Headspace in T/C barrels

[doeroller]

    Here in Mississippi it is now legal to hunt with a 35 or larger caliber in primitive weapon season. The weapon of choice now is a 35 Whelen. The barrels I have worked with have had a large amount of headspace. In some, the gun would close on a field gauge! Most guns the factory ammo would be a lose and sloppy fit in the barrel. Full length sized reloads would have head separations after 3 loadings of the brass. I have also seen this excessive headspace in the 375 H&H caliber. What I have done is to partial resize the case so I have a fairly tight closing of the action. These barrels also have long throats. The bullets have to seated out REAL far to just miss the rifling. Is this procedure the correct thing to do? Will T/C exchange the wide tolerance barrel that will close on a NO-GO and sometime a FIElD gauge? Have any of you had this experience?

[Grumulkin]

I think the headspace issue in Encores has been way overblown.  If you're handloading, it really isn't an issue anyway.  Just set up the die so the action just closes on a resized case or just neck size.

The 375 H&H Magnum case is very long and tapered.  This is a case that really needs the belt for proper headspaceing and it's a case that tends to stretch no matter what you shoot it in.

As for sending the barrel back to T/C; if it's within their specs and if the accuracy is reasonable they probably won't replace it and I don't think they should.  For all the talk about headspace problems, I've shot probably over 20 (maybe more than 30) different Encore and Contender barrels with several different frames and have not had what I believe to be any accuracy problems that could be blamed on head space or sloppy cartridge fit.

[Hank08]

Doeroller, in guns like the contender and encore you have to do the headspacing even to sometime necking the case up then back down til your action has to be snapped hard to close.
As to the 35 Whelen, there was some miscommunication between the ammo manufactuerers,
reamer makers and die makers. It may have been corrected now but early on Rem. ammo was
coming apart in Rem. 700 bolt actions from too much headspace and making cases from 30/06 I've had to neck them up larger than 35 then backdown to 35 to create a secondary shoulder to correct headspace.  Once this is done to fit your chamber and you lock your dies
you should be OK.  .35 Whelen in primitive season, have to wonder, Does anyone use a primitive weapon during that season?
H08

[Luckyducker]

I don't claim to be an expert on Encores or any other firearm but have two Encore rifle barrels and neither of them have headspace issues.   The only rifle I have owned that had a headspace issue was a Commercial FN Mauser action with a custom Shilen barrel that the smith chambered to 264Win.   I had to neck size only for this rifle because the brass was stretching something awful every firing and I knew case failure was imminent if I didn't.    The chamber of that Mauser was so generous that when I replaced it with a custom Encore 264 barrel the brass couldn't even be sized enough to fit in the chamber of the Encore, and the only fix was all new brass which works great.   Anybody need some once or twice fired 264 brass?  Very cheap?

[doeroller]

   I can think of no one now that uses a true blackpowder primitive weapon now that the rules have changed. You can go buy a H&R in 45-70 for alot less money than a top of the line muzzleloader. And you do not have to fool with all that cleaning and loading. Just put the round in and shoot. Accuracy is usually better too.

[skb2706]

If you have a barrel that when installed on your Encore closes on a NO-GO guage I would contact TC and find out what they consider acceptable. It is not SAAMI spec. Therefore unacceptable to me.

[troy_mclure]

   I can think of no one now that uses a true blackpowder primitive weapon now that the rules have changed. You can go buy a H&R in 45-70 for alot less money than a top of the line muzzleloader. And you do not have to fool with all that cleaning and loading. Just put the round in and shoot. Accuracy is usually better too.

many states still require flintlock/matchlock muzzle loaders for primitive weapons season. and a 45/70 is illegal to hunt with in ohio.


where would i find a go/no go gauge?

[epanzella]

    Here in Mississippi it is now legal to hunt with a 35 or larger caliber in primitive weapon season. The weapon of choice now is a 35 Whelen. The barrels I have worked with have had a large amount of headspace. In some, the gun would close on a field gauge! Most guns the factory ammo would be a lose and sloppy fit in the barrel. Full length sized reloads would have head separations after 3 loadings of the brass. I have also seen this excessive headspace in the 375 H&H caliber. What I have done is to partial resize the case so I have a fairly tight closing of the action. These barrels also have long throats. The bullets have to seated out REAL far to just miss the rifling. Is this procedure the correct thing to do? Will T/C exchange the wide tolerance barrel that will close on a NO-GO and sometime a FIElD gauge? Have any of you had this experience?

The spec on TC headspace is .001 between the cartridge casehead and the breechblock (NOT the end of the barrel). There are shim kits to pack out the breech  (firing bin bushing) to tighten up headspace but the shims can only reduce headspace to the point where you run out of space between the breech and the end of the barrel. If that is not sufficient you'll have to use shims under your sizing die untill you have the right headspace. You measure the headspace by removing the barrel, then taking a depth gage and measuring where the (fireformed and then sized) cartridge head is in relation to the end of the barrel and then adding the barrel gap. The sum should be .001 inch. The 375 H&H headspaces on the belt so shimming the sizing die shouldn't change how deep the case goes into the chamber untill you get to the point where the belt is lifting off it's seat in the chamber.