Author Topic: Help with Loading the 30-30 for a Handi rifle.  (Read 1086 times)

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Offline HAMMERHEAD

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Help with Loading the 30-30 for a Handi rifle.
« on: May 10, 2010, 02:12:11 PM »
I'm going to start loading for my 30-30 barrel for my Handi. I'm interested in two basic loads to start. Light lead loads at 1000-1300 fps using Trail Boss (115 LRN) and mid range jacketed loads at 1800-2000 fps using either SR 4759 or H4198 and 110-125 jacketed bullets.
I've done a search here on loading the 30-30 but still had a couple questions.
Loads will be for my ejector barreled Handi only.
Should I full length size with standard dies or neck size only?
Do I flair the case mouth for the lead bullets?
Any need to crimp?
My strategy right now is to load virgin brass with the jacketed bullets and SR 4759 to get the cases to bump up to the chamber size, then neck size only. I'm hoping this will help when I go to load the low pressure lead/Trail Boss loads.
This is my first go-around with rifle reloading, so any and all advice will be appreciated.

Offline PowPow

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Re: Help with Loading the 30-30 for a Handi rifle.
« Reply #1 on: May 10, 2010, 02:52:43 PM »
Neck sizing should be good enough with new brass.
I say that in general; I don't think I have ever seen new 30-30 brass; I thought it came off the ground.
If they start to stick, full size and check the trim length.
If one sticks at the range, the antenna off a Jeep Liberty serves as a great 30 caliber rod.

I chamfer/de-burr the opening for every single round, otherwise it shaves off a little lead or copper, or worse, bends the brass.

No crimp needed on a Handi.

BTW - I got some promising results yesterday in the 16.5-17 gr range of SR-4759 on 115 LRNs in my Handi.
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Offline manatee1947

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Re: Help with Loading the 30-30 for a Handi rifle.
« Reply #2 on: May 10, 2010, 03:38:30 PM »
I load for a contender and that is similar. If you have very square base bullets you might want to chamfer them pretty heavy, or if that still shaves lead then bell faintly. I Do not crimp at all. I have not had much experience with light weight bullets so far.
remember the starfish

Offline HAMMERHEAD

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Re: Help with Loading the 30-30 for a Handi rifle.
« Reply #3 on: May 10, 2010, 03:42:38 PM »
Great stuff PowPow.
I have 20 spent cases from an old box of Federal 150's I shot today, but the range was bare of any others.
16.5 of SR 4759 with a 115 lead bullet must be well over 2,000 fps, isn't it? I thought they would lead up too much at that velocity.
Hunter's Supply 115 LRN are relatively inexpensive, maybe I'll just go with those.

Offline PowPow

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Re: Help with Loading the 30-30 for a Handi rifle.
« Reply #4 on: May 10, 2010, 03:58:01 PM »
I shot a copper jacket as last shot.
That is supposed to clean it out.
I will clock them next time and let you know.
These are Magnus 115 LRN, ~ $30 for 500; its probably the same mold as yours.
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Offline HAMMERHEAD

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Re: Help with Loading the 30-30 for a Handi rifle.
« Reply #5 on: May 11, 2010, 12:42:55 PM »
Now I screwed everything up. Went into the local toy store looking for dies and powder and found a minty Winchester 94 30-30 for $499. No signs of ever being fired, no bolt wear, perfectly clean, pre-USRAC, pre safety, drilled and tapped for peep sights (big plus for me) very nice walnut. I'm guessing it's from the 1970's. Unfortunately, no box, but I'm a shooter, not a collector. Only a trace of rust on the butt plate screws. I put down a deposit.
The old 'just had to have it' syndrome strikes again.

Offline Dand

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Re: Help with Loading the 30-30 for a Handi rifle.
« Reply #6 on: May 11, 2010, 11:58:56 PM »
I really like using a Lyman M die to open case necks for cast bullets. They really make it go smoother and its easy to set the bullet into the case very uniformly. I've heard the Lee universal expanding die works well too but never tried it.

I'd try with and without crimping to see which works best in your rifle. Sometimes a moderate crimp helps.

I have used some of the Hunter 30 cal 115 bullets in my M94 Win and they work fine but lead if sent too fast. I don't recall what powder or load I used.

I don't neck size but partially fully resize, by unscrewing my FL die a few turns off the shell holder so that most of the neck is sized. Works for me and the cases seem to last longer. I use the Imperial graphite on the necks inside and out to reduce stretching too.

