What A FIND!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Wyo. Coyote Hunter]

  Thurs. I stopped into see one of my shooting pals...he is building a new shop, and has a cur dog that I love to play with while we visit...any way we were chewing the fat, and play with the puppy, when he said, "Hey, You want some H4831"""" I stammered ya, I would...then he told me the tale...one of the kids I taught in school is now the owner of a small ranch west of town...while cleaning the place up, they came on the large barrel shaped cardboard container...the young guy didn't want it so they gave it to my pal...It was a 50 pound container of H4831, that had never had the seal broken!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!talk about luck....he have me a big coffe can full of the powder it looks just like the stuff in a can, I just bought some time ago....I ask if they knew what the old rancher shot for rifles, but he is gone, and his sister is gone so there is no family left to tell the story...sad...

[Richard P]

Thats's a good find.  About 40 yrs ago the stuff sold in bulk for roughly .50 per pound.  It is slow enough that you could just fill a 30-06 case and shoot any bullet you could seat.  I'd be hesitant to do that now with some of the Barnes style solid copper bullets.  There is lots of data around for it.  You may need help shooting it up.  rp

[necchi]

Sweet! I'd have ALOT of fun with 50#'s. Heck, I'd even go buy another gun just to make the best use of it!!

http://www.reloadbench.com/gloss/hh4831.html

[charles p]

Do you have to keep that much powder in a metal cabinet or special building?  Do the ATF boys care how much powder someone keeps at home?  Wait until the Democrats hear about this.  Got to be a terrorist training facility.

[Sweetwater]

The story behind that powder would be worth digging up - most likely. Agreed, what a find!! Someone must know someone the old Rancher chummed with or worked for him at some point in life. Probably another piece of history lost, and that is sad...

[Land_Owner]

Do you have to keep that much powder in a metal cabinet or special building?  Do the ATF boys care how much powder someone keeps at home?

The BATFE probably does not have restrictions, but the National Fire Protection Association (NFPA) does and they are closely tied to the local and State Building Department. 

Here is the excerpt from NFPA Chapter 14 Small Arms Ammunition and Primers, Smokeless Propellants, and Black Powder Propellants:

14.3.7 Quantities

14.4.7.1 Smokeless propellants intended for personal use in quantities not exceeding 9.1 kg (20 lbs), shall permitted to be stored in original containers in residences.


14.4 Black Powder

14.4.3 Black Powder intended for personal use in quantities not exceeding 9.1 kg (20 lbs) shall be permitted to be stored in residences where kept in the original containers and stored in a wooden box or cabinet having walls of at least 25.4 mm (1 in.) nominal thickness.

Rest assured, that should you experience a house fire, the Fire Marshall discovers your more than permitted quantity of propellants, damaged or not, they will alert your insurer and there is going to be a problem.

If someone helps me in the posting of a PDF of the full 2006 NFPA Chapter 14, I will make it available to all.

[necchi]

Bahh,,What's a "Residence"? Is a pole barn a residence, a dwelling or an out building? How bout a line shack?

 Besides that's Wyoming, I lived in Douglas an round about for awhile, some of those ranchers, specially the old ones, are kinda private folk. They either liked ya or they just plain didn't, alot is left un-said and left alone.
 And a meer 15 miles from town, sureviving a winter (months) without the amenities and conveniance of the city, isn't a novlety to be praticed or be somewhat ready for, it's still quite a bit, a part of living there.
 With alot of those ranches, your "in range" long before ya reach the house.

[Wyo. Coyote Hunter]

  Sweetwater, you are quite right I think this is a piece of interesting history lost...I would bet he shot a .270...when I first came to this country many of the old timers used that caliber...folks still use it, but now there are many more choices...look at the gun books from the 50's the .30-30, 300 sav. 270 and 06. were the major choices...not much else...now these are good calibers, but there were also some real gunnuts around then too.  But this guy's sister owned this ranch until a couple years ago...she was quite old I saw her many times in her old chev. 4 wheel drive....I would guess about a 1958...she drove 15 miles out to the old ranch every day she could make it...I kind of worried about her, because she  had noone to look for her if she failed to come to town at night.....I would guess she was well ove 80, so the chances of anyone around knowing the story is slim....too bad..I sure would like to know what guns he had, and the stories behind the powder.....

