Author Topic: Gun control as a measure of safety and freedom  (Read 993 times)

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Offline FWiedner

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Gun control as a measure of safety and freedom
« on: March 14, 2009, 08:34:36 AM »
"All human situations have their inconveniences. We feel those of the present but neither see nor feel those of the future; and hence we often make troublesome changes without amendment, and frequently for the worse."

Those words, once uttered by Benjamin Franklin, speak well to the often futile attempts of our elected officials to legislate crime out of existence. They see a situation, and they react. Often well-meaning, but just as frequently without careful study into what will be the results of their actions. When terrible things happen, people feel they have to do something about it... take action, have a plan, keep the bad people from doing bad things. Elected officials don't want to be seen as weak on crime and unwilling to act to protect their constituents.

The problem is, they go about it the wrong way. They blame the law for being weak instead of the criminal for being corrupt and unwilling to follow society's rules. Somehow, it seems to them that if they just made more, stronger laws that this time it would make a difference. And it does. But not the difference they intended.

http://www.examiner.com/x-2206-Cleveland-Gun-Rights-Examiner~y2009m3d13-Gun-control-as-a-measure-of-safety-and-freedom

Note:  ...And then there are those who deliberately use unfortunate or tragic events as an opportunity to advance a defined social agenda which has nothing to do with the specific event.  Like politicians who use the occurance of a mass murder as a pretense to disarm thousands of people who weren't involved.  It's not about crime control, it's just about control.

 :)
They may talk of a "New Order" in the  world, but what they have in mind is only a revival of the oldest and worst tyranny.   No liberty, no religion, no hope.   It is an unholy alliance of power and pelf to dominate and to enslave the human race.

Offline Graybeard

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Re: Gun control as a measure of safety and freedom
« Reply #1 on: March 16, 2009, 08:50:06 AM »
True, true true.

BTW Welcome back Fred it's been a long while.


Bill aka the Graybeard
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I am not a lawyer and do not give legal advice.

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Offline FWiedner

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Re: Gun control as a measure of safety and freedom
« Reply #2 on: March 16, 2009, 09:40:36 AM »
Thanks for the welcome Mr. Graybeard.

 ;D
They may talk of a "New Order" in the  world, but what they have in mind is only a revival of the oldest and worst tyranny.   No liberty, no religion, no hope.   It is an unholy alliance of power and pelf to dominate and to enslave the human race.

Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: Gun control as a measure of safety and freedom
« Reply #3 on: March 16, 2009, 09:55:03 AM »
If the goal was crime control or to stop terror . then all Americans would go armed plain and simple . At some point enough people decided they would hire someone to protect them . They allowed politicans to fill this role thru. police . It created jobs , and raised taxes and big GOVT. was born and accepted by most. Then along came welfare etc. and voters felt they were getting free stuff and Govt. got bigger . And we the people got weaker . And now so many are weak we may never be we the people again but we the subjects !
If ya can see it ya can hit it !

Offline rparsons934

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Re: Gun control as a measure of safety and freedom
« Reply #4 on: March 16, 2009, 09:59:59 AM »
What good thread. FW welcome back even though i never knew you were gone lol. (sry im still new here). I agree with your and shootall's post. so i would say +1 to the both of you.
****The Second Amendment.....You dont know you need it until they come and try to take it away****

Offline robert4570

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Re: Gun control as a measure of safety and freedom
« Reply #5 on: March 22, 2009, 04:40:02 PM »
Well gun control did nothing for the UK and years later they have a new epidemic which politicians are trying to remedy thru legislation..... its called knife crimes . Thats right , they gave up guns and turns out they are worse off now than before. Imagine that an unarmed populace subjected to higher crime rates.
The Brady camp wont tell these tales.

Read below ;


http://www.bbc.co.uk/insideout/content/articles/2008/09/14/london_knife_crime_s14_w1_feature.shtml

Knife crime


Watch the knife crime video
Knife crime - guidance for parents >
 
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/magazine/3244709.stm

Is knife crime really getting worse? 
By Megan Lane & Brian Wheeler
BBC News Online Magazine 


 
Concern about violent crime in Britain has swung back to knives and their availability to children. But has so-called "knife culture" risen while the media's attention has been so fixed on gun crime?
It's a shopping list likely to send a chill down the spine: kitchen knives, axes, razor sharp "cat skinners" and Ninja-style throwing knives.

Yet these and other potentially lethal weapons can be easily bought by children, according to a new national survey.

Almost half of shops tested broke the law by selling knives to children under 16, according to the Trading Standards Institute. And internet traders are even more of a push over because of the anonymity involved in buying something online.

 
Michael Howard, launching an anti-knife campaign in 1996
Sceptics, however, might comment that it has always been thus. There's nothing new about youngsters seeking to boost their street cred by carrying a blade.

It used to be the lore of the playground that flick knives - illegal in the UK - could be effortlessly picked up across the Channel (and so retained a status as the ultimate souvenir from a French exchange trip).

So are we really witnessing a rise in so-called "knife culture" or is the recent coverage afforded to the issue in newspapers just a spot of media hysteria?

Evidence shows knife seizures are on the increase. The number of people convicted of carrying a blade in public rose from 2,559 in 1995 to 3,570 in 2000, according to the Home Office.

Reports from hospital A&E departments indicate a rise in stab wounds, particularly among young men aged between 14 and 25.

Daily routine

One expert with street-level experience is convinced more young people are arming themselves with knives these days.

  Everybody goes to the market and buys kitchen knives - they say they want to use them in the kitchen, but they don't

Youth club member, John
"We are seeing more and more stab wounds - even five years ago, these were pretty rare. Young males in particular are carrying knives on a daily basis, and if they carry them, they use them," says John Heyworth, of the British Association for Accident and Emergency Medicine.

