.475 Linebaugh cast bullet

[Silvertp]

Was reading thru the Taffin Tests for .475 Lin. and noticed his reference to LBT's 405 grain bullet #476.440LFN and the accuracy he achieved with it.  I am thinking this would make a good all-round carry slug for hunting elk and up.

Do any of the cast bullet manufacturers sell this bullet so that I could try them in my revolver? 

Is there anything specific about this bullet that makes it inherently more accurate than some of the other cast slugs?

Any other folks have a favorite .475 linebaugh round for hunting and just shooting fun?

Thanks
Silvertp

[Lloyd Smale]

cast performance sells lfns. Me i prefer keiths for the most part. Frank at MT. Baldy bullets sells a real nice 475 kieth

[paul105]

Montana bullet works has true LBT bullets.  They offer a .475 400gr LFNGC that weighs right at 410gr.  The same bullet is also offered as a plain base.

http://www.montanabulletworks.com/wst_page6.html

Paul

[Silvertp]

Thanks folks for the information.

Lloyd, not sure what type of bullet I will find my Freedom Arms liking.  I will likely try a bunch, including Keith style,  before I settle on my primary hunting / carry load.

Paul105.  I went straight to the Montana bullet works web site you linked.  They have quite an assortment of cast bullet choices.  I may try both the GC and plain base bullets within their respective velocity ranges. 

Im getting pretty jacked up with reloading for this gun.  Working on jacketed bullets now and can't wait to try some cast loads.

Silvertp

[paul105]

Silvertip,

Before you go and buy a bunch of bullets, read the following.  I went back thru some of my prior posts on cast bullets and my Freedom Arms 475.  I cut and paste some paragraphs from those prior posts and didn't bother to edit, so some stuff may be redundant.  It's all relevant and may save you some heartburn.

There is no easy answer when using cast bullets in the .475 Freedom Arms revolvers.  Anything with a crimp to nose length less than or equal to .375" will fit the cyl lengthwise without having to resort to trimming the cases or seating above the crimp grove.  What you have to be careful of is the diameter of the bullet in front of the crimp grove.  Some of the LBT style bullets (sized to .476) will be full diameter in front of the crimp grove enough so that the bullet will not chamber in the throat even though the overall length is short enough for the cylinder.   I haven't found a bullet sized to .475 that is within the overall length constraint that won't chamber in the FA.

For example, my gun likes .476 bullets, but some of the LBT style bullets sized .476 will not chamber in my gun because the forward portion of the bullet in front of the crimp groove will not enter the chamber due to tight throats.  On the other hand,  there are several other makes (Cast Performance & Leadheads) of bullets sized to .476 that will chamber with no problem -- diameter above crimp grove is .475, or the amount of bullet in front of the crimp grove is short enough to allow chambering.

Again, I haven't found a bullet sized to .475 that meets overall length requirements that won't chamber in the FA.

In my experience with the FA 475 LB any of the Keith SWCs with the wide front drive band above cyl throat diameter are virtually impossible to seat in tight throated cyls (they are also too long to seat normally).  The LBT WFN with the longer (relative to a shorter nose in same caliber) nose to crimp measurement can also be difficult to seat.  The WFNs from Cast Performance, as well as some of Leadhead’s bullets seem to be dual diameter – the base will be larger than the portion of the bullet in front of the crimp grove – so no seating problems.  LFNs, and RFNs seem to be less prone to sizing/chambering problems.  Unfortunately, about the only way you are going to figure it out is to actually try different nose profiles, manufacturers and diameters.

The 400gr Lee is a bit too long (.390 crimp grove to nose) to crimp normally.  Using Hornady dies, I shoot/have shot a bunch of these (Lee 400gr) crimped slightly above the crimp grove using 20.0gr of 2400 without any problems.  In my gun the 400gr Lee, sized .476 using 20.0gr of 2400 is a very accurate load.  It runs right at 1,100 fps.

If you happen to get some bullets that won't chamber due to tight throats, you can get serviceable ammo by either crimping in front of the crimp grove, or by trimming you cases.  Remember, the shorter OAL will reduce powder capacity a bit, and you will have to reduce powder charges accordingly.  I'm lazy, so I crimp in front of the crimp grove.  Example, the 400gr RCBS SWC, can't be crimped normally in the FA -- using 19.0gr of A2400, crimping over the front drive band chronographs about 1,160 fps at 80 deg F, while other 400gr Cast Bullets will run slightly under 1,100 fps.

The Mt Bullet Wks 400gr LBT LFNGC/PB with a nose to crimp of .370 is the longest bullet that works in my gun without trimming the cases.

With the longer bullets and heavier loads, make sure you check for crimp jump.

Ultimately, you will have to figure it out by trial and error.

Paul

[Lloyd Smale]

paul hit it on the head. I didnt know you were talking about a fa gun. My fa 475 will not chamber most of my bullets for my linebaugh gun. Theres a couple ballistic cast designs i have that work and a couple molds i got group buys organized for on the cast bullet form that work. I couldnt tell you what comercail cast bullets will work as i havent tried any in my fa gun.

