Author Topic: Basic Information  (Read 1046 times)

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Offline iunderpressure

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Basic Information
« on: May 21, 2009, 08:20:13 PM »
I've don't a lot of inline muzzleloading, but now I'm trying the more traditional stuff.  I have a .50 CVA Bobcat and am goin to try it.  I believe it is 1 in 48".  Is 1 in 48" the best for using conicals and round balls?  What is a good powder range for loads when shooting the conicals and round balls?  And what would be the deer hunting range with both conicals and round ball?

Thanks

Offline flintlock

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Re: Basic Information
« Reply #1 on: May 22, 2009, 01:01:25 AM »
A 1-48 twist is kinda a compromise twist for a 50 caliber...Round ball barrels would be 1-66 twist and the rifling cut .012-.015 deep...

That being said, I have seen 1-48 twist button cut rifling barrels shoot pretty well, they just seem a bit pickier as to the powder charge and the combination of patch/ball and lube that they prefer...

For a .50 your target load can run from 50-60 grains and deer loads from 70-100 grains...You just need to vary the charge and see what the gun prefers...

Effective range will run 100-125 yards which is about as far as most need to be shooting with open sights...

One component that doesn't get enough attention from beginning round ball shooters is the patch and lube used...I got away from using prelubed factory patches years ago because of patch burn through...I think a better system is to go with bulk cotton pillow ticking, wash it a couple of times and then you can experiment with different lubes and see which is most accurate...Bulk patches can either be cut at the muzzle or pre cut...

Lubes I'd suggest trying...SnoSeal...a mix of 8 parts Castor Oil, 2 parts bees wax and 1 part Murphy's Oil Soap...straight olive oil...crisco...ballistol, sometimes cut 50/50 with water, sprayed on and dried...

I've even seen shooters use axle grease for their patches...

When working up a load be sure to recover and check out used patches, I put a tarp several feet in front of the muzzle to catch them...Patches that burn through will not give good groups...Cut patches means your rifling is too sharp and needs polishing...

Offline longcaribiner

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Re: Basic Information
« Reply #2 on: May 22, 2009, 02:46:39 AM »
Bobcats are a fair little gun for the money.  For a short barrel going over 80 grains is pretty much a waste of powder, it doesn't completely burn before the ball exits the muzzle.  That powder that is still burning increases fouling and makes for a large muzzle flash, but adds nothing to accuracy or energy.

I have a CVA frontier rifle which is basically the same gun with  double set triggers.  My kids learn to shoot with it and get pretty good accuracy at 25 yards with only 30 grains of powder.  For paper punching, that is all you need with such a gun.  For hunting, I'd say 75 to 80 grains of 2f is about the top, reduce that by 5 to 10 grains for 3f.     I don't use factory patches.  For target shooting, swab the bore between shots, wet patch followed by dry patch.  For patch lube at the target range, spit is actually one of the best patch lubes.  I cut my own patches, and basically suck on a patch while swabbing the bore and then use that patch to reload.  For hunting, I use patches dipped in melted bees wax or shortening.        Don't use a petroleum oil for patch lube.  The heat of the powder bakes a small portion of the oil to the barrel wall and eventually becomes a problem and is a difficult thing to remove.

Offline iunderpressure

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Re: Basic Information
« Reply #3 on: May 22, 2009, 07:12:11 AM »
what size group are you getting at 100 yards with open sights.  I'm shooting at a piece of cardboard about 18"x12", and i'm hitting it everytime but it's all over the place.  I know some of the problem are the sights.  Maybe a ghost ring rear sight would help.

Offline flintlock

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Re: Basic Information
« Reply #4 on: May 22, 2009, 09:05:56 AM »
3-4 inch groups now, my eyes just aren't what they used to be...But that's with my flintlocks, never owned a percussion, plus my barrels are 38 and 42 inches...

If you are just starting, go back to 50 yards, go with a 6'oclock hold and set your gun up to shoot 2 inches high at 50 yards...Once you can keep your shots inside 1 1/2 inches then move to 75 yards and finally 100...You should be close to dead on at 75 yards and about 2 inches low at 100...

Offline Buckskins & Black Powder

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Re: Basic Information
« Reply #5 on: May 22, 2009, 10:48:12 AM »
i had a bobcat, very accurate rifle..  The bullets i used were what i recommened for your omega, only i used the 295's with 80gr pyrodex RS.  Round ball load was 60gr pyrodex rs with .015 patch and .490 round ball.

heres some ideas on new sights,
http://www.marblearms.com/bullseyeSights.html

Offline iunderpressure

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Re: Basic Information
« Reply #6 on: May 22, 2009, 11:12:33 AM »
Does anyone know about what the difference would be on a patch and ball with 60 grains of pyrodex vs 80?  And is there a magic velocity you want for hunting?

Offline Buckskins & Black Powder

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Re: Basic Information
« Reply #7 on: May 22, 2009, 04:38:58 PM »
i used 60gr for targets. Normally i use between 80 to 100, whichever is the most accurate for hunting.

Offline dustyr

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Re: Basic Information
« Reply #8 on: May 24, 2009, 03:09:58 AM »
I've got one of these - lot of fun to shoot. I recently swapped out the synthetic stock for a wood one, and upgraded the sights. I haven't worked up a hunting load yet, but it does a pretty good job at 50 yds using TC Cheap Shots sabots with 75 gr P-RS (2" groups are the average)


Offline JPShelton

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Re: Basic Information
« Reply #9 on: May 26, 2009, 02:00:46 AM »
what size group are you getting at 100 yards with open sights.  I'm shooting at a piece of cardboard about 18"x12", and i'm hitting it everytime but it's all over the place.  I know some of the problem are the sights.  Maybe a ghost ring rear sight would help.

I shoot a .50 caliber Lyman Great Plains Rifle. With the original 1:60 patched roundball barrel, firing a .490 Hornady swadged ball in conjuction with a .015 pillow ticking patch over a volumetric 70 grain charge of Pyrodex P, it'll shoot clover leafs for three shots at 100 yards.  It is a very accurate caplock.  With the 1:32 conical barrel, it'll shoot within 2 M.O.A. for three shots at 100 yards firing Hornady Great Plains bullets over 70 grains of FFg Triple 7, provided that my loading technique is consistant and I seat the bullet to just ever so slightly compress the powder -and I do mean "ever so slightly" as in virtually not at all.  With the same charge of Pyrodex RS, groups open up to 3" or more at 100 yards for three consecutive shots, with significant vertical stringing on the target, indicating a velocity variation.  With real FFg Goex, it'll put three shots in under 2.5 inches at 100, pretty much regardless of temperature or humidity, and within reason, pretty much regardless of how sloppy and inconsistant my loading technique is.  It isn't the most accurate powder, but it is the most consistant. 

My sights are the fixed "primitive" rear and a custom German silver front blade.  Nothin' fancy there.

Whether balls or conicals, it remains a 125 yard max range rifle.  The difference is use.  I use the patched balls for whitetails here at home and the plan is to use the conicals for elk, assuming I draw a tag somewhere this year.

I'm not convinced that a modern inline is really going to offer me much of an advantage, aside from being easier to shoot in low light and easier to shoot accurately, period, assuming its scoped.  I haven't seen any that are significantly more precise than my GPR, however.

-JP