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Offline bikerbeans

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45 70 Iron Sight Question
« on: March 08, 2010, 02:39:22 PM »
Hi All,

I was shooting my used 45 70 again today and the grin keeps getting bigger.  But after a while I had to look at the target and see what was going on.  At 60 yds my iron sight gun is shooting about 6" high and this is with the rear sight down as low as it will go.  The barrel has the Williams sight which I believe to be factory.  This sight is not very tall so I don't think I can find a lower rear sight to replace it with.  I want to leave iron sights on this barrel but not sure how to correct the problem.  Any thoughts?  I am using factory ammo, Remington 405 SP and Hornady 325 Leverolution and they both are hitting about 6" high at 60 yards.

BB
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RIP Tom: Tom Nolan, ( bikerbeans) passed away this afternoon (02-04-2021).

Why be difficult, when with a little extra effort you can be impossible?

Wife's Handis;  300 BLKOUT

MINE:  270W, 308x444, 44 Bodeen, 410 shorty rifled slug gun, 445 SuperMag Shikari, 45 ACP shorty,  45-70 Shikari, 45 Cal Smokeless MZ, 50cal 24" SS Sidekick, 50 cal 24" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Sidekick, 50-70 Govt Shikari, Tracker II 20 ga shorty, 20 ga VR Pardner, 20ga USH, 12ga VR NWTF, 12ga Tracker II shorty WITHOUT scope, 12ga USH, 10 ga  Pardner Smoothbore slug gun & 24ga Profino Custom rifled slug gun.

Offline Big Blue

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Re: 45 70 Iron Sight Question
« Reply #1 on: March 08, 2010, 02:44:36 PM »
Could you put a taller front sight on it?
Don
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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: 45 70 Iron Sight Question
« Reply #2 on: March 08, 2010, 02:46:24 PM »
Sounds like they put the wrong front sight on it, I'd call H&R and get the correct sight for it. The parts lists shows .476", .578", and 634".

Tim
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Offline bikerbeans

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Re: 45 70 Iron Sight Question
« Reply #3 on: March 09, 2010, 01:29:45 AM »
thanks Tim.  New front sight probably better than my original idea of going after the rear sight with my Dremel.

BB
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RIP Tom: Tom Nolan, ( bikerbeans) passed away this afternoon (02-04-2021).

Why be difficult, when with a little extra effort you can be impossible?

Wife's Handis;  300 BLKOUT

MINE:  270W, 308x444, 44 Bodeen, 410 shorty rifled slug gun, 445 SuperMag Shikari, 45 ACP shorty,  45-70 Shikari, 45 Cal Smokeless MZ, 50cal 24" SS Sidekick, 50 cal 24" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Sidekick, 50-70 Govt Shikari, Tracker II 20 ga shorty, 20 ga VR Pardner, 20ga USH, 12ga VR NWTF, 12ga Tracker II shorty WITHOUT scope, 12ga USH, 10 ga  Pardner Smoothbore slug gun & 24ga Profino Custom rifled slug gun.

Offline bikerbeans

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Re: 45 70 Iron Sight Question
« Reply #4 on: March 09, 2010, 05:00:09 AM »
Tim knows all!!!! ;D ;D ;D

Front sight on this 45 70 barrel measures just under .4 inch.  Set screw has been epoxied in place so I think this barrel will get optics. 

thanks again Tim.

By the way, the 45 70 shell plate for my Dillon 550 is scheduled to arrive today so I am getting ready to load the Starline brass you helped me out with.  Going to try 405 grain cast lead RNFP first with the BH 209 load data from Western Powder.  The folks at my range have already named this rifle the Elephant Gun.  You should show up with your 45 120 and let them see a real gun! :D
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RIP Tom: Tom Nolan, ( bikerbeans) passed away this afternoon (02-04-2021).

Why be difficult, when with a little extra effort you can be impossible?

Wife's Handis;  300 BLKOUT

MINE:  270W, 308x444, 44 Bodeen, 410 shorty rifled slug gun, 445 SuperMag Shikari, 45 ACP shorty,  45-70 Shikari, 45 Cal Smokeless MZ, 50cal 24" SS Sidekick, 50 cal 24" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Sidekick, 50-70 Govt Shikari, Tracker II 20 ga shorty, 20 ga VR Pardner, 20ga USH, 12ga VR NWTF, 12ga Tracker II shorty WITHOUT scope, 12ga USH, 10 ga  Pardner Smoothbore slug gun & 24ga Profino Custom rifled slug gun.

Offline quickdtoo

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Re: 45 70 Iron Sight Question
« Reply #5 on: March 09, 2010, 05:30:54 AM »
Are ya sure it's epoxied? Loctite may require heat to remove small screws, I use a micro torch on scope base screws, a soldering iron will work too, may even work on epoxy!  ;)

Tim
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Offline spikehorn

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Re: 45 70 Iron Sight Question
« Reply #6 on: March 09, 2010, 05:44:12 AM »
Bikerbeans if you try the heat method quick suggested and are succesfull shoot me a PM. I traded for a 45-70 reccently and the rear sight was missing the elvation screw and the hole was very rusty, and with my eyes I scope all my rifles. I will send you the front sight off it.
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308 win                 45-70                       12ga         
30-30                    223 stainless steel   20ga TDC
44 mag                  Tracker II 20ga        20ga
45-70 Manlicher     20ga USH                28ga
                                                              410ga

