my home for which I have created waypoints.  Every once and while I well re-check my unit against these points.  I have not found a problem with them using a Garmin eTrex Legend, Garmin Mapping 76C or the Garmin Mapping 76Cx.  I have also copied (created new waypoints) on my Humminbird Gps/fishfinder and have been able to return to the same locations.

I did a little experiment when creating a waypoint.  During an hour period from the same location I created seven waypoints with a Garmin eTrex Legend.  When I returned home I downloaded the waypoints to a map so I could display them.  The same location gave me a number of different locations within feet of each other.  Repeatability is not exact. 

While I have set here and typed, jumped up and done a number of chores my satellite reception has dropped to five birds but the accuracy is still 8-feet.




There is a learning process to effectively using a gps.  Do not throw your compass and map away!

Boycott: San Francisco, L.A., Oakland, and City of Sacramento, CA.

Offline d_hiker

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Re: WHICH gps to purchase
« Reply #9 on: April 07, 2008, 06:16:01 PM »
Also check to make sure both units are set to the same datum and that the units are set the same, ie; DD.dddd or DD.MMMM or DD.MMSS
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Offline prairiedog555

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Re: WHICH gps to purchase
« Reply #10 on: April 08, 2008, 09:58:26 AM »
My company is in the GPS location business, fleet tracking ect.  We have seen many different GPS units and the one thing I have found is that if you want the best accuracy (5M) and the best satellite acquisition find a unit that uses a SIRF 3 chip set.  Believe me the others are not as accurate by a wide margin.  If they don't say SIRF on specs it probably is not, they are patent protected and the industry standard and don't cost much more.
We had a supplier that switched to a Siemens chip set to save money, accuracy went from 5m to 50m.  Same unit side by side only difference is chip set.  My friend just bought a  smartphone with GPS and did not have SIRF and he is very disappointed, 50 Meter accuracy, and he spent $800.
This is not just my observation, our electrical engineer brought this to our attention, he is right. 

Offline Siskiyou

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Re: WHICH gps to purchase
« Reply #11 on: April 08, 2008, 10:03:31 AM »
Make sure it is the SIRF3 chip, some makers are using the SIRF2 chip.
There is a learning process to effectively using a gps.  Do not throw your compass and map away!

Boycott: San Francisco, L.A., Oakland, and City of Sacramento, CA.