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Offline ilikemilitaria

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At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« on: December 20, 2008, 05:21:04 AM »
Hey, I have a T/C ENCORE 309x50 with .50 cal. black powder barrel. I would like to have a nice centerfire rifle, "mostly" for varmint shooting. I dont expect to hunt/use this for anything requiring .30 caliber bullet or larger.

Now, the only NEF I have is a .22 SSI sportster. I have worked the trigger over on it, and like it very much. I'd like input as to whether to buy a dedicated barrel/caliber for the T/C, or buy an NEF rifle as a dedicated "22" caliber centerfire machine. What do you think, .223 ?.222?, .243?, 22-250?, etc...
I am leaning toward the .223, since surplus ammo can be cheap for "fun shooting" and I can sight a more expensive round in for my hunting load.

Please feel free to educate me on your gun choices, scopes, and what load/bullet shoots best in yours.


THANKS!   ;)
Dave
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Offline Singleshotsam

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #1 on: December 20, 2008, 05:39:53 AM »
For the price of a TC bbl, you can buy yourself a nice varmint rig from NEF / HR...

As far as calibers go, what distances are you planning to shoot, are you wanting to hunt deer with it on occasion or is it just a strict varminter?

Varmint rifle-
For distances under 300 i would go w/ the .223... great round
If your planning on shooting over 300 anytime, i'ld go w/ the 22-250.

If i were planning on the possibilty of ever hunting deer, i'd go w/ a .243.  Great lil' hybrid round, also my favorite cartridge ;D
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Offline petemi

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #2 on: December 20, 2008, 05:57:10 AM »
The .223 ammo is cheaper, but I went with the Handi .22-250 for two reasons.  First and foremost it has better ballistics, and the cost per box of quality ammo is only a buck or two more.  Secondly, I don't shoot FMJ ammo here in any caliber, 'cause when It whines off I haven't a clue where it went.  I don't need to be putting bullet holes in houses, cows, or semis a mile away on the highway.

The other thing is, you can probably buy the Handi for the price of a T/C barrel and buy more barrels at a fraction of the cost.

When you get bored with the .22s, you can always add a .45-70 barrel ;D :D ;D :D

Pete
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Offline ilikemilitaria

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #3 on: December 20, 2008, 06:38:08 AM »
"As far as calibers go, what distances are you planning to shoot, are you wanting to hunt deer with it on occasion or is it just a strict varminter?"



I dont really plan for rifle on deer, since our state does not allow rifle for deer... :(
I started with slugs for deer, then went to black powder, now have been using pistol for deer for about last 6 years.

Thanks for advice so far! I look forward to more input.

dave
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Offline Rustyinfla

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #4 on: December 20, 2008, 07:17:08 AM »


   Some time back one of the magazines did a side by side test of the NEF vs. the T/C. I think Tim has a copy of it, IIRC. In the test they tested a .22 Hornet. In the end the NEF came out the winner.
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Offline tykempster

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #5 on: December 20, 2008, 07:35:26 AM »
Do you handload?  If so a 223 with heavier bullets will outreach factory 22-250 ammo by a looong ways with less recoil, muzzle blast, powder, expense, etc.
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Offline FW Conch

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #6 on: December 20, 2008, 09:17:39 AM »
 ??? during the past 2 years I have often had the same thoughts as you. I like break action rifles & was
leaning toward buying an Encore frame stock & forend, then buying the barrel in the chambering of my
liking. Going new this would  cost me nearly $700 & @ that price I assumed (DANGER) that the quality
would be such that all TC barrels, & "aftermarket" barrels would  truly be "drop in & swap", not requiring
designated frames. After doing some reading over in the Contender/ Encore section I found this is not 100%
true. There are stories of people buying barrels, installing them on their TC frames, then they won't unlatch
& the frame has to be disassembled to get it apart to repair it. Again I assume (more danger), if we purchase
a TC brand barrel, it is guaranteed to fit, aftermarket I guess would depend on the policy of the provider ?
   If you decide to go with Handi, the 223 sounds like a good choice for your needs, because it seems to get few complaints & the 223 is one of the most inherently accurate rounds in existence. Good Luck, & let us know about your choice & how it works out for you.  :)  Jim
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Offline R.W.Dale

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #7 on: December 20, 2008, 10:08:08 AM »
I'm going to be frank here

I went through my encore phase with a couple frames and close to a dozen factory and custom barrels. I learned rather quickly that the accuracy of these rifles is grossly overrated. To put it bluntly they shoot like crap. I got into encores after being so disappointed by the hit r miss accuracy of my Handi rifles only to learn that if anything your average encore barrel is even less accurate. The break action rifle simply doesn't lend itself to knife edge accuracy. It's one thing when your $220 handi shoots 3" groups but it's quite another when a $800 Pro hunter does no better

Couple that with the fact that for the price of a single encore rifle barrel you can buy a COMPLETE entry level bolt gun that'll shoot circles around even the most worked over encore and for the price of ONE shotgun bbl you could have a diffrent single shot chambered in ALL the common gauges
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Offline FW Conch

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #8 on: December 20, 2008, 11:02:30 AM »
krochus, I'M listening & absorbing !  Thanks    Jim
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Offline Sourdough

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #9 on: December 20, 2008, 11:10:29 AM »
I too bought the Encore muzzleloader, Love it.  I own six muzzleloaders and by far it is my favorite.  It even makes my partner jealous, he owns a Knight.  I did buy a 30-06 barrel, and a .338 barrel.  Don't use either one often.  For the price of a barrel i can buy a complete Handi, and the Handi shoots just as well as the Encore.