Those young men are often of school age, according to a survey by the Youth Justice Board this year. It found that of the crimes committed by young people, carrying a knife was the most common offence among children excluded from school (62%).

Undoubtedly, the problem is a predominantly urban one. Julie Jacobs, of the Streatham Youth Centre in south London, says some young people begin to carry knives from about the age of 11, when they first begin to venture out of their home patch.

A 'cyclone knife', bought online
"There is a sense that they need some sort of protection. It is a turf thing, a territory thing, but I don't think it is getting any worse."
So have youngsters themselves seen a rise in knife brandishing?
John, a 17-year-old at the Charter House Youth Club, in Southwark, London, believes the problem is "getting worse" although he does not know anyone who carries a knife.
He was once been threatened by three boys with kitchen knives, while on a bus.
"They were trying to jack me. They wanted my mobile phone and my money. There is nothing that can be done about people getting hold of knives. Everybody goes to the market and buys kitchen knives. They say they want to use them in the kitchen, but they don't."

Suspended from school

One 14-year-old from Peckham thinks there's a lot of bluster from kids trying to appear harder than they are. 
Hidden in a comb - concealed blades are easily available
"I know people who brag about carrying knives. They say they have a great big butcher's knife. People say silly things."

He says a boy at his school was suspended after a knife was found in his bag. But generally, he says, the situation is getting better at his school.
"Maybe one day out of seven someone will say 'give me you money' or something, but I never have been threatened with a knife."
Of those that do brandish a blade, many justify it as in the interests of "self defence", says Unun Seshmi, who runs a charity called Boyhood to Manhood which is dedicated to steering young black people away from crime.

"They are walking around in fear of being stabbed. They feel there is nobody there to protect them. They don't want to go to the police. But they don't want to use the knife either."
 


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United Sportsmen of America

Offline Cabin4

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Re: Gun control as a measure of safety and freedom
« Reply #6 on: March 24, 2009, 02:22:51 PM »
Thomas Jefferson: "Laws that forbid the carrying of arms...disarm only those who are neither
inclined or determined to commit crimes. Such laws only make things worse for the assaulted and
better for the assassins; they serve to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man
may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man." (1764 Letter and speech from T.
Jefferson quoting with approval an essay by Cesare Beccari)

Avery Hayden Wallace
Obama Administration: A corrupt criminal enterprise of bold face liars.
The States formed the Union. The Union did not form the States. States Rights!
GET US OUT OF THE UN. NO ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT!
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Long Live the King! #3

Offline smith85619

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Re: Gun control as a measure of safety and freedom
« Reply #7 on: April 05, 2009, 06:57:03 PM »
"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both."
Benjamin Franklin
If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you.

Offline chrsm

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Re: Gun control as a measure of safety and freedom
« Reply #8 on: April 07, 2009, 11:16:28 AM »
I was at a state trap shot and my friends son left his grandfathers Browning in the gun rack, outside, in plane view of every passerby and only a arms length away from all. Hundreds of people if not thousands walked by it. They drove off not knowing of there lose. At the end of the day, some one turned in that fire arm to the office to be later reunited with the boy. Every fire arm event I go to whether gun show, shoot our club. This is when I feel the safest, the most American and the most comfortable. I wish I could feel that way with all people all the time. But to be unnist I am in fear. In fear of my own government,what they stand for and how they think. THIS IS NOT ENGLAND,EUROPE,RUSSIA,MEXICO,CANADA.... we are AMERICANS. Why should we be like them, have a government telling you what to do, how to act, what you can and can not say. We should not fear government, police, strangers......Government is simply to big for there britches. They promote fear, violence, unemployment and the rape of the dollar. I do not want to look in the crystal ball, for I am scared of are children's future. You take my guns away you take my freedom away as well. God help us all!!!!!!

Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: Gun control as a measure of safety and freedom
« Reply #9 on: April 07, 2009, 11:26:40 AM »
chrsm , a few gun shows ago here several guns were stolen off tables the one before that a truck load were taken from a dealer . Keep an eye out . The problem with GOVT. is they forced the doors open . We had to let anyone in to any event shooting or other wise . After years of this we no longer have groups of like minded people doing sports or shows you have anyone and anything comming in to screw up American dreams and ways of life .
If ya can see it ya can hit it !

Offline DDZ

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Re: Gun control as a measure of safety and freedom
« Reply #10 on: April 08, 2009, 12:12:04 PM »
When it comes to fixing crime, all our elected officals would have to do is look at past history by looking at the states that allow carry laws, without its citizens haveing to jump through hoops to carry a firearm. In every case where citizens were allowed to carry, crime has dropped. So I don't buy the fact that our elected officals can't see what reduces crime. They damn well know that making more laws will not fix the problem. The proof is as plain as black and white. Our second amendment was not writen for you to protect yourself from bad guys. It was written to protect a free people from tyranny. Our elected officals are not stupid, they do know this, even if they won't admit it. By making more gun laws, and eventually making laws, to make it illegal to own a firearm. (governments intent) Government will then have all the power they need to do what they want. Never think that our over powered government dosn't know what they are doing.   
Those people who will not be governed by God will be ruled by tyrants.    Wm. Penn

Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: Gun control as a measure of safety and freedom
« Reply #11 on: April 08, 2009, 12:16:39 PM »
There will always be crime , if we are free then we would be allowed to defend ourselves with out worry of becomming a criminal . Crime control is best applied at the time of the crime .
If ya can see it ya can hit it !