Author Topic: more Swiss in a longrifle.....reading patches?  (Read 599 times)

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Offline tommy4toes

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more Swiss in a longrifle.....reading patches?
« on: September 13, 2003, 12:06:13 PM »
well I took some advice from the board here, and switched to .495 RBs with pillow ticking(washed) patches. Shooting was only at 25yds because of the winds here this afternoon.
Powders tried were Swiss 1.5F and Swiss 3F (I forgot to bring the 2F, duh). Starting at a caliber's worth of 3F(50grs), groups averaged around 1". 60grs produced a 3 shot cloverleaf 2" above the bull, but after adjusting hold on the rifle settled back down where they should have been. This powder is really "jumpy", and the rifle needs to be gripped rather than rested on the sandbags alone.
Pretty much the same results with the 1.5. When the wind didnt blow the powder out of the pan, groups were good with slightly less fouling than the 3F. Best accuracy was with 65grs, once again a 3 leaf clover.
Finally the winds got bad so I packed it up and went looking for patches, which by the way were square-cut pillow ticking lubed with spit. None showed any burn through, and a solid fouling ring with points that corresponded with the rifling. Is this good ? How does one "read" patches anyways?



t4t


t4t
we've all got it coming, kid.........

Offline wallynut

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more Swiss in a longrifle.....reading patch
« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2003, 12:17:34 AM »
When I look at patches, I usually am looking for cut thru areas to indicate rough rifling.  These will have straight "razor sharp" cuts.  The other thing I look for is burned thru areas showing blow by.  That is where the gasses are blowing past the bullet as it is going down the barrel after firing.

From what you said about your shooting, I'd have to assume that you are getting it where it needs to be with this rifle.  I've had a lot of 50cal rifles that will group using the 60-65 gr load when the right ball and patch combo is used, personally I will use a smaller ball and thicker patch so I don't have to "hammer" the load.  That's just me.  Sounds like your getting it where you need to.  You can keep on experimenting, you might find better results and the time spent shooting will never hurt neither.
aim small, miss small

Offline Triple Se7en

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more Swiss in a longrifle.....reading patch
« Reply #2 on: September 15, 2003, 01:54:29 AM »
Your patches are good Tommy!

Had you inspected burn-thru patches using spit, you can usually correct that by using a good non-petro lube like Lehigh Valley.
............. Keep Your Powder Dry ...................

Offline tommy4toes

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more Swiss in a longrifle.....reading patch
« Reply #3 on: September 15, 2003, 03:39:39 AM »
OK thats what i thought. Hopefully I'm getting on the right track with this rifle. The .495 balls seem to produce better accuracy, but theyre tough to get down the barrel with the pillow ticking patches(with a spit lube)
I made up a batch of moose milk, and have mink oil, LeHigh, sperm oil, as well as some SPG-lubed patching to try when i get to go shooting again.
thanks fellas


t4t
we've all got it coming, kid.........

Offline Triple Se7en

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more Swiss in a longrifle.....reading patch
« Reply #4 on: September 15, 2003, 09:39:31 AM »
OK Tommy...

.... what's with-this sperm oil? Never heard of that!  Ah... never mind! I'm not even going to ask where you got that stuff from...lol

Well maybe I will ask this one question. Is this sperm oil home-made?... lol again!
............. Keep Your Powder Dry ...................

Offline johnt

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more Swiss in a longrifle.....reading patch
« Reply #5 on: September 15, 2003, 01:41:48 PM »
Ok, I've seen this a hunderd times.
 1st, no joke, if you have true sperm oil don't waste it for patch lube. The oil from the head cavity of the Sperm whale is $50 per oz. round these part's, clock makers use it.

 Now, onto the problem. Changing lubes for prb is not as important as the amount of any of the given lubes as applied to the patch. Spit works fine,if the gun is to be discharge immediatly and/or if the bore is not hot from repetitave firing. Think like this,"is the patch damp with spit or really slathered?" is it the same each time?""everytime?" I use spit patch fer tween shot swabs,damp.
 After years of shooting traditional bp and having fun and sum success,I began experimenting with patch lube properties. I got an old eye drops bottle and found 2 drops of lube on each precut patch shot different than 3 drops per precut using 5 shot groups. I finally found that using 4 drops on three patches rolling them tween my fingers to spread the lube throughout the patch worked best,,,ya have any idea what kind of PITA that is!? Well more later,,,, my point is there are many many fine lubes on the market and some that have been used for centuries, it's about finding the right amount for your gun,powder,ball,and cloth. Think,,poor. Think,, conservative. Think,, every shot count's,how can I keep it the same?
 
  When the group fall's apart it's not because you have failed,,your learning something,ya just have to find out what it is :)

Offline tommy4toes

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more Swiss in a longrifle.....reading patch
« Reply #6 on: September 15, 2003, 05:18:49 PM »
yes John it's real sperm oil...........want to buy 17oz.? I wouldnt sell it anyways...........
sorry I'm being sarcastic.........i guess I'm going to have to play with my methods some more - I've gotten some decent results but i know this rifle can shoot better - I can feel it. Years of shooting tell me that, I just have to find the key. It may well be the  patches and lube; thats what I'm asking y'all about.
Thanks for the hints and direction.

Here we go again

t4t
we've all got it coming, kid.........

Offline River runner

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more Swiss in a longrifle.....reading patch
« Reply #7 on: September 17, 2003, 04:24:08 PM »
Tommy 4 Toes, Johnt, has got it right as far as lube goes. He taught me a thing or two, and I've been shooting since Dan'l Boone was a pup. As with any shooting discipline, consistency is a must and first cousin to accuracy. One thing I noted about your original post, is you mentioned "you had to hold the rifle, not just rest it etc" Any bench rest shooting, be it for competition, or sighting in for the big hunt, must be held firmly into your shoulder, for the ultimate accuracy, allowing the rifles recoil to be free, will adversely affect the poi. Try this, and I'll bet after a few trial runs, you'll be shooting one holers at 25 yards in the wind, or at least diminish the size of the clover leafs noticeably. RR :D

Offline tommy4toes

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more Swiss in a longrifle.....reading patch
« Reply #8 on: September 17, 2003, 07:08:12 PM »
thanks River Runner

I've been following johnt's advice; and have gotten quite an improvement. However, there's still some things lacking. It may be the shooter.
I've gotten some great groups but I am looking for longer range - 100yds or so for hunting this fall. One thing i have to get used to is the longer barrel - dwell time - and figure out this "consistent" lube thing. I really do believe thats the key.

t4t
we've all got it coming, kid.........

Offline WD45

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more Swiss in a longrifle.....reading patch
« Reply #9 on: September 20, 2003, 03:17:49 AM »
Along the lines of the consistancy thing, It can make some difference in accuracy by how you seat the ball. Now I have seen some fellers go a little waco over this and I am not suggesting that but there is some truth to the madness. Try to be consistant with the amount of pressure you use to seat the ball on the charge.
Wish I had a place to ask questions like this 30 years ago :D