Offline gcrank1

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Re: 45 70 Iron Sight Question
« Reply #7 on: March 09, 2010, 06:04:04 AM »
Give the front sight and barrel a little pre-heat with a smallish tip on a propane torch, then with a gloved hand insert the allen wrench to the screw while applying a little twist and a bit more heat. You will probably find it breaks free quite easily without a lot of heat.
If you get worried about the amount of heat you are using, Stop, and let what you have done saturate the metal for a bit, then try the wench again.
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Offline bikerbeans

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Re: 45 70 Iron Sight Question
« Reply #8 on: March 09, 2010, 08:38:49 AM »
I heated the offending allen head bolt for over an hour.  Bent a small allen wrench with no success.  I used a 1500 watt forced air resistance heater so the metal didn't get real hot.   Not sure I am brave enough to use a torch or soldering iron.  I have two identical 45 70 barrels and I planned to scope one of them and shoot iron sight with the other so it isn't a big deal.  Besides the sights on the other barrel are nicer (code, for large enough for me to still see them).  I do have an old T/C muzzleloader with epoxy in the scope base threads so might try the heat on that one first.  Will advise is I give it a go.

BB
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RIP Tom: Tom Nolan, ( bikerbeans) passed away this afternoon (02-04-2021).

Why be difficult, when with a little extra effort you can be impossible?

Wife's Handis;  300 BLKOUT

MINE:  270W, 308x444, 44 Bodeen, 410 shorty rifled slug gun, 445 SuperMag Shikari, 45 ACP shorty,  45-70 Shikari, 45 Cal Smokeless MZ, 50cal 24" SS Sidekick, 50 cal 24" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Sidekick, 50-70 Govt Shikari, Tracker II 20 ga shorty, 20 ga VR Pardner, 20ga USH, 12ga VR NWTF, 12ga Tracker II shorty WITHOUT scope, 12ga USH, 10 ga  Pardner Smoothbore slug gun & 24ga Profino Custom rifled slug gun.

Offline cult .44

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Re: 45 70 Iron Sight Question
« Reply #9 on: March 09, 2010, 09:25:39 AM »
FWIW, you can get different rear sight blades for the Williams sight. Midway has them. My .45-70 Handi came with the 1/4" blade but you can get 3/16", 5/16", and  3/8". Since they were pretty cheap, I grabbed them all. The 5/16" seems to work best all around for me so far.
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Offline dangerranger

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Re: 45 70 Iron Sight Question
« Reply #10 on: March 09, 2010, 10:16:49 PM »
 depending on what epoxy or thread locker was used you may have to get it to 290deg [for loctite] or 400deg [for epoxy] to let go. DR
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Offline bikerbeans

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Re: 45 70 Iron Sight Question
« Reply #11 on: March 10, 2010, 12:31:22 AM »
Hi Cult,

I looked at Midway and the rear sight blades appear to be for the Williams sight that come on more recent barrels.  This barrel has an older sight with a different style blade and adjuster.  My friend who owns the local gun shop said he will remove the front blade for me and it will only cost me a box of oatmeal raisin cookies.   Good deal for me since with my adult ADD small, stubborn things tend to end of smashed on the gun room floor. 

DR,

The only torch I own is tipped for propane and I used it for burning re-bar when I was demolishing concrete.  Probably a little excessive for gun barrel work. 

thanks to all for suggestions and info.

BB
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RIP Tom: Tom Nolan, ( bikerbeans) passed away this afternoon (02-04-2021).

Why be difficult, when with a little extra effort you can be impossible?

Wife's Handis;  300 BLKOUT

MINE:  270W, 308x444, 44 Bodeen, 410 shorty rifled slug gun, 445 SuperMag Shikari, 45 ACP shorty,  45-70 Shikari, 45 Cal Smokeless MZ, 50cal 24" SS Sidekick, 50 cal 24" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Sidekick, 50-70 Govt Shikari, Tracker II 20 ga shorty, 20 ga VR Pardner, 20ga USH, 12ga VR NWTF, 12ga Tracker II shorty WITHOUT scope, 12ga USH, 10 ga  Pardner Smoothbore slug gun & 24ga Profino Custom rifled slug gun.

Offline bikerbeans

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Re: 45 70 Iron Sight Question
« Reply #12 on: March 11, 2010, 05:23:11 AM »
Success!  Removed rear sight and got out a couple of files. Took 90 minutes but am good to go.  Gun shot just below point of aim @ 25 yards (backyard yard pistol range, be Monday before I can go to the club) with the sight bottomed out. 

thanks for help/suggestion.

BB
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RIP Tom: Tom Nolan, ( bikerbeans) passed away this afternoon (02-04-2021).

Why be difficult, when with a little extra effort you can be impossible?

Wife's Handis;  300 BLKOUT

MINE:  270W, 308x444, 44 Bodeen, 410 shorty rifled slug gun, 445 SuperMag Shikari, 45 ACP shorty,  45-70 Shikari, 45 Cal Smokeless MZ, 50cal 24" SS Sidekick, 50 cal 24" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Sidekick, 50-70 Govt Shikari, Tracker II 20 ga shorty, 20 ga VR Pardner, 20ga USH, 12ga VR NWTF, 12ga Tracker II shorty WITHOUT scope, 12ga USH, 10 ga  Pardner Smoothbore slug gun & 24ga Profino Custom rifled slug gun.
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