[Silvertp]

Paul105 and Llyod

Thanks for the heads-up.  I was unaware that the bullet dimension above the crimp groove is so critical in the .475 FA.  Very valuable information.  Will definitely slow down my reloading and pay more attention to bullet fitment now that you have alerted me. 

Is this primarily only a factor in the 400 grain + bullets? 

Seating above the cannlure sounds like a simple solution.  If I need to crimp above the groove I would probably reduce the powder charge by 10% to account for the reduced case capacity.  In your experience is this enough of a reduction to stay out of trouble? 

Really appreciate the advise and information you guys are providing.

Silvertp

[paul105]

Silvertip,

"I was unaware that the bullet dimension above the crimp groove is so critical in the .475 FA.  Very valuable information.  Will definitely slow down my reloading and pay more attention to bullet fitment now that you have alerted me.

Is this primarily only a factor in the 400 grain + bullets? "

Not limited to 400gr bullets.  Montana Bullet Works typically shows crimp to nose dimensions in the bullet listings.

"Seating above the cannlure sounds like a simple solution.  If I need to crimp above the groove I would probably reduce the powder charge by 10% to account for the reduced case capacity.  In your experience is this enough of a reduction to stay out of trouble?"

There is no way to tell -- it would depend on the bullet, powder, charge, etc.  As an idividual you have no way of being sure.   I only crimp above the drive band with light to moderate loads.

I've settled on two loads.  The Montana bullet works 400gr LFN with 15.0gr HS6, and the Montana Bullet Works 420gr WFNGC with 25.0gr of H110.  Depending upon powder lot, those loads chronograph (from my 6" ported FA) 1,100 fps and 1,275 fps respectively.  I could easily get along with just the 400gr at 1,100 fps.

The 420gr WFNGC nose to crimp is short enough to give you an extra margin of safety relating to crimp jump tying your gun up with the heavier load.  I've never had a crimp jump problem with either load.

Hope some of this is helpful.

Paul

[Silvertp]

Paul, very helpful. 

This is the kind of specific information you can't get from books and that can be so valuable when working up loads.  I'm  starting to feel like I can start working with the cast slugs now and find some good loads by spring bear season.

Much appreciated.

Ken (Silvertp)

[Lloyd Smale]

like paul said if you know your only going to load for that mold trimming your brass to fit your gun is probably a better answer then crimping out of the grove.

[fowler]

Silvertip I have to add that Paul and Lloyd have steered you strait so far. I got a FA 475 4 3/4" barreled gun last year and have learned a lot over the year. Now I cast and size my own bullets mostly from LBT molds but I do have a Lee 325gr mold that I have cast but a handful of bullets from, only because they hit a long ways from my other molds. The throats on both of my cylinders (I have a 480 Ruger cylinder in addition to the 475) is .475 so I size my bullets at .475 and I have never had a chambering issue.

I have settled on running a 375gr LFNPB sized .475 in 480 cases for 90% of my shooting now. I normally run my bullets at 850 to 950 fps because they are still pleasant to shoot and seem to be pretty accurate at that speed or faster. I would not hesitate to hunt deer with this load as it would still blow right through one. For hunting elk here in Colorado I shoot a 425gr WLNPB at 1100fps but I also feel that the 375 would be just fine at that same 1100fps velocity as it has proven to be a more accurate load in my gun than the 425gr bullet in the last few months (I only got the mold in November).

My one suggestion is start mild with your gun unless you have a fair bit of big bore shooting experience (I thought I did after running stout loads in my Ruger Bisley 45 colts, I didn't). Start with 800 or 900fps loads and run a few hundred of them before stepping up to 1000 to 1100fps loads and run a crap load of them before stepping up to 1200+fps loads. The 475 can get to be a brutal gun to shoot from recoil and it WILL develop flinches for a lot of guys in a hurry, especially if you jump the gun and run full power loads too early. Yes recoil is all in your head but once your mind tells your body that a certain gun hurts is it is almost impossible to control a flinch from that day forwards. But if you start with light loads, get used to the gun and trigger and work your way up the recoil ladder slowly then you should be fine. Once the damage is done it is very hard to undo it.

Good luck.

Bill

[Silvertp]

Bill,

I appreciate your confirmation of the info contained in this thread, plus your experiences with cast loads in the FA .475 as well.

I can see myself producing my own cast bullets sometime in the future, but want to try some out before I take the plunge.  To date my only big bore handgun was a .44 Mag in a Ruger super blackhawk.  I shot a lot of heavy loads thru that gun and packed it many a mile and think it was good preparation for moving up to the .475.  Now that Ive got the FA I'll never look back.  When I need a serious handgun Ive got a new friend for packing.

I think your advice for working up to the heavier loads makes sense.  Even when I shoot my heavy recoil rifles I like to "sneak up" on the heaviest loads by shooting lighter recoiling rifles and rounds before I jump in on the big-stuff.  Helps me get mentally prepared to enjoy shooting the heavy rounds.  Also makes sense as I would like to have a lighter load that is more "plinker friendly" and that I can use for letting friends shoot, may as well work up that light load while on the way to my packing / hunting load. 

Good shooting to ya
Ken