[Sweetwater]

When I was in Saratoga, visiting the chosen home town and homestead of my great-uncle, there was a Mrs. Eaton who ran a store who knew a bunch about him. Forgot the name of the store, could be EATON"S for all I know. I think it was a dry-goods place, not sure any more. Come South into town, take a left at the center of town and it was on the right before the grocery store. A BIG 'I think" there

History is so fragile and can get totally lost if no one takes the time, shows the interest, to preserve it. My work as a Surveyor has given me a completely different view of history than what I got in school. Probably because I had a couple bosses who were more interested in 'preserving the records' than creating new records under their name. I learned to appreciate that and took it as my own work goal. Takes a bit of time and effort, but quite often the survey monument that no one has seen for xxyears is buried under a bush, or a fencepost, or even under two layers of concrete sidewalk (as the road level was raised over the years) that monument was a Rancho corner in southern California just north of Santee and very important to the project I was working on. My young chainman thought I was nuts going through the first layer of concrete, but when the 2nd layer was busted through and that Rebar and cap shown up pretty with the correct markings - he was one happy camper! and a believer in perserverance....

[Dand]

Land Owner thanks for the heads up. Folks take him serious. The fire insurance folks will look for ANY excuse to reduce their payments. My friends didn't have a powder storage issue but they had a long hard fight to get their house rebuilt after a fire started in the electrical panel. NO clear cause to the fire, possibly frost infiltrated into the panel and shorted things out. Total loss of the house.

Disregard the powder storage, and it will be easy to figure out and very easy for the insurance company to dump you.

Now. I gotta figger out what to do with some extra powder.

One thing LO, I thought the limit used to be 25 pounds. Am I wrong or has it changed?

My apologies if this seems a hijak

And yesss what a deal on 4831 - my 06 and 300 win could be happily fed for a very long time.

[Wyo. Coyote Hunter]

  Sweetwater, that was Eaton's Western Wear...the bldg. is still there, but empty..she retired, and her husband passed...she may have too..I seldom go down town, and am away quite a bit...so that could have happened...I dont have the 50 pounds of 4831, my pal has it in a shop...far more powder than I have years left to shoot...

[Terbltim]

Hey Wyo. Coyote Hunter,
That was a heck of a find and good on you!
I have a similar story, not quite as good but ...
I got a 25-lb keg of IMR-PB powder by being acquainted with my barber well enough for him to know I was a hand-loader of several calibers.
The guy in the chair asked if the barber would be interested in a can of gunpowder. (Its well known that he's a varmint [groundhog] hunter and loads his own.)
The barber's eyes met mine and he said, "probably not but that fellow there might," as he gestured to me. We both then asked in unison, "what kind of gun powder?"
The customer said he didn't know, he'd found this keg sitting in the trunk of an old car he was junking. Been sitting in there for unknown years. (At least it had been dry.)
He said he'd bring it by, "later."
Well he left, I got my haircut and I left.
A couple weeks later I called the barber to see about shooting some 'hogs, (an interest we shared,) and he told me that guy had brought back a "big keg" of powder.
He didn't know the type but had it in the closet for me.
Turns out its a keg of IMR-PB, lot number 6XX !! (Really old stuff I think.)
It had been opened but the cap was on tight and most of it was still there.
I made up a few loads of several different cast bullet loads, exact matches for the information I could find, (there isn't much for this powder,) and it gave performance very close to what the sources stated.
That was about 6 years ago. I now have more IMR-PB powder data than all info sources I could find put together, all developed here at home, (with a chronograph.)
I've grown to like it a lot and will probably be shooting it until I'm ready to quit.
Now if I could just stumble on to whatever the military surplus equivalent of Accurate #7 and obtain a bunch for cheap. Or maybe IMR-4895.
That big barrel of IMR-4831 is a seriously great find. Hard to beat that one.