You might want to look at the RCBS X-die for 30-30 as it is supposed to greatly reduce case stretching and 30-30 cases are light and tend to stretch. I have no experience with it tho.

I wouldn't count on shooting a copper jacket to clear out the lead. I think I've read where the serious cast bullet shooters don't think that always works. A good swabbing with Shooter's Choice, Butches, or similar potent solvent will take out light and moderate leading.

Since you are getting that M 94 - check out the Lee Factory Crimp die. I really like it for my lever cartridges. But you can do fine with the crimp feature built into most all standard 30-30 seater dies.

Since you are getting the M 94, case length will be important to get uniform crimps so some calipers and a case trimmer will eventually be needed. The Lee system is cheapest and I have used it but much prefer my Lyman Universal trimmer.

Have no handi, but sure enjoy shooting light loads in my M94, especially now that my boys are getting big enough to join me. Have only plinked tho - no serious accuracy efforts.

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liberal Justice Hugo Black said, and I quote: "There are 'absolutes' in our Bill of Rights, and they were put there on purpose by men who knew what words meant and meant their prohibitions to be 'absolutes.'" End quote. From a recent article by Wayne LaPierre NRA

Offline jlchucker

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Re: Help with Loading the 30-30 for a Handi rifle.
« Reply #7 on: May 12, 2010, 03:35:24 AM »
I pretty much agree with Dand on most of what he said.  I' ve used Lyman M dies for years, on most of my cast bullet rifle work.  I've also got the Lee universal expanding die--in fact a couple of them.  These have an internal plug adjustment for short and long cartridges, so over time I've acquired two.  You don't need much of a flare of case mouths, but like any reloading procedure, deburring and sometimes trimming needs doing. So's inside-neck lubing, but go easy with this.  I need to try an RCBS x-die in 30-30.  Dand's comment has me interested.  I shoot a lot of cast bullets through my 30-30's (Winnie and Marlin--don't have a handi). I shoot jacketed through some of these guns as well, but find that doing this has zero cleaning properties.  Use some Kroil, a bore brush, and some patches instead. 

I use the Lee Factory Crimp dies for nearly all of my rifle reloading.  If you use the crimp feature in a seating die, be aware that you're not only crimping, but pushing the bullet further into the case at the same time. 115 grain lead bullets are fine plinker and small game bullets. There's plenty of published data for them.  Reasonable loads with a properly fitted lead bullet usually won't cause leading problems. Lastly, don't overlook cast bullets for hunting applications, and don't think that just because the velocity isn't of a whizzy-bang nature, that cast bullets aren't game killers. There's a lot of penetration with those lead bullets loping along at 1500 fps or so, and has been for over a century and a half.

Offline Dand

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Re: Help with Loading the 30-30 for a Handi rifle.
« Reply #8 on: May 12, 2010, 03:58:31 PM »
I looked back in my notes for those cast Hunter 115  gr bullets.  I used IMR 4227- 14 grains and noted I was getting bit of leading and recommended going to 13 or 13.5g. No chrono work. I believe I got this from a good published load manual but can't find which one right now - possibly Pet Loads.

edit: yes found where Ken Waters in his 30-30 update lists 14 gr IMR 4227 for 115 cast bullet as very accurate in his lever gun.
NRA Life

liberal Justice Hugo Black said, and I quote: "There are 'absolutes' in our Bill of Rights, and they were put there on purpose by men who knew what words meant and meant their prohibitions to be 'absolutes.'" End quote. From a recent article by Wayne LaPierre NRA

Offline PowPow

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Re: Help with Loading the 30-30 for a Handi rifle.
« Reply #9 on: May 15, 2010, 12:08:15 PM »
BTW - I got some promising results yesterday in the 16.5-17 gr range of SR-4759 on 115 LRNs in my Handi.

never mind - could not reproduce results with 16.5-17gr. no where close. going back to 12-13 gr.
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Offline HAMMERHEAD

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Re: Help with Loading the 30-30 for a Handi rifle.
« Reply #10 on: May 15, 2010, 08:44:14 PM »
Thanks for all the help folks.
I found a great thread over at the Marlin forum on light 30-30 loads if anyone is interested.
http://www.marlinowners.com/forums/index.php/topic,41593.0.html