I own Contenders, Encores, and a TCR, all with multiple barrels.  Have gotten to where I hate changing barrels.  I also owned multiple barrels for one of my Handis.  Not anymore, I sold the extra barrels.  I now buy complete guns in the caliber I want, and leave them as such.

It's been over a year since I shot my Encore, My Contender and TCR see occasional use.  The Handis are what I carry daily.  During the winter I carry a .223 Ultra.  During the summer I carry a 30-06.   
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Offline Sourdough

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #10 on: December 20, 2008, 05:01:30 PM »
OK, Let me clarify something here.  I live in Alaska, we don't have spring and fall.  Winter starts at freeze-up usually mid Sept to mid Oct.  That's when the Bears go into hibernation, and I get the .223 out.  Then Break-up and summer usually starts sometime in April.  That is when the Bears come out and I put the .223 away.

As for the T/C or a Handi, depends on what caliber you want to go with.  I'd go with the Handi unless you want a Magnum caliber, then you have to go with the Encore barrel.  Watch out for that .416 Rigby, I've taken two guys to the hosp to get stitches with that barrel.  Scope bite is really bad.
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Offline ilikemilitaria

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #11 on: December 20, 2008, 06:23:29 PM »
Well, the consensus seems to be, and I agree, that I need a handi-rifle most likely in .223. This said, what barrel twist goes with what model ? I have been looking, but am a bit confused. I will most likely look at the SB2 model (synthetic and black). Do all the .223's shoot about the same? Do all of them come with the scope rail? What about a side "thumb" lever for the hammer to aid in cocking when scope is mounted? I have one on my .22 sporter, but I added that on, it didn't come with it. Thanks for all that have replied. Hope some others are being helped as well.

dave
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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #12 on: December 20, 2008, 06:42:21 PM »
Barrel twists are listed in the FAQs, any extractor .223 made this year will be 1:9", prior to that there's no guarantee of what you'll get, 2007 most likely will be 1:9", but they switched back and forth some, check it using the method listed under the twist rate list in the FAQs is the only way to know for sure. Built year codes are listed in the FAQs also.  H&R lists what their firearms come with on their website, basically, if it comes with sights, it doesn't come with a scope rail, but all centerfire rifle barrels are drilled and tapped for a rail, if they come with a scope rail, they should include a hammer extension.

Tim

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Offline chip-don

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #13 on: December 21, 2008, 12:49:48 AM »
you are on the right track two rifles are better than one rifle with two barrels
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Offline Hammerspur

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #14 on: December 21, 2008, 03:56:51 AM »
I too vote for the Handi... Heavy Barrel in .223.

All I did to mine is take it out of the box and add a marginal scope (Bushnell 3.5-10 x 45) Polar Caps and my own home made quick-sling.
It's the best shooter I've ever owned!
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Offline nomosendero

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #15 on: December 21, 2008, 05:33:26 AM »
Does your use of the word "dedicated" mean that you want this gun as a set-up & never change barrels? If so, why are you limiting your choices to these 2? You might hold off till after the Shot Show. I understand the Marlin bolt gun will be avail. in short action, if it is avail in 223 or 22-250 it will be a safer bet concerning accuracy than a break open & is as cheap as a Handi. Also, there will be another break-open choice to consider which may be better than the 2 you are looking at, if you can hold for another month.
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Offline ilikemilitaria

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #16 on: December 21, 2008, 09:03:41 AM »
nomosendero, I am not aware of the coming Marlin rifle you refer too, nor the other break-open rifle coming out. Feel free to educate me.

dave
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Offline MSP Ret

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #17 on: December 21, 2008, 09:24:27 AM »
yes, this sounds interesting, how about letting us all in on this info....<><....:)
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Offline Slufoot

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #18 on: December 21, 2008, 09:27:57 AM »
Hey nomosendero I would like to hear about the other break-open choice!
Thanks!
Slufoot
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Offline dpe.ahoy

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #19 on: December 21, 2008, 09:40:23 AM »
Yah, what they said. ???  Give it up for yer ol buddies here. ::)  We won't tell anybody else, honest.  DP
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Offline nomosendero

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #20 on: December 21, 2008, 10:08:34 AM »
Dave, go to the Marlin site concerning the XL7. They show long action only, but I understand they now have a short action, I have heard 243, 7-08, & 308 , but I suspect 22-250 & maybe 223 soon. The website is not updated yet, like several companies I suspect it will be after shot show. People have been able to get them out-the-door for $300.00, a great deal.

The new break-open is the CVA Apex, I hear in 19 centerfire calibers, 50 cal. MZ & rimfire. With the Bergara barrels & if the action is upscale from the Optima Elite, then this should be a fine rifle.
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Offline Slufoot

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #21 on: December 21, 2008, 10:16:35 AM »
Thanks nomosendero!
I had heard about the Marlin but this is the first new info on the Apex that I've heard.
Thanks again,
Slufoot
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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: At a crossroad...help me make a decision NEF vs T/C
« Reply #22 on: December 21, 2008, 10:28:22 AM »
I checked out the XL7 recently at SW, it's a nice rifle similar to the Stevens 200, but with a bit nicer stock, butter smooth fluted bolt and an Accu-trigger style trigger, the .25-06 and .270 they had in stock sell for $289.99. There's a thread on the Apex in the CVA forum, no real info other than a magazine article and a pic of Chad Shearer with one.

Tim

http://www.marlinfirearms.com/Firearms/CenterfireBoltAction/XL7.asp

http://www.marlinfirearms.com/Firearms/CenterfireBoltAction/XL7C.asp

http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/topic,159402.0.html
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